Topic: CMC-8 or CA-14? I want omnis as well, and the CAFS-OMNIs look tempting...

[adrianf74]

Here's a question, and I know it's a matter of personal preference.

I presently have a set of CMC-8's that I bought back in 2002/03.  I also have the SP-SB-3 which uses the mini-9v battery.

I'm tempted to "upgrade" or change mics as it's been a while since I've done so.

I'd like to get a set of lower-priced omni mics as well and figure the CAFS-OMNI will do the trick perfectly.  I like the size for stealth reasons.

The question is this: should I dump my CMC-8's and trade to CA-14's (or something else) or just get CA-14 omni and card caps or what?

I'll add that I'm using an Edirol R-09 these days.  I know a preamp is a better bet than a battery box so I'm looking at CA-UGLY for size (because it DOES matter in my case).  That said, I'd probably just sell the beloved battery box since I'd be moving up.

I'd appreciate some takes on this.

Thanks,
Adrian.

[acidjack]

Here's a question, and I know it's a matter of personal preference.

I presently have a set of CMC-8's that I bought back in 2002/03.  I also have the SP-SB-3 which uses the mini-9v battery.

I'm tempted to "upgrade" or change mics as it's been a while since I've done so.

I'd like to get a set of lower-priced omni mics as well and figure the CAFS-OMNI will do the trick perfectly.  I like the size for stealth reasons.

The question is this: should I dump my CMC-8's and trade to CA-14's (or something else) or just get CA-14 omni and card caps or what?

I'll add that I'm using an Edirol R-09 these days.  I know a preamp is a better bet than a battery box so I'm looking at CA-UGLY for size (because it DOES matter in my case).  That said, I'd probably just sell the beloved battery box since I'd be moving up.

I'd appreciate some takes on this.

Thanks,
Adrian.

I am assuming you use your CMC-8 with the stock AT933 caps (as opposed to say, with the adapter that allows you to use U853 caps). It's not clear from your post if you run omni or cardiod caps with them. I've run both. I find the omnis very nice sounding; the cards were a little thin on bass response, so I got the adapters and run the U853 caps with them.

For the mics, I'm not sure the CA-14 are really an upgrade to the CMC-8.  Both are good mics.  If you want to upgrade the sound of the CMC-8 (at least the cardiod caps) I think you'd be better off buying the adapter and the U853 cardiod caps for the mics you have rather than buying all-new mics.   

Same deal for omnis - if you already have CMC-8 omnis I'm not sure how dramatic the difference will be with the church mics.  You could get omni caps for the CMC-8 for less than what a new set of CAFS-Omnis cost.

On the battery box, it depends on your application.  If you record loud rock shows stealth (as I'm guessing from your post), I am not sure a pre will make a ton of difference sound-quality wise with these mics.  Having no battery box would definitely be a mistake.  For size, nothing beats the tiny Church battery box or the SPSB-10, which I use and find very effective plus a little more sturdy than the tiniest church box (since on that one you can see the 9v battery sitting there). 

If I were you, I would hold off on buying new mics until you can get a real upgrade.  For one example, Chris makes some new active cables that allow you to run Audix capsules with them into a normal battery box like the one you already have.  Those caps are the same size as the Church mics and are (supposedly) comparable in quality to AKG 480s.  They will set you back a touch more to have both omnis and cards (and hypers if you want them) but based on what I have heard, they'd be a real upgrade for you.  Look around on Archive.org for "Audix 1290" and compare the recordings yourself.

[paulbaptiste]

^agreed, use the bodies you have and get the adaptors and get some card/and or subcard, plus omni caps.  853's are great mics, and much better capsules than the 933/943 series.  You can't really beat the 853's for the price, and IMO, I enjoyed them more than the CA mics, 14's, CAFS, MM-HLSC.  Actually liked the 853 omni's over DPA 4061's, but that's just me, much more presence.

As for preamps.  I'd get the 9100 over the Ugly, get your mics mini-xlr modded, for lock-ability- no chance for loose connections.  the 9100 is much easier to use/set levels than the ugly.  I know everybody is "stealth" smaller is better, but black 853's with black cables, on a black cap, with black shure rotaing clips into a black 9100 that's the size of a pack of squares. . .  is easy to stealth.  done it for years

[adrianf74]

^agreed, use the bodies you have and get the adaptors and get some card/and or subcard, plus omni caps.  853's are great mics, and much better capsules than the 933/943 series.  You can't really beat the 853's for the price, and IMO, I enjoyed them more than the CA mics, 14's, CAFS, MM-HLSC.  Actually liked the 853 omni's over DPA 4061's, but that's just me, much more presence.

As for preamps.  I'd get the 9100 over the Ugly, get your mics mini-xlr modded, for lock-ability- no chance for loose connections.  the 9100 is much easier to use/set levels than the ugly.  I know everybody is "stealth" smaller is better, but black 853's with black cables, on a black cap, with black shure rotaing clips into a black 9100 that's the size of a pack of squares. . .  is easy to stealth.  done it for years

My CMC-8's are the original Cards that Sound Pros released.  I'm not sure if I can get adaptors and caps for them - I've never pursued that avenue.  If anybody can help advise me on this, I'd appreciate it.

