Topic: Tascam DR-70D 4-channel audio recorder (Part 5)

[noahbickart]

I botched a show this summer, due to the same error message. I checked, and a card I had been using seemed to no longer work with the Tascam. I bought one from the approved list, and everything has been smooth sailing since then.

Lots of people are really upset at Tascam for not being more forthright with the information that the vast majority of SD cards will not work, or at least are less likely to work, especially running four channels, especially at 24/96.

On the other hand, I think there has been no reports of a problem with an approved card.

[aaronji]

This may have nothing at all to do with the speed rating printed on the card, as those ratings are derived from burst read / write tests and audio recorders send a more or less continuous data stream. 

Speed classes are based on minimum sustained write/read speed, not burst (which, as I understand it, is the more complex task anyway).

On the other hand, I think there has been no reports of a problem with an approved card.

I think there have been a few, at this point...

[voltronic]

This may have nothing at all to do with the speed rating printed on the card, as those ratings are derived from burst read / write tests and audio recorders send a more or less continuous data stream. 

Speed classes are based on minimum sustained write/read speed, not burst (which, as I understand it, is the more complex task anyway).

I'll have to go check to see where I read that.

On the other hand, I think there has been no reports of a problem with an approved card.

I think there have been a few, at this point...

To my knowledge, mine has been the only one that I've seen on this forum and it hasn't been repeated in the weeks since it happened.  Who else has had a problem with an approved card?

[aaronji]

To my knowledge, mine has been the only one that I've seen on this forum and it hasn't been repeated in the weeks since it happened.  Who else has had a problem with an approved card?

I thought there had been others, but I don't really feel like reading back through the whole thread to find them.  Maybe Life in Rewind or johnmuge?  In any event, that is immaterial.  The fact remains that at least one user has had an issue with an approved card...

[stevetoney]

My deck has experienced 'write timeout' error with UNapproved cards.

[johnmuge]

I had a problem using approved card SDSDUP-016G with V1.11 firmware.  I have a brand new, never used DR-70D just shipped to me from Tascam.  Anybody want to give it a try ? $150 and it's yours.  I think I'm going to stick with my DR-680 for multi channel.

[jbosco]

I had a problem using approved card SDSDUP-016G with V1.11 firmware.  I have a brand new, never used DR-70D just shipped to me from Tascam.  Anybody want to give it a try ? $150 and it's yours.  I think I'm going to stick with my DR-680 for multi channel.

What was the problem with your first one and why did Tascam send you a new one, I think I missed all that.

[johnmuge]

I unfortunately had another problem this weekend on test #2.  At the 1 hour 47 minute point, the recording levels went up by them self and peak with the red lights flashing and it recorded a weird noise.  From that point on every few minutes, there are pops and skips and also a few other 10 second intervals of level peaking.  I spoke to Brian @ Tascam Tech Support who was very nice and knowledgeable about the deck.  He went over all my settings and the card and external power etc. and confirmed something weird was going on and asked me the send the unit back to Tascam for either repair or exchange.  I'm hoping for the best as I like the deck and I want it to work with confidence.  I will report back with the outcome.  I was using a approved card SanDisk #SDSDUP-016G,  V1.11 firmware, and a Generic Power Bank 20,000 mah ultra thin battery.

  The first problem I had was at  George Porter.  At the 30 minute point, it skipped and digi noise till the end of the set and it did the same thing for both the first and second set.  I ended up with about 1 hour of good music and 1 hour of crap.  That was on a unapproved Sandisk card that came with the deck from B&H.  It ran fine with a class 4 Sandisk for 2 shows after that and then I got a approved card and did home testing and it failed the second test.

[voltronic]

I unfortunately had another problem this weekend on test #2.  At the 1 hour 47 minute point, the recording levels went up by them self and peak with the red lights flashing and it recorded a weird noise.  From that point on every few minutes, there are pops and skips and also a few other 10 second intervals of level peaking.  I spoke to Brian @ Tascam Tech Support who was very nice and knowledgeable about the deck.  He went over all my settings and the card and external power etc. and confirmed something weird was going on and asked me the send the unit back to Tascam for either repair or exchange.  I'm hoping for the best as I like the deck and I want it to work with confidence.  I will report back with the outcome.  I was using a approved card SanDisk #SDSDUP-016G,  V1.11 firmware, and a Generic Power Bank 20,000 mah ultra thin battery.

  The first problem I had was at  George Porter.  At the 30 minute point, it skipped and digi noise till the end of the set and it did the same thing for both the first and second set.  I ended up with about 1 hour of good music and 1 hour of crap.  That was on a unapproved Sandisk card that came with the deck from B&H.  It ran fine with a class 4 Sandisk for 2 shows after that and then I got a approved card and did home testing and it failed the second test.

That SanDisk model is the exact one I have that gave me problems.  I did notify Tascam right away saying that card should be retested, but have not gotten a reply.  FWIW, performance with that card has been perfect since using the SD Association Formatter I linked earlier.

