Gear / Technical Help => Post-Processing, Computer / Streaming / Internet Devices & Related Activity => Topic started by: phatdats on February 13, 2003, 02:33:43 PM

Title: minime and laptop help!!!!!!!!!!!!
Post by: phatdats on February 13, 2003, 02:33:43 PM
first off, i have a compaq 1712us (933 celeron, 512mb ram) that i
have been using for my main computer for over a year.... in the last
5-6 months, i have started taping 16/48 with an esi u24 (which i LOVE
and highly recommend!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)   last month i finally got a mini
me, and much to my suprise, got it to work 24/96 (via usb) first try,
and have recorded about 15 shows at 24/96 now glitch free!  i don't
know what chip set i have (i know that that has been the culprit of
many problems for others....) but it works!

here is my question... i am looking to get a ultra-small laptop just
for taping, and i am looking at the following:
fujitsu lifebook p series
sony cm1v, etc....

i have been looking on ebay, and i would like to spend around $900...
does anyone have any experience/feedback on using any of these doing
24/94 with a mini me?  any other really small suggestions?  i will
only use this laptop for taping, and then dump the shows to a
firewire drive for editing on my other computer.... i really like the
sony c series, but i have only 1 goal in mind (24/96 via usb) and
don't want to get a laptop that will not work for whatever reason
(usb chipsets, etc....)

thanks for the space!
Title: Re:minime and laptop help!!!!!!!!!!!!
Post by: hippies on February 13, 2003, 05:00:42 PM
please explain how you are accomplishing 24/96 over the MME/ USB connection?  MME USB  only supports 24/48 as far as anyone knows.  

what software are you running?  i am guessing you are not getting true 24/96.  i am guessing your software may be writing a 96k file but based on a 24/48 input.  please let us know exactly how and what you are running, so we can sort out this lil mystery.  ;)
Title: Re:minime and laptop help!!!!!!!!!!!!
Post by: phatdats on February 13, 2003, 11:16:50 PM
ok, i will try not to make this too long.... first my setup:
--compaq 1712us (933 celeron, 512mb ram, 20g HD)
--mini me serial # 020611 (bought about a  month ago from a large
"guitar" center
--apogee's latest usb drivers (ver 2.0.8)
--wavelab 4.0
--soundforge 5.0
--soundforge 6.0

when i bought the minime, i was under the impression (i don't know
how) that it is possible to do 24/96 over usb with the minime if
everything is exactly right, and the stars are aligned with the
moon... (and if that's the case, then you should be buying lottery
tix as well....) i thought that apogee backed off that claim when
they realized that it was a crapshoot, and they couldn't guarantee
and support it...  

when i read the manual, it stated that it is not supported, and could
be implemented in the future... i called gary, and he said the
minime was not set up (internally) to do 24/96 via usb.... i was
kinda bummed, but decided to try it anyways...  my first test was in
soundforge, and i got it to work right away, recording almost 45
minutes of flawless audio.  i then tried it in wavelab, but kept
getting n error saying that "my audio hardware doesnot support 96k"
i called gary back, and he was supprised that i got it to work in
soundforge.  he admitted that he has never tried the minime in SF,
and would have to check it out because "internally the minime is not
setup to do 96k over usb..."

i next called the new "computer specialist" at a western USA tapers
and he admitted that he was under the same impression that i was,
about the mini me beaing able to do it, but since there was so many
problems, apogee backed off the claim..  he told me that he has also
done it successfully (only a few times out of many tries) and it
boils down (in his case, and opinion) to getting the usb drivers to
work with your usb chipset.  he told me to try and re-install the
drivers manually, one at a time, and see if that helps.... well, i
did that, and now it won't work under soundforge anymore, but - it
works like a charm in wavelab 4.0.

i have recorded about 20-25 hours total ( a bunch of 1 1/2 hour sets
of local bands), and haven't had any problems yet..... i have yet to
dither any of them down to cd, but i have opened them up in both
wavelab and soundforge 6.0, and done some editing with no know flaws
what so ever!!
when i open them up in either program, they are listed as 24/96 sound
files, so i don't think that they are actually 24/48 to answer your
question....  if that was the case, then wouldn't i get the same
"chipmunk effect" as when you open a 48k file as a 44.1 (kinda sped


Title: Re:minime and laptop help!!!!!!!!!!!!
Post by: hippies on February 14, 2003, 02:02:43 AM
hey Steve,

thanks for the added info.  very interesting.  this seems to open up previously unknown issues with the MME USB then.  you are on uncharted ground here, bro!  ;)

this issue seems to warrant further investigation, as you say Gary at Apogee has confirmed our suspicions that the MME is not internally set up to run at 24/96.

one final question.  what are the sizes of your files?  are they running close to what one would expect for 24/96?  i.e. appx. 2G per hour for 2 track.?  

very interseting stuff.  now you've got me curious.  my MME is loaned out to a friend right now, but we'll have to try it with the numerous 'puter setups (both mac and PC) we have available here very soon and see what we come up with.

thanks for the info.


Title: Re:minime and laptop help!!!!!!!!!!!!
Post by: Marc Nutter on February 16, 2003, 01:36:19 PM
Hi Everybody,

I have done some testing and posted commentary and screenshots at;action=display;num=1045419934;start=0 regarding this issue.

In short, it does not look like we are getting a reliable "real" 24/96 USB feed when using the Mini Me via USB.  

The software will evidently interpolate the 2448 feed that it sees and make it look like 24/96.  I'm sure some more impirical testing is in order.  

Happy Recording,

Title: Re:minime and laptop help!!!!!!!!!!!!
Post by: jpschust on February 16, 2003, 01:39:25 PM
Marc, 24/96 is supported via COAX in steady form, right?
Title: Re:minime and laptop help!!!!!!!!!!!!
Post by: hippies on February 16, 2003, 01:58:12 PM
right, Jonny.  ;)

thanks for the info, Marc.  this is what i had suspected, but had not had a chance to try any tests.  when i get the mini back home here, i'll see what i come up with as well.  

Title: Re:minime and laptop help!!!!!!!!!!!!
Post by: Marc Nutter on February 17, 2003, 06:55:08 PM
Hi All,

(Johnny: "Steady Form" ?? I'm not familiar with the term.  As hippies answered, I'm thinking S/PDIF output at 24/96.  Yes!)

This 2496 over USB issue proved to be a time consuming endeavor but from what I can determine, the Mini Me is NOT delivering a 2496 feed over USB.

At the suggestions of one of our forum members, I recorded a test signal with the Mini Me at 2496 and sent it via USB to one computer and via S/PDIF>Nuendo Audiolink 96 (a.k.a. Multiset) to another computer.

A screen shot illustrating the differences can be seen at;action=display;num=1045419934;start=0

The images show that the USB feed is NOT the same as the S/PDIF>AL96 feed.

Additionally, Wavelab reports differences in Global Analysis and even in pitch (ie. 397.54Hz with Multiset and 400.22Hz with USB).

With these differences, I would NOT feel comfortable using the Mini Me at 24/96 over USB.

Further tests and insights are certainly encouraged.  Please report back with findings or comments about these tests.

Happy Recording Everybody!!!