Topic: JB3 versus DAT recorders

[Evil Taper]

Wow, the recorder you're using is the last thing that you should be concerned about right now.  Spend your money on some decent mics before you even think of getting a new recorder.  Sony ECM mics are probably the absolute worts mics you can use for recording concerts so get rid of those (that cuz it's most likely a single point stereo mic anyway) and at least invest in a pair of Sound Professionals mics.  Look at either the sp-cmc-8, sp-cmc-4 or sp-cmc-2 mics at soundprofessionals.com and buy something in that quality range.  Those mics sound FAR better than that thing you have now so upgrade.  You'll probably also have to buy a battery box with the mics so keep that in mind.  The mics are far more important than the recorder, anyone here will tell you that.

[Genghis Cougar Mellen Khan]

Wow, the recorder you're using is the last thing that you should be concerned about right now.  Spend your money on some decent mics before you even think of getting a new recorder.  Sony ECM mics are probably the absolute worts mics you can use for recording concerts so get rid of those (that cuz it's most likely a single point stereo mic anyway) and at least invest in a pair of Sound Professionals mics.  Look at either the sp-cmc-8, sp-cmc-4 or sp-cmc-2 mics at soundprofessionals.com and buy something in that quality range.  Those mics sound FAR better than that thing you have now so upgrade.  You'll probably also have to buy a battery box with the mics so keep that in mind.  The mics are far more important than the recorder, anyone here will tell you that.

I'd stay away from Sound Professional's mics and go with one of Core-Sounds mics.

The mics are far more important than the recorder, anyone here will tell you that.

Yep, and Sound-Pro isn't the way to go, unless you're a fan of bass distortion.

[Ray76]

Wow, the recorder you're using is the last thing that you should be concerned about right now.  Spend your money on some decent mics before you even think of getting a new recorder.  Sony ECM mics are probably the absolute worts mics you can use for recording concerts so get rid of those (that cuz it's most likely a single point stereo mic anyway) and at least invest in a pair of Sound Professionals mics.  Look at either the sp-cmc-8, sp-cmc-4 or sp-cmc-2 mics at soundprofessionals.com and buy something in that quality range.  Those mics sound FAR better than that thing you have now so upgrade.  You'll probably also have to buy a battery box with the mics so keep that in mind.  The mics are far more important than the recorder, anyone here will tell you that.

And if you want good customer service, core sounds isnt the way to go.

Len is not the nicest guy .

Ray
I'd stay away from Sound Professional's mics and go with one of Core-Sounds mics.

The mics are far more important than the recorder, anyone here will tell you that.

Yep, and Sound-Pro isn't the way to go, unless you're a fan of bass distortion.

[Genghis Cougar Mellen Khan]

And if you want good customer service, core sounds isnt the way to go.

Len is not the nicest guy .

Ray

True, but he's not going to be plugged into my deck...

Sure Sound-Pro is nice, but all that's good for is consoling you after their mics farted out every kick drum note.

I'd check E-Bay, I've seen Core-Sound mics on there in the US and Euro go for around $100-$120 US.

[moby78]

And if you want good customer service, core sounds isnt the way to go.

Len is not the nicest guy .

Ray

True, but he's not going to be plugged into my deck...

Sure Sound-Pro is nice, but all that's good for is consoling you after their mics farted out every kick drum note.

I'd check E-Bay, I've seen Core-Sound mics on there in the US and Euro go for around $100-$120 US.

Could you give me a link to that e-bay site and some good advice how to buy there? I haven´t bought anything at e-bay yet. Thanks.

[Ray76]

And if you want good customer service, core sounds isnt the way to go.

Len is not the nicest guy .

Ray

True, but he's not going to be plugged into my deck...

Sure Sound-Pro is nice, but all that's good for is consoling you after their mics farted out every kick drum note.

I'd check E-Bay, I've seen Core-Sound mics on there in the US and Euro go for around $100-$120 US.

Could you give me a link to that e-bay site and some good advice how to buy there? I haven´t bought anything at e-bay yet. Thanks.

www.ebay.com

LMAO

[Ray76]

And if you want good customer service, core sounds isnt the way to go.

Len is not the nicest guy .

Ray

True, but he's not going to be plugged into my deck...

Sure Sound-Pro is nice, but all that's good for is consoling you after their mics farted out every kick drum note.

I'd check E-Bay, I've seen Core-Sound mics on there in the US and Euro go for around $100-$120 US.

true. THe best way to run those mics is with phantom ive heard.
Course, im movin beyond them , ima be blingin soon.

Ray

[Brian Skalinder]

FWIW, plenty of people are very happy with their Sound Pro mics.  As Ray indicated, best bet is to run them with phantom power to avoid overloading problems.  Or if you can afford it, get the actual Audio Technica AT853Rx instead of the SP flavor. 

[Genghis Cougar Mellen Khan]

FWIW, plenty of people are very happy with their Sound Pro mics.  As Ray indicated, best bet is to run them with phantom power to avoid overloading problems.  Or if you can afford it, get the actual Audio Technica AT853Rx instead of the SP flavor. 

It'll help your chances, but you can't avoid the problem. 

For the amount that are very happy with them, I'd venture to guess the amount that were not very happy with them and have moved on to different mics is much larger.

I could give you plenty of examples of Sound Pro mics that were run WITH their SP phantom power and still have distortion issues, even WITH Sound Pro's phantom power supply.  I'm not talking stack tapes, extreme SPL situations, just your average club setting.  If you want to take from the back, only tape non-amplified shows, they're great in that reguard.

CSB and CSC mics are cheaper than Sound Pro mics, just as compact, I haven't heard of anyone with a distortion problem as of yet...

