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Offline tbger

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Newbie question about DAT
« on: July 29, 2020, 05:21:42 AM »
Hi,


As some of you have seen, I've searched (and basically found) a recorder with a digital input, for transferring my DAT tapes (mainly).

When I just got into the actual job, I found out that my TCD-D7 stopped working properly, throwing an 'Error 10' each time I insert a tape.

I'm not in a harsh, but given I have quite a lot of time at home because of the Corona virus quarantine, I'd really like to do this now.

To my question:  I'm almost completely not familiar with DAT recorders, and I'd like to know which DAT decks would decently play my tapes.  All of them were recorded on the Sony D7.


Any help is appreciated, thanks in advance.


Roy

Offline Melanie

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Re: Newbie question about DAT
« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2020, 08:34:00 AM »
I have used a Tascam DA 30 mk 2 successfully, although it now has a tape stuck in it. Due out for repair next week. I just bought a Fostex PA 4 for transfers and it has played most of what I have put in it, my portable deck was a Sony D3, I believe. Tape guides would loosen on these decks unless lock-tite was used on set screws,  some tapes have issues. Someone here may have one for sale, see who chimes in. Bob

Offline old and in the way

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Re: Newbie question about DAT
« Reply #2 on: July 29, 2020, 08:40:06 AM »
I have a couple of Fostex D5's and have found that these decks play almost everything i throw at them . The Sony D7  is a small portable and ok for a small amount of transfers but a
home unit will serve you better for larger amounts .Look on Ebay for used decks or search for a good used home deck that will be what you need.Dat hasn't been a thing for quite a while and most decks are showing problems with age .There are still people who work on them but you'll have to decide if it's worth the cost. good luck .

Offline Ozpeter

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Re: Newbie question about DAT
« Reply #3 on: August 01, 2020, 07:29:45 AM »
In my experience (many years ago) DAT tapes sometimes won't play other than on the machine they were recorded on, if it was misaligned.  Ideally you'd only buy a machine that you'd tested one of your own tapes on.  And use a tape that wasn't so important in case the deck being tested eats it.

Offline tbger

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Re: Newbie question about DAT
« Reply #4 on: August 17, 2020, 12:22:52 PM »
In my experience (many years ago) DAT tapes sometimes won't play other than on the machine they were recorded on, if it was misaligned. Ideally you'd only buy a machine that you'd tested one of your own tapes on.  And use a tape that wasn't so important in case the deck being tested eats it.

Thanks everybody for your help, especially thank you Peter for this smart advice, I'd definitely do so if I find out my D7 can't be fixed at a decent price.  (I've highlighted the above for anyone with the same problem who would read this topic in the future.)

Offline lerond

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Re: Newbie question about DAT
« Reply #5 on: August 17, 2020, 11:42:15 PM »
I have a small collection of DAT decks of various models, with three (Sony D-100, Fostex D-5, and Panasonic SV-3800) hooked up for making transfers. I'd be happy to try making transfers on problematic tapes sent to me with a self-addressed stamped envelope for the return journey.

Maybe someone with a D-7 could make the same offer?
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Offline tbger

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Re: Newbie question about DAT
« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2020, 04:58:44 AM »
Good morning here,


I've finally sent my D7 to someone who knows how to fix these things in my country (Israel).  I've been told that its guides were very loose (among the other, more critical problems, of capacitor leakage and old grease).

In the meantime, I've tried playing my tapes on a Tascam DA-30 (not the MK ii).  Now, my tapes divide into two groups:  the first were recorded by my (loose headed) D7, in SP mode; the second - on my friend's D7, in LP mode (this means a downgrade to 32KHz, right ?).  The DA-30 played the first group of tapes without a problem, but none of the other tapes (my friend's LP mode ones) - it showed nothing on the meters as well.

I didn't think about this difference when I was near the device, so I can't test or change anything now, but could it be that the Tascam doesn't read tapes recorded on LP ?  Or is there a way to change its settings to recognize the inserted tape is an LP one ?  Just so I could check it when I'm near the deck again.

EDIT:  I do see a "Rec. Mode - Standard/Long" on the DA-30 MKii, but I can't figure out whether this option is featured on the original DA-30 as well (I see on datrecorders.co.uk there actually is support for 32KHz, but I don't know if they mean just for recording or for playback too).  I've natively thought that most decks would support LP mode just like my D7 does.


Thanks everyone,
Roy

P.S. sorry for my newbie questions !
« Last Edit: November 24, 2020, 09:40:55 AM by simplemind »

Offline morst

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Re: Newbie question about DAT
« Reply #7 on: November 24, 2020, 06:53:16 PM »
Sony and Panasonic used different formats for their LP modes, which are not compatible with each other. Not sure which one the tascam would use, but probably the Panasonic version.

