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Gear / Technical Help => Playback Forum => Topic started by: wboswell on December 18, 2004, 11:09:19 PM
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Been shopping hard for something for mainly musical playback. I thought I had a Sunfire Super Junior lined up last week, but the seller stopped responding. Now, it appears that I'll go with a pinnacle baby boomer. I'm going to pull the trigger on monday unless someone here can sway me another way... I've read great things about the Hsu and SVS subs, but from what I can gather, those do better for HT, but get sloppy with music playback. I like the B&W 675 but I can't find one used.
and if you're looking to sell, let me know...
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jason b was trying to sell his jbl i know that- what are you looking to spend?
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Todd R uses that Pinnacle and loves it... fast and musical.
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I am personally not a fan of the Pinnacle subs William. I recently did an install using 2 Pinnacles and they were less than pleasing. This was my third less-than-great experience with them.
<edit> Let me add that this is, of course, just my personal opionion and experience.
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FWIW, I enjoy my Pinnacle Baby Boomer with my MMGs. Though I don't have much (i.e. any) other experience with subs. Jason - what did you find less than pleasing about the Baby Boomers (or other models)? What other subs would you recommend at the same price point? (quickly found on Google for $400-500).
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What other subs would you recommend at the same price point? (quickly found on Google for $400-500).
I've been meaning to make my own thread about exactly this except at a price point at around $400. Anyone have any comments on the Adire Rava w/Shiva driver (http://www.adireaudio.com/TextPages/RavaPageFrameText.htm)?
(http://www.adireaudio.com/images/Rava-4.jpg)
Or maybe the Dayton Audio Titanic MKIII (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=300-760&ctab=1#Tabs)?
(http://www.partsexpress.com/images/300-760m.jpg)
Going to be paired up with a pair of Axiom M22's (http://www.axiomaudio.com/m22ti.html)
(http://www.axiomaudio.com/img/prodpics/M22CherryPairGrillOff.jpg)
Yet to determine what my amp might be as well.. currently they'll be driven by an H/K AVR-20 but I am looking for an amp that will maybe warm up the axioms some.. no clue there yet.
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I'm a huge fan of the vandersteen sub. I've had a 2qw for a few years and still love it.
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I'm a huge fan of the vandersteen sub. I've had a 2qw for a few years and still love it.
when I was shopping around Vandersteen was the most recommended brand and had glowing reviews. I went with a Paradigm because I got a steal on one new in box but Vandersteen sounds like a great option.
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Todd R uses that Pinnacle and loves it... fast and musical.
QFT
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Todd R uses that Pinnacle and loves it... fast and musical.
QFT
I guess I could have let you say that yourself :P
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Scott recommended I try out a Onix Rocket UFW-10. I found several reviews using a google search which had side by side comparisons to the Hsu and SVS subs I was also considering. Each one told me the things that I wanted to hear, so I figured I'd give it a shot. Its got a 10" woofer in a sealed enclosure powered by a 500w amp. The cube is 14x14x14 and should have a very high WAF.
I was able to get a "b-stock" unit, which in reality was simply an open box unit. If it doesn't work out, I won't have a hard time getting rid of it. Rocket has their own forum and they go very quickly...
It should arrive sometime next week...
(http://www.av123.com/images_dynamic/gallery/subwoofers_1_5.jpg)
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enjoy william!
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Cool, William - have fun and let us know how you like it!
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Yeah, I'd like to hear what you think after you get it set-up.
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So far so good with the sub. Unfortunately, I can't isolate the sub as the only improvement in sound as I also added an NAD T763. The NAD pushes 100watt/channel while my former pushed 80(Denon) watts/channel. The combination of the two turned my room into a whole new beast.
The sub does not shake the foundation.. but that's not really what I was looking for. I wanted to feel Matt Apts kick drum in my chest and the UFW-10 does that very well. For HT, its presence is certainly felt, but its much more of a defined rumble rather than window pane rattle. In a smaller room, I know it would do a better job, but for now, I have no complaints.