[Mike D (VT)]

Thanks for all the info. My card isn't even on the list.  I guess I will upgrade the deck's firmware and try to re-format the card. It also seems like dialing down the bit rate from 24/96 to 24/48 might help.
I'll definitely get one of the "approved" cards too.

[voltronic]

Thanks for all the info. My card isn't even on the list.  I guess I will upgrade the deck's firmware and try to re-format the card. It also seems like dialing down the bit rate from 24/96 to 24/48 might help.
I'll definitely get one of the "approved" cards too.

I wouldn't be satisfied with just recording at 24/48, even if that's what you normally do.  You should be able to record at 4-channel 24/96 if you want to, but that might mean you need a different card. 

In the meantime, definitely try the SD Association Formatter to see if that solves your problem in the short term, even before doing a firmware update.  It's the best tool for the job, and if that fixes things you may have had a corrupted filesystem - approved card or not.  Like I said, you can't do a "full" format on any firmware before 1.11, but you can format it properly with this in your PC.

[aaronji]

Thanks for all the info. My card isn't even on the list.  I guess I will upgrade the deck's firmware and try to re-format the card. It also seems like dialing down the bit rate from 24/96 to 24/48 might help.
I'll definitely get one of the "approved" cards too.

The thing to keep in mind is that these issues are obviously due to some defect in the recorder and not the cards themselves.  The problems have been sporadic and I don't think anyone has identified a set of conditions that will lead to them.  The proposed solutions (use cards on the approved list and reformat in the computer) are either suspect (users have had issues with approved cards) or anecdotal (computer format).  Even if the computer format method has been tested enough to qualify as solid evidence, it is, at best, an inconvenient work around (a field recorder that can't be formatted in the field?).  Until such time as Tascam fixes the underlying defect, you will be essentially shooting the dice with this recorder.  Some people seem to have had very good luck, but others have not.  You really just have to decide if the level of risk is worth it to you...   

[EDIT: YMMV, IMHO, etc.]

[phil_er_up]

Thanks for all the info. My card isn't even on the list.  I guess I will upgrade the deck's firmware and try to re-format the card. It also seems like dialing down the bit rate from 24/96 to 24/48 might help.
I'll definitely get one of the "approved" cards too.

The thing to keep in mind is that these issues are obviously due to some defect in the recorder and not the cards themselves.  The problems have been sporadic and I don't think anyone has identified a set of conditions that will lead to them.  The proposed solutions (use cards on the approved list and reformat in the computer) are either suspect (users have had issues with approved cards) or anecdotal (computer format).  Even if the computer format method has been tested enough to qualify as solid evidence, it is, at best, an inconvenient work around (a field recorder that can't be formatted in the field?).  Until such time as Tascam fixes the underlying defect, you will be essentially shooting the dice with this recorder.  Some people seem to have had very good luck, but others have not.  You really just have to decide if the level of risk is worth it to you...   

[EDIT: YMMV, IMHO, etc.]

^^^^^^^^Believe what aaronji said is true!

This feels like a short in your car/truck electronics. Sometimes it works and others times it doesn't. IMO there are so many uncontrollable variables in our hobby that adding the recorder to that list is not even in the ballpark. Add insult to injury they came out with a new unit (DR-701D) without addressing this problem with the SD cards!

[chk]

has anyone had issues or given a serious test since upgrading to firmware 1.12? 
i am going to try and run a test this wknd and will report back...thanks

[voltronic]

Thanks for all the info. My card isn't even on the list.  I guess I will upgrade the deck's firmware and try to re-format the card. It also seems like dialing down the bit rate from 24/96 to 24/48 might help.
I'll definitely get one of the "approved" cards too.

The thing to keep in mind is that these issues are obviously due to some defect in the recorder and not the cards themselves.  The problems have been sporadic and I don't think anyone has identified a set of conditions that will lead to them.  The proposed solutions (use cards on the approved list and reformat in the computer) are either suspect (users have had issues with approved cards) or anecdotal (computer format).  Even if the computer format method has been tested enough to qualify as solid evidence, it is, at best, an inconvenient work around (a field recorder that can't be formatted in the field?).  Until such time as Tascam fixes the underlying defect, you will be essentially shooting the dice with this recorder.  Some people seem to have had very good luck, but others have not.  You really just have to decide if the level of risk is worth it to you...   

[EDIT: YMMV, IMHO, etc.]

^^^^^^^^Believe what aaronji said is true!

This feels like a short in your car/truck electronics. Sometimes it works and others times it doesn't. IMO there are so many uncontrollable variables in our hobby that adding the recorder to that list is not even in the ballpark. Add insult to injury they came out with a new unit (DR-701D) without addressing this problem with the SD cards!

This thread may turn out to be related - I'm testing my two SD cards using the tool Rainer linked now: http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=175071.0

My thinking on the new DR-701D from a marketing standpoint is that they need to continue to actively support / update the 70D, since those users are going to be their target market for the 701D.  In other words, why would people who felt left out in the cold by Tascam having unresolved issues with the 70D buy the new unit?  Then again, I don't really know anything about marketing so I might be completely off base.