I'm definitely leaning towards the 9100 at this point.  A couple of people have also PM'd me saying DO NOT go with the ugly because it's a lot harder to work with. 

So, can anybody point me in the direction I need to head to for mics, adapters, etc... thanks.

[Belexes]

Consider adapters and the 853 series of capsules for your mics.  They offer more bass response and more detail to my ears.  You can obtain cards, omni, hyper, and there is a limited stock left of subcards.

[Humbug]

So, can anybody point me in the direction I need to head to for mics, adapters, etc... thanks.

Sure, these are the adaptors to use a AT933 body (no groove) or AT943 body (groove for clip), with AT853 caps:

http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/AT-ADAPT

Caps on the same site.

[fmaderjr]

As for preamps.  I'd get the 9100 over the Ugly, get your mics mini-xlr modded, for lock-ability- no chance for loose connections.  the 9100 is much easier to use/set levels than the ugly.  I know everybody is "stealth" smaller is better, but black 853's with black cables, on a black cap, with black shure rotaing clips into a black 9100 that's the size of a pack of squares. . .  is easy to stealth.  done it for years

I've been posting similar thoughts for several months. The 9100 is plenty small enough to stealth with and is easy to adjust the levels. With the UGLY you have use a mini-screwdriver to change the levels and you need to change each channel separately. Very inconvenient IMO and almost impossible to stealth with if you are going to need to adjust levels. I love the 9100 series but just don't get the UGLY. To me the only time the UGLY would be useful is if you are recording acoustic and know you will be using max gain before you enter the venue.

[adrianf74]

As for preamps.  I'd get the 9100 over the Ugly, get your mics mini-xlr modded, for lock-ability- no chance for loose connections.  the 9100 is much easier to use/set levels than the ugly.  I know everybody is "stealth" smaller is better, but black 853's with black cables, on a black cap, with black shure rotaing clips into a black 9100 that's the size of a pack of squares. . .  is easy to stealth.  done it for years

I've been posting similar thoughts for several months. The 9100 is plenty small enough to stealth with and is easy to adjust the levels. With the UGLY you have use a mini-screwdriver to change the levels and you need to change each channel separately. Very inconvenient IMO and almost impossible to stealth with if you are going to need to adjust levels. I love the 9100 series but just don't get the UGLY. To me the only time the UGLY would be useful is if you are recording acoustic and know you will be using max gain before you enter the venue.

Thanks to everybody here and their feedback.  I've been able to come up with a solution that, for now, will allow me to what I need.

The 9100 would've been useful for Tori Amos last week, however, I wouldn't normally be taping "softer sounding" shows so some people have stated that the SP-SB-3 battery box (with the mini-9v battery) is probably as "small" as I'm gonna get.  It's been often suggested to avoid NOT using the battery box as well, and since most of the shows I'm at are rock shows with some volume, the battery box and my CMC-8's will be good enough for when I'm a bit further from the stacks.

The AT853 Omni idea seemed good, however, the size of the caps gets a bit big for my liking - I already find my AT933's "too big" for some circumstances so I decided to go with the CAFS-OMNIs *for now*.  They'll be a stop gap for when I'm closer to a sound source or need to be in "super st***th" mode.

I'd love nothing more than a pair of DPA4061's or, based on feedback, some Audix caps with the Church cables.  But I'm gonna wait to see what people are saying about that idea.

Thanks again to those who replied here and via pm.  Cheers.

[Sunday Driver]

As for preamps.  I'd get the 9100 over the Ugly, get your mics mini-xlr modded, for lock-ability- no chance for loose connections.  the 9100 is much easier to use/set levels than the ugly.  I know everybody is "stealth" smaller is better, but black 853's with black cables, on a black cap, with black shure rotaing clips into a black 9100 that's the size of a pack of squares. . .  is easy to stealth.  done it for years

I've been posting similar thoughts for several months. The 9100 is plenty small enough to stealth with and is easy to adjust the levels. With the UGLY you have use a mini-screwdriver to change the levels and you need to change each channel separately. Very inconvenient IMO and almost impossible to stealth with if you are going to need to adjust levels. I love the 9100 series but just don't get the UGLY. To me the only time the UGLY would be useful is if you are recording acoustic and know you will be using max gain before you enter the venue.

Thanks to everybody here and their feedback.  I've been able to come up with a solution that, for now, will allow me to what I need.

The 9100 would've been useful for Tori Amos last week, however, I wouldn't normally be taping "softer sounding" shows so some people have stated that the SP-SB-3 battery box (with the mini-9v battery) is probably as "small" as I'm gonna get.  It's been often suggested to avoid NOT using the battery box as well, and since most of the shows I'm at are rock shows with some volume, the battery box and my CMC-8's will be good enough for when I'm a bit further from the stacks.

The AT853 Omni idea seemed good, however, the size of the caps gets a bit big for my liking - I already find my AT933's "too big" for some circumstances so I decided to go with the CAFS-OMNIs *for now*.  They'll be a stop gap for when I'm closer to a sound source or need to be in "super st***th" mode.

I'd love nothing more than a pair of DPA4061's or, based on feedback, some Audix caps with the Church cables.  But I'm gonna wait to see what people are saying about that idea.

Thanks again to those who replied here and via pm.  Cheers.

Well, if you don't like the size of the AT933, the Audix are even bigger.