Become a Site Supporter and Never see Ads again!

Author Topic: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System  (Read 5535 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Popmarter

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Taperssection Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 678
  • Gender: Male
Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #45 on: October 19, 2022, 12:12:41 PM »
yeah!! here is my money 😂
Recorders: SD MixPre 3 II; Sony A10; Edirol R44; Sony M10; Sony WM-D6; Edirol R-09HR; iRiver IHP-120; Sharp MD-MT20; Sharp MD-MT190
Microphones: Nevaton MC59/S (cards); Milab VM-44 Links (cards), AT853 7.4mod (cards); AT831 (cards); Nakamichi CM300 (all CP's); Soundman OKM II Rock Studios
Preamps: Beyerdynamic MV100; JK Laboratories DVC-X-17b; Naiant IPA; Nakamichi MX-100 modded for 9v battery use

Offline Gutbucket

  • record > listen > revise technique
  • Trade Count: (15)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 14898
  • Gender: Male
  • "and the rowers keep on rowing!"
Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #46 on: October 19, 2022, 12:16:41 PM »
Here's one option:

https://www.cdint.com/catalog/category/Cables/10-32
^
Choose appropriate microdot termination (size 10-32, straight female, straight or right angle male), preinstalled on whatever length of cable you want.  Their standard RG174 cable works nicely for my applications.  For this kind of thing I tend to purchase a single cable pre-terminated with dots at both ends that is twice my required length, cut it in half and re-terminate the cut ends to mini-xlr or whatever you need at the other end to create a pair.

RG174 is nicely jacketed, robust, and the center conductor is far easier to solder than the cable DPA uses.
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<< (note: This is a 1st draft, now several years old and in need of revision!  Stay tuned)

Offline Popmarter

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Taperssection Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 678
  • Gender: Male
Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #47 on: October 19, 2022, 12:44:50 PM »
sorry for the ignorance but how many volts do you need to power this setup? 9V?
Recorders: SD MixPre 3 II; Sony A10; Edirol R44; Sony M10; Sony WM-D6; Edirol R-09HR; iRiver IHP-120; Sharp MD-MT20; Sharp MD-MT190
Microphones: Nevaton MC59/S (cards); Milab VM-44 Links (cards), AT853 7.4mod (cards); AT831 (cards); Nakamichi CM300 (all CP's); Soundman OKM II Rock Studios
Preamps: Beyerdynamic MV100; JK Laboratories DVC-X-17b; Naiant IPA; Nakamichi MX-100 modded for 9v battery use

Offline mountainhop

  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Taperssection Regular
  • **
  • Posts: 108
Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #48 on: October 19, 2022, 12:45:42 PM »
i think the next set will have mmcx jacks built in to the housing to use common headphone cables for PIP, or the microdot to mmcx cables on that site interchangably

Offline mountainhop

  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Taperssection Regular
  • **
  • Posts: 108
Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #49 on: October 19, 2022, 12:50:01 PM »
sorry for the ignorance but how many volts do you need to power this setup? 9V?
i was able to run one mic on PIP. now that i have this cable built i technically have a pair, so i will attempt to test if the A10 can power a pair.

based on my observations so far, as well as neumann's spec sheet, 2.5-10V is the range. higher obviously better for high SPL though the <3V PIP did fine in a quick test at a loud show (with a single mic, aka half the required current)

Offline mountainhop

  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Taperssection Regular
  • **
  • Posts: 108
Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #50 on: October 19, 2022, 12:53:05 PM »
what is cdint's turnaround time? and what is the diameter of their RG174. the cable on the prototype i built is RG174, marked 'bedea #1098 RG174 made in Germany". i have a few of these pigtails around but the cable is a bit thick for this purpose, imo
« Last Edit: October 19, 2022, 01:14:46 PM by mountainhop »

Offline DavidPuddy

  • Trade Count: (15)
  • Taperssection All-Star
  • ****
  • Posts: 1556
Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #51 on: October 19, 2022, 01:24:41 PM »
Around 5 business days for my RG174 back in July

Offline mountainhop

  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Taperssection Regular
  • **
  • Posts: 108
Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #52 on: October 19, 2022, 01:31:05 PM »
Around 5 business days for my RG174 back in July
do you know the diameter?

