Topic: Power Conditioners...initial observations

[Tim]

ha! I'll let her know that she's not alone!

[ducati]

Better is relative.  Better sounding?  Yes.  Better MTBF?  Yes.  Cold start *is* hard on tubes.

But remember, you're burning tube life.  And you'll burn through power tubes every 80 days or so!!!   

[Tim]

my amp can get pretty damn warm... it's ventilated pretty well but those tubes get HOT

[Frank M]

a thread highjacking,....

ok tube d00ds, a powering question for you.

Wouldn't it be better to leave the amps on rather than having to deal with a cold start each time?
It seems to me that the distortion of the hot/cold cycle would be really hard on the tubes?? (remember, I know very little about tube amps).

Tubed power amps should be turned off when not in use. 

Tubes have a limited life span.  There's a coating on the filament that throws off electrons when heated, but doesn't last forever.  Also, you don't want anything that hot sitting around when you're not home!

[cheshirecat]

There was a huge thread over at AA about this, I'll post if I can find it.  Yeah it takes the guy a while to warm up, but when you leave it running your killing tube life and also leaving yourself open to a fire risk (i assume more of an issue with vintage gear, but the same ideas apply in modern gear so maybe not).  The last thing you want is for something to go bad (tube, cap, whatever) in the amp and have it run away when you're not around.

From what I've read SS rectification in tube amps is particularly hard on amps at turn on because the plate current is nearly instantly there before the filaments have warmed up.  Mine uses a tube rectifier so things are a little easier on the amp, works like a built in standby switch.  The amp starts up as >> heaters come on, tubes begin to warm, when the rectifier has warmed up, DC plate current is passed, then bias voltage comes up (delay is varied by the size of the caps in the circuits that need to charge before passing current).  I think thats right, but the basic point is that until the tubes are warm, they're not seeing any plate current because its not getting through the rectifier.

[BCostigan]

It is possible but depends very much on the apartment configuration, I'd bet.  If you have access to your electrical box, I'd be tempted to just do it.  No one would know 
.

No one would know unless the place burnt down because of Tim's wiring.    Not worth it Timmay....especially in an apt. with other families living in the building etc.


I find this thread pretty amusing actually.  Any good power conditioner will have an isolation transformer built in.  As the name suggests is pysically isolates your power source from the rest of your house/world.  All it is really is a 1:1 induction transformer but will minimize noise and volatge spikes/drops because it's not *pysically* connected to the system.   These suckers are pricey though......best I found is about $400 for the xfmer rated for 20A. 

To me, the advantage of using an isolation xfmer is there are no gadgets or devices that will alter the waveform (some talk of power conditioners coloring the sound). 


I do think removing noise is a bit of a sisyphean task....there are just SO MANY variables that come into play that attaining the ultimate goal can be elusive.


As always...if anyone is planning on doing some home wiring feel free to PM me with any questions! I'd be happy to give people some pointers.  I play with wires all day long! 

[Frank M]

These suckers are pricey though......best I found is about $400 for the xfmer rated for 20A. 

Good iron is never cheap.  Alpha-Core offers a Sequerra-designed 8-outlet, 1000W model for $900. 

http://www.alphacore.com/power%20supply.html

[Lil Kim Jong-Il]

that is the same concept as this: http://www.bluecircle.com/index.php?menu_id=2724 and the 1200 watt unit is similar price.

I've been using a MR1200 for about 2 years.  Made a huge improvement - i didn't realize I had audible backgound noise until I installed this thing.

edit:  these things can be had for 500-600 on audiogon if you are patient.  They come up rarely; a wanted ad is how I got mine.

[ducati]

It is possible but depends very much on the apartment configuration, I'd bet.  If you have access to your electrical box, I'd be tempted to just do it.  No one would know 
.

No one would know unless the place burnt down because of Tim's wiring.    Not worth it Timmay....especially in an apt. with other families living in the building etc.

I, of course, assumed that he would consult outside help if he wasn't qualified.

[BCostigan]

It is possible but depends very much on the apartment configuration, I'd bet.  If you have access to your electrical box, I'd be tempted to just do it.  No one would know 
.

No one would know unless the place burnt down because of Tim's wiring.    Not worth it Timmay....especially in an apt. with other families living in the building etc.

I, of course, assumed that he would consult outside help if he wasn't qualified.

Wasn't trying to flame you!     Just wanted to make the obvious clear in the off chance it wasn't.

[ducati]

That is a good thing to point out, tho, and I'm glad you did.

Power is NOT something to mess around with if you don't feel qualified!!  AC power and the inside of tube amps--stay away if you don't know what you're doing

So..............................  I'm wondering how the Furutech vs. wallplate shootout went.

[Tim]

So.............................. I'm wondering how the Furutech vs. wallplate shootout went.

delayed thanks to my tube difficulties. Perhaps I can interest Jonny in lending an ear to such a shootout tonight

[scervin]

I was worried for a couple months as I did all my own electric.  Just did simple stuff and I'm a ME with some circuits knowledge as it was required.  I also took a semester class on the NEC (National Electric Code) to meet the 12 credits needed to be covered under BCBS of MI.  It was an awesome class and used much of what I learned there in the basement (load calculations, outlet spacing, GFCI's, etc.)  One demonstration on GFCI's was the prof dropped a hair dryer in a metal bucket with salt water and lit a 75W bulb connected to the bucket with wire and alligator clips.  You could put your hand in the water as it was running as well because the electricity had a place to go.  He then hooked a GFCI up and showed how it cut everything off. Pretty cool!

It has been a year now w/o issue so I'm more comfortable.  I figure white to white, black to black ground to ground....

sc.

[ducati]

I had an EE friend do mine, and although he was a whiz at wiring, the hole he accidentally drilled in the side of my house wasn't so great    I still need to buy a new piece of siding 

[Daryan]

Has anyone ever used products from equitech???  I heard the son of q will take care of the issues I have with the current conditoner from Wayne at Bolder!

I can get a pretty sweet deal on it new too!

Thanks