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Author Topic: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread  (Read 90308 times)

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Offline prof_peabody

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Re: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread
« Reply #165 on: October 19, 2005, 12:17:07 PM »
Hey. So i'm in the finishing touches of a new rig, and i'd really appreciate some help so I can make sure I get the right parts. I have the microtracker, and need to figure out if the phantom power adapters are required for phantom power on the microtracker with cmc-8 mics.

I actually don't even know if SP-CMC-8 mics will work with phantom power with this thing, but I sure as heck hope so. I'm going to be running these mics direclty into the Microtracker.

This is the rig I have picked out so far...
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/category.cgi?item=SP-CMC-8 Cardoid SP-CMC-8 Mics
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-PHANTOM Phantom Power/Plug-In Power Mod

This is where i'm confused, do I need the power modules for Phantom Power for the Microtracker, or could I just use the wire below and skip the phantom power adapters all together?
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-MICROTRACK-XLRF-TRS In other words, do I need this wire, 'DUAL XLRF TO 1/4 TRS ADAPTER FOR USE WITH XLR BALANCED MICS AND MICROTRACK"
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/ISI-SPA-PM4 Or would I have to have them mod my phantom power adapters to be like this?  "ISI-SPA-PM4 STEREO PHANTOM ADAPTER FOR BALANCED ELECTRET CONDENSER MICROPHONES FOR PMD660, PMD670, PMD671, M-Audio MicroTrack 24/96"

Hopefully someone that has used the phantom power on this thing can help me out. I've searched for a long time, and I haven't seen any definite answers. I'd much rather not use the phantom adapters as they're just about as big as the microtracker itself, and i'm trying to keep it as small as possible, but if it's needed, then I guess i'll have to deal. Any help is appreciated, thanks a lot!

You can't run the mics directly into the microtracker; the two phantom power adapters (Samson PM-4) are required.  Call SP and talk to them, they will walk you through the steps you need to make your rig. 

Offline jpschust

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Re: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread
« Reply #166 on: October 19, 2005, 12:24:51 PM »
charged the new mt over night and never got a "charge complete" reading on the lcd.  disconnected the power supply so as to not kill the battery.  this normal?

my plan is to run d8 > mt so im not risking losing a recording my first couple of times off the bat.
Quote from: Todd Snider
They say 3 percent of the people use 5 to 6 percent of their brain
97 percent use 3 percent and the rest goes down the drain
I'll never know which one I am but I'll bet you my last dime
99 percent think with 3 percent 100 percent of the time

Offline udovdh

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Re: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread
« Reply #167 on: October 19, 2005, 12:38:54 PM »
charged the new mt over night and never got a "charge complete" reading on the lcd.  disconnected the power supply so as to not kill the battery.  this normal?
Just unplug and replug until you charge 6 hours?

Offline jpschust

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Re: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread
« Reply #168 on: October 19, 2005, 01:48:38 PM »
charged the new mt over night and never got a "charge complete" reading on the lcd.  disconnected the power supply so as to not kill the battery.  this normal?
Just unplug and replug until you charge 6 hours?

i need to recharge this f'n thing for more time?  it got like 10 hrs of charge time last night
Quote from: Todd Snider
They say 3 percent of the people use 5 to 6 percent of their brain
97 percent use 3 percent and the rest goes down the drain
I'll never know which one I am but I'll bet you my last dime
99 percent think with 3 percent 100 percent of the time

Offline anhisr

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Re: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread
« Reply #169 on: October 19, 2005, 01:59:54 PM »
Hey,
   I did it several times at first.  If then I don't have to bring an extra battery with me for normal 3 1/2 hour shows great. 
Audio: Neumann KM 100> 20, 30, 40, 43 or 50 > V3 > MT II (love that M/S)
Still Camera Body: Canon D5 Mark II
Canon Lenses:  16-35mm f2.8L II USM; 28-135mm f3.5-5.6 IS USM; 70-200mm f2.8L IS USM
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Offline L Ron Hoover

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Re: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread
« Reply #170 on: October 19, 2005, 04:51:51 PM »
charged the new mt over night and never got a "charge complete" reading on the lcd.  disconnected the power supply so as to not kill the battery.  this normal?

my plan is to run d8 > mt so im not risking losing a recording my first couple of times off the bat.


Yeah, I think I'm gonna drag the d-7 along just for some reliable levels. Hopefully they get that issue fixed soon.