I've only had it for a few days so as it breaks in, I'm sure I'll have more to say...
edit...
I forgot to mention that I am dealing with a hum coming from the speakers. I'm planning on taking it down, piece by piece to try to isolate the hum, but I'm guessing that it has something to do with the fact that 1) all of the cables are in such a mess or 2) something being improperly wired. I made all the connections in a hurry on Christmas Eve and haven't had a whole lot of time to play with it since.
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Congrats! That sub is probably the best I've heard for music. I'm holding out for either the UFW-12 or REF Sub as the 10" didn't fill my large room. Right now I'm using SVS 25-31 PC+ tuned to 22Hz. The thing is a beast for HT, but for audio it is a little messy.
SC
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I gets better and better every time I turn it on... I'm a dumbass so it took me a while to figure out that it sounds better with the speakers set to "small" on the NAD and having the ufw-10 do all the LF work. Less strain on the NAD-more power for the mids and uppers. Haven't done any spl tests yet so its still not being as efficient as I should.
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I forgot to mention that I am dealing with a hum coming from the speakers. I'm planning on taking it down, piece by piece to try to isolate the hum, but I'm guessing that it has something to do with the fact that 1) all of the cables are in such a mess or 2) something being improperly wired. I made all the connections in a hurry on Christmas Eve and haven't had a whole lot of time to play with it since.
William,
Put all of your equipment, including the sub, on the same circuit. Also check to make sure that if you have satellite, your dish is properly grounded. So many idiots from dish network come and install a dish, and never bother to ground it.
Congrats on the new equipment!
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So many idiots from dish network come and install a dish, and never bother to ground it.
'thats the damn truth...the directv guy installed my dish 4 years ago and never grounded it...had to ground the damn thing myself when I noticed he had not done it...
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I'm stumped with the hum... I have all components plugged into the same circuit. I unplugged each component, then speakes, one at a time, powered up the unit after each connection was removed, and the hum was there until the last speaker was unplugged. Obviously there was no hum when there were no speaker connections. I don't think its a ground loop issue b/c I didn't have a hum with my Denon unit. I believe its an analog thing and associated with the internal fans on the unit. They are audilble when the unit powers up...
The weakest link is the power stip I have the components plugged into, but that'll have to do for now.
The only analog connections are an s-vid from the NAD to the TV, the component out from the 2900 to the NAD, and the 5.1 connection out of the 2900 to the NAD. All else are digital (DA-30mkII, 2900 for redbook, Charter digital cable box has a digital out).
I don't remember it being nearly as noticeable until I connected the unit to the TV for set up. The first few days I had it, I just plugged it up an went with it. Then I made a video connection from the TV to the NAD so that I could use the onscreen display to set the speaker distance, etc... that's when the hum became more noticeable to me anyway. I may have just not picked up on it until then, and I'm thinking this is the case.
The sound is just great, but the barely audible hum grates on me when watching TV. Any help would be greatly appreciated!
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So far so good with the sub. Unfortunately, I can't isolate the sub as the only improvement in sound as I also added an NAD T763. The NAD pushes 100watt/channel while my former pushed 80(Denon) watts/channel. The combination of the two turned my room into a whole new beast.
The sub does not shake the foundation.. but that's not really what I was looking for. I wanted to feel Matt Apts kick drum in my chest and the UFW-10 does that very well. For HT, its presence is certainly felt, but its much more of a defined rumble rather than window pane rattle. In a smaller room, I know it would do a better job, but for now, I have no complaints.
I've only had it for a few days so as it breaks in, I'm sure I'll have more to say...
edit...