Offline DavidPuddy

  • Trade Count: (15)
  • Taperssection All-Star
  • ****
  • Posts: 1556
Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #53 on: October 19, 2022, 01:34:41 PM »
Around 5 business days for my RG174 back in July
do you know the diameter?

~2.6mm according to my inexpensive calipers

Offline illconditioned

  • Trade Count: (9)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 2975
Please DO NOT mail me with tech questions.  I will try to answer in the forums when I get a chance.  Thanks.

Sample recordings at: http://www.soundmann.com.

Offline fireonshakedwnstreet

  • Trade Count: (8)
  • Taperssection Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 656
  • Gender: Male
  • David
Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #55 on: October 21, 2022, 02:45:53 PM »
Very exciting!
Mics: AT 3031; AT 853Rx (c, o); CA-14(c); Naiant X-R (h); Studio Projects C4 (c, o, h); Nak 300/Tascam PE-125/JVC M510 (cp-1, cp-2, cp-3, JVC M510 superdirectional caps)
Recorders: Tascam DR-680 MkII; Tascam DR-70D; Tascam DR-5; Tascam DR-2D
Pres: Edirol UA-5 (Oade PMod & WMod); Marantz PMD661 (OCM); Naiant MidBox

Offline mountainhop

  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Taperssection Regular
  • **
  • Posts: 108
Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #56 on: October 22, 2022, 10:32:49 PM »
did a little more testing today. I got my "YPA" (chinese knockoff) versions of the DAD3056 microdot to 5-pin lectrosonics servo input so i could use microdot mics with the SPDR i picked up recently. Fortunately the knockoffs passed all tests on being electrically identical to the DPA versions (pin 1 was properly grounded to chassis, pins 2&4 were shorted to tell the input to produce 4V PIP, and there was the proper 3K9 resistor on pin 3 mic input)

neumann's  KK14 specs are as follows:
Maximum SPL   153 dB SPL, with Supply = 10 V, Rfeed = 20 Kilohms, for THD < 0.5%
143 dB SPL, with Supply = 5 V, Rfeed = 8.25 Kilohms, for THD < 0.5%


I was unable to get any response from sennheiser/neumann tech support, but lectro support suggested 6.6K resistor with the 4V their input provides

it did seem to work fine with the default 3.9K resistor in the adapter, i imagine this slightly lower resistance would only bump up output a bit on this very low-sens mic. any advice on the practical considerations here, or if i am putting the caps at risk, would be welcomed. technically the 3K9 resistor at 4V will allow up to about 1mA of current for these caps that want a max of 0.26 mA, so not sure if thats bad necessarily. Unless there is some other purpose than current-limiting for that resistor in that circuit. I would find it hard to believe that neumann would provide a mic with microdot out that wasnt compatible with the common DPA/lectro/countryman/etc microdot inputs, without providing specific guidance otherwise

so i did a home speaker test handholding the KK14 (on custom cable) next to a 4011GS, both single mics into the SPDR. Not an ideal test but at least a good comp. Adjusted the input levels on the channels independently on the recorder to get reasonably similar waveforms

The distance i was holding them can definitely be considered 'nearfield'. 15-30cm to the sound source

The KK14 definitely had less bottom end, but seemed to me to have a bit more clarity than the 4011s (which are kind of known by some for their 'dark' sound'). Per gutbucket's suggestion i did a little EQ on the bottom end and was satisfied with the result

the three files (4011 untouched, KK14 untouched, and KK14 eq'd) are here: https://mega.nz/folder/tPEWkLIB#nSlOB2jQ1tQpAlD3gqR2hQ

considering im usually removing low end from my recordings in post, this may not be objectionable in practice. Still, the proof wont be in the pudding until i get them in a free-field environment at a show, which i have a few coming up in the next few weeks (and should have a pair of second-gen cables by middle of this coming week)
« Last Edit: October 22, 2022, 11:01:23 PM by mountainhop »