Offline fuzn

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Re: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread
« Reply #171 on: October 19, 2005, 08:13:13 PM »
Hey. So i'm in the finishing touches of a new rig, and i'd really appreciate some help so I can make sure I get the right parts. I have the microtracker, and need to figure out if the phantom power adapters are required for phantom power on the microtracker with cmc-8 mics.

I actually don't even know if SP-CMC-8 mics will work with phantom power with this thing, but I sure as heck hope so. I'm going to be running these mics direclty into the Microtracker.

This is the rig I have picked out so far...
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/category.cgi?item=SP-CMC-8 Cardoid SP-CMC-8 Mics
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-PHANTOM Phantom Power/Plug-In Power Mod

This is where i'm confused, do I need the power modules for Phantom Power for the Microtracker, or could I just use the wire below and skip the phantom power adapters all together?
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-MICROTRACK-XLRF-TRS In other words, do I need this wire, 'DUAL XLRF TO 1/4 TRS ADAPTER FOR USE WITH XLR BALANCED MICS AND MICROTRACK"
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/ISI-SPA-PM4 Or would I have to have them mod my phantom power adapters to be like this?  "ISI-SPA-PM4 STEREO PHANTOM ADAPTER FOR BALANCED ELECTRET CONDENSER MICROPHONES FOR PMD660, PMD670, PMD671, M-Audio MicroTrack 24/96"

Hopefully someone that has used the phantom power on this thing can help me out. I've searched for a long time, and I haven't seen any definite answers. I'd much rather not use the phantom adapters as they're just about as big as the microtracker itself, and i'm trying to keep it as small as possible, but if it's needed, then I guess i'll have to deal. Any help is appreciated, thanks a lot!

You can't run the mics directly into the microtracker; the two phantom power adapters (Samson PM-4) are required.  Call SP and talk to them, they will walk you through the steps you need to make your rig. 
Thanks for the help man, you're awesome. +T!
DPA 4061s > SP-MicroTrack Dongle > M-Audio MicroTrack

Offline fuzn

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Re: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread
« Reply #172 on: October 19, 2005, 08:20:23 PM »
This is (probably) a extremely newbie question but if you use one of those usb battery boxes to extend the MT's battery life, would you still need phantom power (like fuzn linked to) for the mics if you turn phantom power to ON on the MT? Again sorry if this is a stupid question... :-[

MoFo2
All the USB battery box does is help the MT itself with it's battery power. It pretty much takes it as if you were just plugging it into the wall. So in other words, it doesn't affect anything else including phantom power. But if you're going to use phantom power, that USB battery box is VERY useful as it drains the battery much faster in comparison to not using phantom power.
DPA 4061s > SP-MicroTrack Dongle > M-Audio MicroTrack

Offline Evil Taper

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Re: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread
« Reply #173 on: October 20, 2005, 04:44:07 AM »
So when the s/pdif 24/96 issue is resolved to full working order and reliability who here is going to leave their recording laptop at home and rely on this unit alone?
Really not very evil at all now...

Offline JasonSobel

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Re: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread
« Reply #174 on: October 20, 2005, 08:08:25 AM »
Last night, I ran the MicroTrack at 24bit (via the S/PDIF input) for Yonder Mountain String Band.  it was the first real show where I was running 24 bit out of the V3.  I've done several tests of the MicroTrack at home, but hadn't yet had the chance to run it at a show.  here are some things that I observed:

battery power -
as per usual for me, I think I went way overboard with battery power.  I am using ToddR's "juice box" to supply a regulated 5V to the microtrack.  I'm using a 9V, 5AH, NiMH battery.  this battery should power it for a LONG time, which is good.  I certainly didn't have any problems at Yonder Mountain last night

channels -
during the first set, the channels recorded normally.  During the second set, the channels recorded in reverse.  This is easily fixed in post (just swap channels), but still an issue.  I did not power down between sets.

"remaining time"
as we all know, when you start recording a file, there is also a count down with the remaining time.  in all my tests, this counts down from the 2gig file size limit, not the total time left on the card (I'm using a 4GB CF card - Sandisk Ultra II).  So, as usual, I start the first set recording and the count done is from ~2 hours.  Then, between the 2nd set and encore, I noticed something funny.  The second set had recorded for about an hour and half, but the count time thing still said that I had another hour and a half to go (approx.)  So for the second set, it had started counting down from 3 hours instead of two.  At this point, I'm thinking one of two things "shit, for some reason, it's only recording at 16 bit (48kHz) instead of 24 bit.  16/48 would give me about 3 hours per 2 gigs.  shit."   or  "this is strange, the first set was an hour long.  so maybe it is recording at 24 bit, but is counting down from the total time remaining on the card (4 hours total at 24/48 minus 1 hour for the first set).  well, I got home, and verified that it did indeed record both sets at 24/48.  I verified this by looking at the file size, and playing both sets in WaveLab and using the bit meter.

