Taperssection.com
Gear / Technical Help => Playback Forum => Topic started by: utahtaper on February 28, 2004, 01:20:07 PM
-
I'm thinking about sinking the dough into a home system to ditch the Sony system I have been listening on. Anyone have any suggestions?
What is about the cheapest nice system you can build? I'm not made of money here.
I keep reading a lot about Maggies......
-
ballpark budget? $500? $5k? do you have any components you can use - DAT, CD/DVD, etc? are we just talking pre/power amp and speakers?
-
Well I have a standalone cd, dat, and dvd. I have never built a home system from scratch and my home Sony system is about 14 yrs old and I've been wanting to upgrade for some time. Ballpark budget is a little hard to come up with. Best bang for the buck is what I would go by. So maybe just the pre,amp, and speakers. Do I need a new reciever?
Like I ran across a pair of Maggies MGIIIa's that a guy wants $750 for. Is this a good buy?
What component should I spend the most on?
Also on speakers, should I be looking for 3 way or 2 way?
-
yes, MG3a's for $750 is a good deal if they are in good condition - they retailed for >$2k.
so assuming you go with the MG3a's, you need a pre/power amp. tube or solid state? separates or integrated?
you'd need a "receiver" only if you plan on using it for home theater/surround.
-
yes, MG3a's for $750 is a good deal if they are in good condition - they retailed for >$2k.
so assuming you go with the MG3a's, you need a pre/power amp. tube or solid state? separates or integrated?
you'd need a "receiver" only if you plan on using it for home theater/surround.
They are in good condition. I could probably use my reciever I have now then. I'm not sure what to use for a pre/power amp. Especially using a tube or solid state. Is it better to not use integrated?
-
For the best bang for your buck, integrated is almost always the way to go.. You should give yourself a budget..
-
I went to the local stereo shop and they had a deal on a Sunfire setup. But then I looked on ebay and it was the same deal. What do you think of this combo?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3080367855&category=39783
-
Sunfire, well Carver, makes some great stuff...that's a pretty good deal...the question is whether this is music only, or also an a/v system...then get a budget...if music only, check out some tube configs, they make a world of difference...paradigm speakers just came out with a studio series that sounds great....i have the reference system now with b&k's and it's very nice...just look around...
-
I could probably use my reciever I have now then. I'm not sure what to use for a pre/power amp.
Make sure your receiver has pre-outs if you're going to run from it into a preamp.
-
Sunfire, well Carver, makes some great stuff...that's a pretty good deal...the question is whether this is music only, or also an a/v system...then get a budget...if music only, check out some tube configs, they make a world of difference...paradigm speakers just came out with a studio series that sounds great....i have the reference system now with b&k's and it's very nice...just look around...
Hmmm.... Well I guess it would be nice to have a/v capability. What route would I go from there? Would the Maggies not be right for a/v?
-
I could probably use my reciever I have now then. I'm not sure what to use for a pre/power amp. Especially using a tube or solid state. Is it better to not use integrated?
when you say "receiver", are you talking about a radio tuner or one of those 1 box preamp/poweramp/tuner/(surround processor)? I'm assuming its a 1 box pre/power/tuner. You may be able to use this with the Maggies, but be sure the speaker impedence is ok for the receiver. Some receivers don't like anything but 6 or 8 ohm loads. I'm not sure if the Maggies are 4 ohm, but if they are, you could damage the receiver if its not up to the task.
The advantage of an integrated is that you typically get a bigger bang for the $ and can also save on interconnects. Separates give you the flexibility to upgrade each component separately and "tune" your system a bit more by selecting components having the characteristics you want (ie. a tube pre for warmth and imaging mated to a solid state amp for low end control and detail or power if you speakers need it).
I like tubes, especially for preamps. I also like to drive my speakers to high spl's, so being unable to afford high power tube amps I've stuck with solid state for power amps. This was especially true when I had the Maggies since they were pretty low sensitivity and required a decent amount of power. My current speakers are a bit more senstive and I am considering going all tube, but haven't quite decided how to go yet. I'm currently using a Panasonic SA-XR45 that is a home theater surround receiver with 6x100w digital amps. It stirred up a bunch of positive buzz on AudioCircle and AudioAsylum, so I thought I'd give it a shot while I was "between systems" - it was only $400, so I didn't think it was that much of a risk. It actually sounds very good using the digital inputs - very detailed and excellent low end, but the highs are a bit too much on some recordings. The XR45 is discontinued, but they are planning to replace it with the XR70 for the same price. If you want something for a/v surround, I would seriously consider it - sounds way better than it should for only $400 and has plenty of power to drive any speakers.
regarding the Sunfire pre/power combo. I'd try to listen to it first. I've never been too excited about the Sunfire components. Typically overpowered and lack a refined sound. I've never heard the Symponic Reference line, so I hesitate to generalize and tell you its not any good. For that much $, I'd be willing to bet you can do better.
-
So maybe if I went the Pana sa-xr45 route, I could add components to that as well later if I thought that I needed more umph?.....
Hey Craig do you have any idea what this one is compared to the one you spoke about?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3081348210&category=39814
-
So maybe if I went the Pana sa-xr45 route, I could add components to that as well later if I thought that I needed more umph?.....
Hey Craig do you have any idea what this one is compared to the one you spoke about?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3081348210&category=39814
I doubt you'd need any more umph - the XR45 or 70 have 100wpc digital amps. Should be plenty of power. The XR45/70 really aren't set up to allow the addition of a more powerful amp, plus the thing that makes these receivers sound good is their ability to take a digital input straight to the amp stage.