So what is your opinion of Core-Sound mics?
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=33624.msg428899#msg428899

[Ray76]

FWIW, plenty of people are very happy with their Sound Pro mics.  As Ray indicated, best bet is to run them with phantom power to avoid overloading problems.  Or if you can afford it, get the actual Audio Technica AT853Rx instead of the SP flavor. 

It'll help your chances, but you can't avoid the problem. 

For the amount that are very happy with them, I'd venture to guess the amount that were not very happy with them and have moved on to different mics is much larger.

I could give you plenty of examples of Sound Pro mics that were run WITH their SP phantom power and still have distortion issues, even WITH Sound Pro's phantom power supply.  I'm not talking stack tapes, extreme SPL situations, just your average club setting.  If you want to take from the back, only tape non-amplified shows, they're great in that reguard.

CSB and CSC mics are cheaper than Sound Pro mics, just as compact, I haven't heard of anyone with a distortion problem as of yet...

So what is your opinion of Core-Sound mics?
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=33624.msg428899#msg428899

I havent heard about those folks, but hell I learn somehting new ever day.
Ray

[Ray76]

http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=44551.new#new

[Brian Skalinder]

So what is your opinion of Core-Sound mics?

I don't care at all for their low cost binaurals, regular binaurals, or stealthy cardioids - I don't think I've heard a single recording using those mics that I enjoy.  I would never buy them, use them, or suggest that anyone else should.  On the other hand, I've encountered mixed results with the Sound Pro version of the AT mics - some I've enjoyed, others I have not.  And I've heard plenty of Audio Technica AT853Rx recordings I enjoy.

Core-Sound's High End Binaurals sound great.  But I would never buy them, use them, or suggest that anyone else should when one may purchase a pair of DPA 406x + MPS battery box / MPA preamp and achieve the same or better results, all the while working with an organization that provides quality customer service before, during, and after the completion of the sales cycle.

[Ray76]

So what is your opinion of Core-Sound mics?

I don't care at all for their low cost binaurals, regular binaurals, or stealthy cardioids - I don't think I've heard a single recording using those mics that I enjoy.  I would never buy them, use them, or suggest that anyone else should.  On the other hand, I've encountered mixed results with the Sound Pro version of the AT mics - some I've enjoyed, others I have not.  And I've heard plenty of Audio Technica AT853Rx recordings I enjoy.

Core-Sound's High End Binaurals sound great.  But I would never buy them, use them, or suggest that anyone else should when one may purchase a pair of DPA 406x + MPS battery box / MPA preamp and achieve the same or better results, all the while working with an organization that provides quality customer service before, during, and after the completion of the sales cycle.

Ding ding!
My limitations with verbalizing the English language(though I was a lit minor, figure that one out)
keep me from writing the very thoughts you relayed above. +T Brian.
Quit stealing my thoughts.
 

[Genghis Cougar Mellen Khan]

So what is your opinion of Core-Sound mics?

I don't care at all for their low cost binaurals, regular binaurals, or stealthy cardioids - I don't think I've heard a single recording using those mics that I enjoy.  I would never buy them, use them, or suggest that anyone else should.  On the other hand, I've encountered mixed results with the Sound Pro version of the AT mics - some I've enjoyed, others I have not.  And I've heard plenty of Audio Technica AT853Rx recordings I enjoy.

Core-Sound's High End Binaurals sound great.  But I would never buy them, use them, or suggest that anyone else should when one may purchase a pair of DPA 406x + MPS battery box / MPA preamp and achieve the same or better results, all the while working with an organization that provides quality customer service before, during, and after the completion of the sales cycle.

Agreed on the low-cost binaurals...

I don't think I've heard a single recording using those mics that I enjoy.

I'm guessing your listening experience has been limited with reguards to these mics?  I'm not saying that if you hear enough recordings, you'd enjoy them, just possibly that you heard a few bad ones so you're not inclined to give other recordings a listen.

I know you'd agree with this statement:

Location, config, venue, sound system, mix, etc. all play a role.

Have you heard any recordings made with the above mics by someone that wasn't green to taping at the time? 

This is my reasoning for suggesting Core-Sound mics over Sound  Pro mics.

I agree that Sound Pro mics can, from time to time make a very listenable recording, but for a newbie taper I think the reliability factor (dIsToRtIoN) is something someone new to taping can live without. 

"I'm running SP-XXX mics > SP bat box > MD and I have distortion, what's the problem?"   

While the CSB/CSC mics may not have as pleasing results as some SP mics (completely subjective), if the taper uses the correct input and sets the levels correctly, they should leave with a distortion free recording.  The smaller amount of variables the new taper has to worry about, the better IMO.  If given the right location/config/venue/sound, I think it's a shame that you could possibly come away with a distorted recording due to equipment failure.  IMO if the taper knows how to operate their equipment, has a good location, config, venue, sound system, mix, they can pull off a very listenable recording with Core-Sound mics every time.

All opinions here, I'm just looking to help those that are taking all these factors into consideration. 

I'd be more than happy to supply you with CS samples that I think might have an impact on your opinion.

 

EDIT: spelling + content

[Evil Taper]

Yeah what they said...I suggested sound pros because alot of people use them and pull decent recordings with them.  I don't know anyone besides Karl who still uses Cores for anything though so I wasn't about to suggest those.  I've personally been less than pleased with my sound pro's mics, 3 of 5 shows i taped with them have distortion on the bass at some level or another...but the ones without distortion sound better than any sony ecm will ever be capable of.  The mini ATs seem to just pick up too much bass, they require eq work to make them sound right for sure.  So I guess go with core's, or buy some DPA 4061s and you'll be VERY happy you did.  Some of my favorite stealth recordings were made with sound pros gear so I'm partial...