So this begs the question, why did it tell me that I have three hours of record time at 24/48?  what would have happened when it reached the 2 gigs?  probably just stopped, like it did before.  but I thought that this was strange behavior.

Obviously, I haven't listened to the whole recording through yet, but I'm assuming that there were no pops/skips/blips or any errors like that.  If I do find some problem with the recording, I'll let you all know.

and, finally, a few other minor observations:

as this was the first time for me running 24 bit out of the V3 S/PDIF, it was also the first time that I needed to break out the XLR > mini cable to run my D8 analog out of the V3 as a back-up.  I learned that the standard right-angle neutrik XLR connectors are too wide for the V3, and they can't fit next to my right-angle mic input XLR's.  they pushed against each too much for me to be comfortable.  Because of this, I ran my D8 backup from the AES1 output of the V3, and recorded a truncated signal.  As a back-up, this wasn't a big deal to me.  as it turns out, it looks like I won't have to transfer that DAT anyway.  However, this method of DAT back-up wouldn't have worked if I was running at 24 bit, 96kHz.  on the other hand, there are still two things precluding me from recording 24/96 on the MicroTrack anyway (the S/PDIF input on the MicroTrack doesn't yet record at 24/96, and 8GB CF cards are still too expensive anyway).  Once these items are taken care of, I'll probably trust the MicroTrack enough to not run a back-up anyway.  I'm almost at the point of leaving my D8 at home already.

The levels are still not accurate after a while.  I consider this a minor issue, because it doesn't impact the recording at all, and I have nice level meters on the V3.  speaking of levels, I had this show DIALED in.  man, it was sweet, peaks consistently around -1dB or so, with only one clip (during applause between songs).

and as far as the sound, well, the Avalon is one of the better sounding venues in Boston, and there weren't too many screaming, drunken idiots (although there were a few).  actually, at one point, some passer-by spilled a beer right by our gear.  luckily, only a bit splattered onto my D8, which was easily wiped off.  a bit more got on the laptop that was running an on-the-fly matrix.  I think because of this, they missed  bit of the recording, and will have to splice it in from another source.  and speaking of multiple sources, it was nice that there were 5 tapers there.  Last year when the played Boston, I was pretty much the only taper.  it was good to see more folks come out to tape.

All in all, it's nice to finally record at 24 bit, the MicroTrack is doing just what I want it to, and I almost trust it enough to leave the D8 at home.  just a few minor issues to be resolved with firmware:

(1) 24 bit, 96 kHz recording via the S/PDIF input

(2) auto-save at 2 gig limit and seamlessly start a new file

(3) fix the intermittent channel swapping

(4) make it more stable (although it seems pretty stable to me now, much more so than the original firmware)  In all my tests and last night, it has only frozen on me once with the latest firmware installed.  not perfect yet, but much better.

cmoorevt

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Re: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread
« Reply #175 on: October 20, 2005, 09:17:42 AM »


"remaining time"
as we all know, when you start recording a file, there is also a count down with the remaining time.  in all my tests, this counts down from the 2gig file size limit, not the total time left on the card (I'm using a 4GB CF card - Sandisk Ultra II).  So, as usual, I start the first set recording and the count done is from ~2 hours.  Then, between the 2nd set and encore, I noticed something funny.  The second set had recorded for about an hour and half, but the count time thing still said that I had another hour and a half to go (approx.)  So for the second set, it had started counting down from 3 hours instead of two.  At this point, I'm thinking one of two things "shit, for some reason, it's only recording at 16 bit (48kHz) instead of 24 bit.  16/48 would give me about 3 hours per 2 gigs.  shit."   or  "this is strange, the first set was an hour long.  so maybe it is recording at 24 bit, but is counting down from the total time remaining on the card (4 hours total at 24/48 minus 1 hour for the first set).  well, I got home, and verified that it did indeed record both sets at 24/48.  I verified this by looking at the file size, and playing both sets in WaveLab and using the bit meter.