No, that receiver has MOSFET amps and would likely not be any better than the Sony you have now.
-
If I went the receiver route. Anyone know if there is one out there that can output 4 ohms? And if the unit does, would you have the option of upgrading later with an outboard pre and amp?
-
For something completely different, try an all tube integrated. I have a Cayin TA30 on order from www.2baudio.com, $600 stock, $850 with some tweaks (Auricaps, external bias, adjustable feedback). 30 wpc push-pull, can take EL34, KT88, KT66, EL37, 6L6 and 5881 output tubes (very cool) and convert to a 4 wpc single-ended class A amp by simply removing 2 output tubes and adjusting the bias (also very cool). I'll post a review in a few weeks.
http://www.goodsound.com/equipment.shtml (http://www.goodsound.com/equipment.shtml)
-
yes, MG3a's for $750 is a good deal if they are in good condition - they retailed for >$2k.
FYI, I've come across a few used IIIa's for around $700, so $750 is a bit on the high side.
Also, you should go over to the Planar Speaker Asylum and search "IIIA" - you'll get posts on power requirements, tweaks, stands, cross-overs, etc.
http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/MUG/bbs.html (http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/MUG/bbs.html)
Good luck with your decisions and have fun with the new system!
-
For something completely different, try an all tube integrated. I have a Cayin TA30 on order from www.2baudio.com, $600 stock, $850 with some tweaks (Auricaps, external bias, adjustable feedback). 30 wpc push-pull, can take EL34, KT88, KT66, EL37, 6L6 and 5881 output tubes (very cool) and convert to a 4 wpc single-ended class A amp by simply removing 2 output tubes and adjusting the bias (also very cool). I'll post a review in a few weeks.
http://www.goodsound.com/equipment.shtml (http://www.goodsound.com/equipment.shtml)
thanks Craig, that looks pretty cool.
-
I came across a "used" Panasonic XR(?) receiver (not sure if its the 25 or 45, the 45 is the better of the two):
http://www.audiocircle.com/circles/viewtopic.php?p=73766#73766
-
Subject says it's sold :-\
Thx for the heads up though Craig!
-
I know its a bit more $$, but this integrated is supposed to be excellent. I almost bought one, but decided to go tubes...
http://www.audioadvisor.com/store/productdetail.asp?sku=DMPERR200IP
http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/perreaux_200ip.htm
http://www.audioreview.com/PRD_116070_1583crx.aspx
-
I bought my home system through Audiogon
http://www.audiogon.com/index.html
Its an auction site that specializes in high end equipment. I found some deals on lower-end stuff from guys that were upgrading.
Good luck!
-
check this integrated out
http://www.charismaaudio.com/A40.html
Class A operation and built in DAC
i bet it sounds VERY nice. Just plug your digital source directly into it via s/pdif and add speakers. you're off to the races in style!
-
check this integrated out
http://www.charismaaudio.com/A40.html
Class A operation and built in DAC
i bet it sounds VERY nice. Just plug your digital source directly into it via s/pdif and add speakers. you're off to the races in style!
That is pretty cool. Another one in that style is the Music Hall Mambo (1 box integrated + DAC). Suprised there aren't more out there.
-
The DAC's in most name-brand DVD players are very good these days, 192kHz with decent analog filter components, so I wouldn't consider a built-in DAC to be a valuable feature in an amp.
I recommend against jumping too far ahead of yourself when upgrading a stereo. Your Sony doesn't provide a balanced basis for comparison, so your first step is to get a well-balanced rig so you can determine which specialized gear is right for you. For example Maggie's are nice, but are they nice *for you*? They aren't for me. Get your standard of reference and *upgrade only when you've actually heard the benefit to the upgrade*. Here's how I'd steer ya:
DVD player: any current Hitachi - has good DAC and the most overlooked feature that directly impacts sound quality, the ability to *disable* auto-power-off, keeps analog circuitry warm
Amp: Cambridge, Arcam, Sugden, Rega, and Creek all make superb simple affordable neutral integrated amps, find one used the has about 1/2 the power rating that you're used to (a 60W Rega smokes a 120W Sony), don't consider tubes until you befriend a local wirehead
Speakers: No idea what brands are in your area or what style suits your music, but first thing you should do is knock on the cabinets - ideally you should hear more knuckle than cabinet (knock the 1st joints of your middle fingers together to hear what I mean). Any sound other than knuckle is added to everything played through those speakers. Then look for woofers with paper cones and rubber suspensions, and cloth dome tweeters. First stop - Mission, then KEF, then Monitor Audio (their bronze series breaks a lot of my rules, but they really engineered their way around the faults).
Accessories: Most importantly, get decent speaker stands! I'm talking heavy metal tubing which can be filled with sand, and thick metal plates. On top of getting the speakers into the right positions, remember the non-knuckle sound of the cabinet? A lot of it conducts through the metal and dissipates in the sand. A $120 pair of speaker stands will make a $300 speaker sound $300 better every time. Everyone and their dog has a theory about cables, just start with whatever cheap interconnects look nice, and OFC 12ga stranded speaker cables, if/when you upgrade, you'll find a use for them elsewhere. Subwoofer? Maybe, start with a passive, run separate cables to the sub, don't pass-through.
Total cost should be around $750, from there you can determine on your own what exotic gear is right for you, your music, and your room, or if you'd rather spend the money elsewhere. If you jump into high-end gear too fast it will not be the right gear for you, and you'll never know how or why. You'll just sit there thinking your $5k stereo kicks ass.