I forgot to mention that I am dealing with a hum coming from the speakers. I'm planning on taking it down, piece by piece to try to isolate the hum, but I'm guessing that it has something to do with the fact that 1) all of the cables are in such a mess or 2) something being improperly wired. I made all the connections in a hurry on Christmas Eve and haven't had a whole lot of time to play with it since.
congrats on the new sub
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I'm stumped with the hum... I have all components plugged into the same circuit. I unplugged each component, then speakes, one at a time, powered up the unit after each connection was removed, and the hum was there until the last speaker was unplugged. Obviously there was no hum when there were no speaker connections. I don't think its a ground loop issue b/c I didn't have a hum with my Denon unit. I believe its an analog thing and associated with the internal fans on the unit. They are audilble when the unit powers up...
The weakest link is the power stip I have the components plugged into, but that'll have to do for now.
The only analog connections are an s-vid from the NAD to the TV, the component out from the 2900 to the NAD, and the 5.1 connection out of the 2900 to the NAD. All else are digital (DA-30mkII, 2900 for redbook, Charter digital cable box has a digital out).
I don't remember it being nearly as noticeable until I connected the unit to the TV for set up. The first few days I had it, I just plugged it up an went with it. Then I made a video connection from the TV to the NAD so that I could use the onscreen display to set the speaker distance, etc... that's when the hum became more noticeable to me anyway. I may have just not picked up on it until then, and I'm thinking this is the case.
The sound is just great, but the barely audible hum grates on me when watching TV. Any help would be greatly appreciated!
If using grounding plugs go out to your local hardware shop and grab a cheater plug. It will accept the 3-prong plug, but has no ground to the outlet. For less than a buck I find its good to at least give it a try if all else has been checked.
SC
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If using grounding plugs go out to your local hardware shop and grab a cheater plug. It will accept the 3-prong plug, but has no ground to the outlet. For less than a buck I find its good to at least give it a try if all else has been checked.
SC
I am already using a cheater plug from the power strip to the outlet...
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damn that's bizarre william. Jason and Scott already said what I had to contribute.... weird.....
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I picked up a few more cheater plugs for the components that didni't already have them, and that hellped alot. Another source of the hum is probably due to the speaker cable (DH Labs) is bundled with the power cables as they exit the armoir that the equipment sits in. Another hole for the stuff to exit will do the trick - I hope!
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Yes, I make sure all power cables are run a good 8" away and never parallel to speaker cables or interconnects if I can help it.
SC
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what software version are you using on the NAD. I had tons of issues with mine and finally got a Arcam after returning 4 different NADs. Go over to ecoustics and read the message board, the hum is VERY typical of the 7x3 line, and it seems like the problem hasn't been solved 100%. Its unfortunately because they sound great, when you don't get the hum (or in my case pops). Good luck trying to fix it.
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To extend this thread a little, is it worth the expense to get a sub that goes lower than 25 Hz? There are a lot of budget subs that get to 25, but not lower. The Hsu VTF-3 and ACI Force are comparably priced units that will go to 20 Hz or lower. Anyone replace a budget sub with a full-range sub and feel it was worth the effort?
FYI, I sometimes listen to industrial, gothic, and new age-type synthesizer music, and I'd hate to miss the full effect of what's recorded. My room is 12 x 19, and I'm running GMA Europas, which barely dip into the 40s on their own. Thanks.
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I have not replaced a budget sub with a better sub, I went for a decent sub to start.
The depth of reproduction is just part of what a better sub can do. The budget subs (based on very limited auditions but a lot of research before I got my sub) usually suffer from loose bass. Most of those are geared toward HT applications where people want to feel the explosion or dinosaur foot steps.
The higher end subs intended for audio will throw really tight bass. Deep is one thing but you want that bass to be tight like the thump from a kick drum. If you are into industrial and gothic, you will appreciate tight bass. It will be much closer representation of what you get in the clubs.
I don't know about the ACI you mentioned, but the hsu has a good reputation. You should also look into Rel and Vandersteen. Also the newer velodynes are pretty nice. I have a vandy and know someone with a velodyne so I can recommend both from firsthand experience. The vandy is not a HT sub, it's intendeed for music so it is really tight. The velodyne I have heard is in an HT system and is tuned for that more than music but it is very tight and responsive.