Interesting that you mention this. I used mine last week.  When I got to the venue and powered everything up to check for levels I had +/- 3hours and 13min of recording time on my blank card (2gb card, recording at 16/48).  In order to check levels I recorded a brief 10 second file or so.  Everything was running properly so I powered down.  When I powered back up and started the recording for real, the display was telling me I only had 1hr 25 mins of record time left on the card.  I immediately thought I must have somehow changed the settings to 24/48 or something else.   I let the recording go for almost an hour until I started a new file because I was worried I would run out of time.  After starting the new file (without powering down) the display showed the correct time left on the card-about 2 hours and 13mins(my initial time minus the hour or so I had recorded) and I got the rest of the set with no problems. 

When I got home I verified everything had recorded in 16/48 and the file size were what they should have been for 16/48.  Weird issue and I'm not sure what would have happened had I let the first recording trickle down to 0:00 time remaining on the card.

Offline detroit lightning

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Re: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread
« Reply #176 on: October 20, 2005, 09:27:28 AM »
thanks for the info Jason - let us know how it sounds, or any other points worth noting on the sound

if you run XLR -> miniplug -> dat out of the V3, would this not be a truncated signal?  still not sure i understand how that works

Offline Cooker

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Re: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread
« Reply #177 on: October 20, 2005, 09:40:57 AM »
analog signals aren't truncated, dithered or anything else. they're just analog.

Offline JasonSobel

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Re: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread
« Reply #178 on: October 20, 2005, 09:54:22 AM »
thanks for the info Jason - let us know how it sounds, or any other points worth noting on the sound

sure thing.  of course, though, running digital in, the MicroTrack imparts no sound of it's own.  only records the V3 at 24 bit :)

Quote
if you run XLR -> miniplug -> dat out of the V3, would this not be a truncated signal?  still not sure i understand how that works

analog signals aren't truncated, dithered or anything else. they're just analog.

exactly, if I ran analog out of the V3 > DAT, than it's just an analog signal going to the deck, and the deck does the A/D conversion.  it's just completely bypassing the V3's A/D converter, and it's just like running line-in on any deck.


"remaining time"
as we all know, when you start recording a file, there is also a count down with the remaining time.  in all my tests, this counts down from the 2gig file size limit, not the total time left on the card (I'm using a 4GB CF card - Sandisk Ultra II).  So, as usual, I start the first set recording and the count done is from ~2 hours.  Then, between the 2nd set and encore, I noticed something funny.  The second set had recorded for about an hour and half, but the count time thing still said that I had another hour and a half to go (approx.)  So for the second set, it had started counting down from 3 hours instead of two.  At this point, I'm thinking one of two things "shit, for some reason, it's only recording at 16 bit (48kHz) instead of 24 bit.  16/48 would give me about 3 hours per 2 gigs.  shit."   or  "this is strange, the first set was an hour long.  so maybe it is recording at 24 bit, but is counting down from the total time remaining on the card (4 hours total at 24/48 minus 1 hour for the first set).  well, I got home, and verified that it did indeed record both sets at 24/48.  I verified this by looking at the file size, and playing both sets in WaveLab and using the bit meter.


Interesting that you mention this. I used mine last week.  When I got to the venue and powered everything up to check for levels I had +/- 3hours and 13min of recording time on my blank card (2gb card, recording at 16/48).  In order to check levels I recorded a brief 10 second file or so.  Everything was running properly so I powered down.  When I powered back up and started the recording for real, the display was telling me I only had 1hr 25 mins of record time left on the card.  I immediately thought I must have somehow changed the settings to 24/48 or something else.   I let the recording go for almost an hour until I started a new file because I was worried I would run out of time.  After starting the new file (without powering down) the display showed the correct time left on the card-about 2 hours and 13mins(my initial time minus the hour or so I had recorded) and I got the rest of the set with no problems. 

When I got home I verified everything had recorded in 16/48 and the file size were what they should have been for 16/48.  Weird issue and I'm not sure what would have happened had I let the first recording trickle down to 0:00 time remaining on the card.

that is pretty interesting.  it seems like your "problem" was sort of the opposite of mine, saying you had less time than you should have.  this is probably a small bug.  M-Audio should be made aware of this, and hopefully they'll address the issue in a firmware update.  I wonder if any of us can replicate something like this in a home test.  Then we'll really be able to see how the MicroTrack acts when time runs out...

Offline detroit lightning

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Re: [PT 2] M-Audio MicroTrack 2496 - *actual* real-life experiences thread
« Reply #179 on: October 20, 2005, 12:16:50 PM »
analog signals aren't truncated, dithered or anything else. they're just analog.

that makes sense.  thanks for the info! +t

 

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