Offline grawk

  • Trade Count: (1)
  • Taperssection Regular
  • **
  • Posts: 96
  • Gender: Male
Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #57 on: October 24, 2022, 06:58:00 PM »
can’t wait to hear the results
4015gs/4061->mma:a d-vice/mixpre 10 ii/zoom f3

Offline goodcooker

  • Trade Count: (41)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 3905
  • Gender: Male
  • goes to 11
Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #58 on: October 25, 2022, 11:32:19 AM »

SNIP < considering im usually removing low end from my recordings in post, this may not be objectionable in practice. > SNIP

This is where the rubber meets the road in a lot of what we are doing taping live shows. If the low end roll off is similar to what you are often doing in post then it all works out for the intended use.
Line Audio CM3 || ADK A51 type IV
SD MixpreD || Oade Warm Mod UA5
Tascam DR680 || Marantz PMD661 || Korg MR1 (homebrew internal battery mod)

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/goodcooker

"Are you the Zman?" - fan at Panic 10-08-10 Kansas City
"I don't know who left this perfectly good inflatable wook doll here, but if I'm blowing her up, I'm keeping her." -  hoppedup

Offline mountainhop

  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Taperssection Regular
  • **
  • Posts: 108
Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #59 on: October 30, 2022, 11:51:32 AM »
success on friday night. got the parts just in time on thursday to build the field-worthy version. got it dialed in where i was able to build a half-dozen of the center spring pin assemblies (by far the trickiest part)  in a few hours and bat 1000 on location to the tiny center pad on the capsule. so i built out one complete pair using mmc-x connectors, these worked splendidly with an off-the-shelf mmc-x headphone cable (albeit a tad short), Like most IEMs, when properly seated it is a robust connection.

i ran KK14>church ugly 9V bat box>A10 successfully. i ran without the bat box for the opening DJ set which was reasonably loud (albeit maybe a tad shy of the headliner volume) with no ill effects. ill try to do more tests sans bat box in an extreme stack environment in the future

so the million-dollar question: how do they sound? I would say i was pleased with their perfomance but technical limitations prevent a straight apples-to-apples with the 4011s i hoped to compare them to. namely:

1. i boned it and the 4015s were still in my hat from the last gig so id be comparing subcards with cards

2. the 4015s were in a proper mount at approx 70 deg and ~110mm for this stack tape. lacking a proper mount for these (because i built them too small, and was also rushed to get out to the show), i jammed them in there on the outside of the 4015s in some little windtech windscreens i had lying around, and so they were effectively A-B at about 150mm with the other mics and kinda my forehead as a bit of a baffle

3. the KK14s were in the windscreens which had potential to muffle the highs relative to the 4015s that were naked and right up against the thin fabric of the k****l v**t**r. The windscreens are technically deeper than my side-cable setup would allow. my best measurement is that there is a 10mm void space in front of the capsule before the foam, and then 15 mm of foam in the front and 9mm on the sides. It is good that windscreens exist for these! i bet they would do well outdoors



as expected the 4015s need rolloff work but the KK14s seem to need nothing. bottom end is there but not overpowering. hope to run next to the 4011s later this week in a proper setup. i might literally epoxy the KK14 cable ends right to the 3d-printed 110 70 deg mount, because i have the extra parts

im not sure i will post this show publicly, so if you want samples, message me and ill link you to a 4ch polywav with the two sources
« Last Edit: October 30, 2022, 11:56:25 AM by mountainhop »

 

RSS | Mobile
Page created in 0.059 seconds with 37 queries.
© 2002-2022 Taperssection.com
Powered by SMF