Offline jefflester

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Re: Newbie question about DAT
« Reply #8 on: November 24, 2020, 08:07:52 PM »
The "Panasonic" 32 kHz is 16-bit, but it is not an LP mode. 16-bit @ 32 kHz, but the machine runs the same speed and a 2 hour tape is still just a 2 hour tape. The "Sony" 32 kHz is an LP mode non-linear 12 bit @ 32 kHz and the machine runs at half speed so you get 4 hours out of a 2 hour tape. The Fostex and Tascam machines that have LP mode are 12-bit/32-kHz like the Sony machines. That Tascam DA-30 should play back 32 kHz LP DATs made on a Sony TCD-D7. If it doesn't it could well be a head misalignment problem like Ozpeter mentioned. I haven't done any in years, but had varied success playing back LP tapes recorded on a Sony DTC-75ES or received in trade. I still have the 75ES stored away in a closet in case I need it for some old LP mode recordings (like an FM broadcast of the 1997 Playboy Jazz Festival) and they don't play on my Fostex D5. Though I have doubts it will ever make it all the way through a 4 hour tape given that the transport was struggling back 10+ years ago when I used it last. Over the years my Fostex D5 has played just about everything (like oaitw said), frequently better than my Panasonic SV-3800.

LP mode in section 19 of the DAT-heads FAQ:
https://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=302.0
« Last Edit: November 24, 2020, 08:10:07 PM by jefflester »
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Offline jerryfreak

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Re: Newbie question about DAT
« Reply #9 on: November 24, 2020, 08:38:10 PM »
the hardest part for me of dealing with 32K recordings (all sony) is finding a recorder that can accept it. none of the standalone solid state recorders i use will lock on 32K. Soundcards can usually do it but the laptop i used to use is long defunct. You may need to go analog out of the DAT
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Offline tbger

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Re: Newbie question about DAT
« Reply #10 on: November 26, 2020, 01:41:53 AM »
A lot of thanks for your help guys.

In the meantime, we've tried out the LP cassettes on a (properly aligned) Fostex D5, which was my only and last option - luckily it played them flawlessly. 

jefflester, are you sure the Tascam DA-30 should play LP tapes ?  I'm asking because I simply can't find a way to adjust it to LP mode, or to 32 KHz (which I do find on pictures of the DA-30 MKii - is this what you mean you've tried ?).  I know the heads of the mentioned DA-30 are aligned, so in my humble opinion this could either be that the LP tapes were recorded on a misaligned D7 (and the Fostex D5 still played them), or that the DA-30 actually does not read LP tapes.  Anyone could pop in here and share your knowledge on this please ?

Offline jefflester

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Re: Newbie question about DAT
« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2020, 08:06:51 PM »
Yeah, looks like it is only the DA-30 MKII that records and plays in LP mode. That datrecorders.co.uk page has a photo of the non MKII but it looks like the specs for MKII so it's a little confusing. I was also thinking of the DA-20 that had LP mode in its non MKII version, the DA-20 being like a Fostex D-5 but with the black front instead of white.
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Offline tbger

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Re: Newbie question about DAT
« Reply #12 on: November 27, 2020, 04:24:56 AM »
Thank you for letting me know, and also for the info about the different LP methods of Panasonic and Sony / Tascam - it might save me a lot of time and / or money.

Roy

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Re: Newbie question about DAT
« Reply #13 on: November 30, 2020, 09:58:03 PM »
the hardest part for me of dealing with 32K recordings (all sony) is finding a recorder that can accept it. none of the standalone solid state recorders i use will lock on 32K. Soundcards can usually do it but the laptop i used to use is long defunct. You may need to go analog out of the DAT


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Offline tbger

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Re: Newbie question about DAT
« Reply #14 on: December 06, 2020, 01:49:37 PM »
the hardest part for me of dealing with 32K recordings (all sony) is finding a recorder that can accept it. none of the standalone solid state recorders i use will lock on 32K. Soundcards can usually do it but the laptop i used to use is long defunct. You may need to go analog out of the DAT

Hey - I didn't notice your reply previously, thanks for pointing this out.  Does it mean if I go straight from the DAT deck into a recorder that doesn't specially record on 32KHz, I'll get some kind of errors on the result ?  Or maybe it won't receive anything at all ?

Anyway, I was thinking about using my Violectric V800 DAC for solving this issue, feeding it from the DAT deck, and using its digital output going back to the recorder.  It has a resampling feature which, supposedly, should change the sample rate of the incoming signal, according to what you define. I'm attaching the part of the manual where this issue is mentioned (from the Digital Output chapter).

What I'm planning to use as a recorder is a Marantz PMD570, which should be able to record on 48KHz.  So, assuming I'm not mistaken with something, and everything will work as it should, I hope I'll get my job done this way.

Any opinions are welcome and highly appreciated.  I'm just a beginner in this stuff.


Roy
« Last Edit: December 07, 2020, 01:35:55 AM by tbger »

 

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