Topic: Is There Any Noticeable Sonic Degradation When Using Copper Quad Mic Cables?

[dactylus]

Hello,

While researching the various types of copper mic cables available I came across this cautionary statement concerning the use of any and all quad mic cables:

http://www.eventhorizon-srv.com/html/wire_types.html

Mogami 2893
             
 This is Mogami part number W2893 (mini quad). It is a lightweight quad microphone-style cable that is very flexible, durable, and sounds great. It will fill your needs for medium-abuse environments.  Mogami 2893 wire has 26AWG twisted-pair with served shield and gloss black jacket.


** Quad cable is great at reducing noise, but due to its higher inductance and capacitance it will not sound as good as a comparable standard mic cable. We recommend that you only use quad in high RFI (Radio Frequency Interference) environments or where you have a problem with noise pickup.


Can anyone comment on the validity of this statement as it applies to our typical recording scenarios?  There is no questioning the fact that we are surrounded by more and more cell phones and blackberries as each second ticks away and the shielded quad cables do provide some protection against that noise...

Thanks!

 

[Todd R]

Yes, that's true, or at least true theoretically.  And the issue is related to the quad/starquad nature of the cabling, not specific to copper per se.

Quad cabling will have higher capacitance per foot, and that can degrade high-frequency response.  Whether it is much of a concern with 15' mic cables as opposed to 200' runs of cabling I don't know.

Still, it is something to consider when choosing cabling.  I don't know that quad cabling is the best choice in this regard.  Cabling that is part of a snake or permanent install might go very near fluorescent lights, dimmers, electric motors, etc, etc that can create a noisy environment, so quad cabling could well make sense. In a taperssection, I'd guess we're much farther away from those sources of noise, though probably much closer to cell phone noise.

I don't know the right choice.  When I was making cables, I started with quad silver since I thought iwth the noise aspect for mic cables it would make sense.  Then I found that far more of my orders were for custom short ICs that would be down in a gear bag, so I decided to change to regular two-conductor cabling (non-quad).  Of course, at the time, I didn't personally own or use a cell phone, so I hadn't given that aspect much thought then.

[dactylus]

^
Thanks for the input Todd.

[yug du nord]

I read somewhere Chris Church had stated that he uses 2-conductor cable where 2-conductor cable is needed.  And 4-conductor cable where 4-conductor cable is needed.  Each has it's own application in his mind.  Makes sense.

[notlance]

It depends on the mic impedance, but assuming low impedance mics quad cable should be OK for cables up to about 100m where "regular" cable would have the same HF rolloff at about twice that length.  Note that I said "about".  For a typical 15m mic cable, don't worry about HF loss it unless you are trying to record bat calls.

If you want to have some fun, you can always calculate the HF rolloff yourself; it's just a first-order LPF.  Here's an on-line calculator:

http://www.sengpielaudio.com/calculator-cable.htm

[Nick's Picks]

for our lengths, I'd say its irrelevant.  I"ve used copper/silver quad and two wire flavors of the same....and I can't tell any difference other than cable stiffness.  the millspec quad stuff is pretty stiff.

[dactylus]

for our lengths, I'd say its irrelevant.  I"ve used copper/silver quad and two wire flavors of the same....and I can't tell any difference other than cable stiffness.  the millspec quad stuff is pretty stiff.

^
Thanks for the input guys.

[boojum]

Star quad means never having to say you're sorry.  Imagine recording some great group one night and getting home to find it full of RF hash.  Do that once and you will be cured.  As has been posted, under 200 foot runs it is probably irrelevant.  Over that it might be a problem.  How much of a problem?  Not much or pro's would not be using it for long runs in the field.

[Nick's Picks]

honestly, when was the last time anyone here had a recording ruined by RF exposure?
just curious...., not trying to derail the point. 

[Todd R]

honestly, when was the last time anyone here had a recording ruined by RF exposure?
just curious...., not trying to derail the point.

Yeah, that's what I'm wondering.  Also wondering if quad cables are any better with cell phone interference or if that operates at a different frequency or something that means the quad cables do no better.

Also -- as to the pros doing it, I'm not sure that info helps.  The quad cables might well have some level of high frequency rolloff due to higher capacitance, and the pros being pros might realize that and just provide a compensating high frequency boost.  Not to say we can't do the same, but many people don't like to make EQ tweaks or other changes to their recordings.