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Author Topic: Unconventional Requirements (iPhone, Roland r-07, Shure MV88+, Zoom F3)  (Read 1501 times)

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Offline tonyjuliano

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Re: Unconventional Requirements (iPhone, Roland r-07, Shure MV88+, Zoom F3)
« Reply #15 on: September 27, 2022, 01:49:11 PM »
It seems to me that there is a lot of overlap in your proposed set-ups. Why not start with one small and one larger rig and see where those are lacking before buying another? Personally, I would rather have one or two pairs of good mics than five pairs of lesser ones.

Yes, much overlap, for now.  But this is to figure out what works.  Ill ultimately end up with just 2 setups, I imagine.  One for "stealth" and another for quality.  But I have to  try out all the scenarios to get there.

Offline aaronji

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Re: Unconventional Requirements (iPhone, Roland r-07, Shure MV88+, Zoom F3)
« Reply #16 on: September 27, 2022, 03:54:05 PM »
^ Well, no, not really. Most of these things are known quantities, with lots of information and user reports available.

Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Unconventional Requirements (iPhone, Roland r-07, Shure MV88+, Zoom F3)
« Reply #17 on: September 27, 2022, 04:59:38 PM »
Two things-
First- Don't worry about audible monitoring while recording.  You only need to audibly monitor with headphones as needed for troubleshooting and setup. When recording you only need to verify that you have signal and have good levels, visual monitoring is helpful for that.

Second- The quality of your recordings will primarily determined by the following hierarchy:
1. Recording location.
2. Recording location.
3. Recording location.
4. The transducers you use and how you arrange them (microphones and configuration).
5. Managing the immediate environment around the recording location.
6. Everything else.  It just needs to work. This includes whatever recorder you use.

Better mics are the topmost part of the equipment portion of the hierarchy. How you use them is next important. Nothing is more important than recording location, other than the supporting equipment being setup correctly and simply working right.
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Offline tonyjuliano

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Re: Unconventional Requirements (iPhone, Roland r-07, Shure MV88+, Zoom F3)
« Reply #18 on: September 27, 2022, 05:02:07 PM »
Two things-
First- Don't worry about audible monitoring while recording.  You only need to audibly monitor with headphones as needed for troubleshooting and setup. When recording you only need to verify that you have signal and have good levels, visual monitoring is helpful for that.

Second- The quality of your recordings will primarily determined by the following hierarchy:
1. Recording location.
2. Recording location.
3. Recording location.
4. The transducers you use and how you arrange them (microphones and configuration).
5. Managing the immediate environment around the recording location.
6. Everything else.  It just needs to work. This includes whatever recorder you use.

Better mics are the topmost part of the equipment portion of the hierarchy. How you use them is next important. Nothing is more important than recording location, other than the supporting equipment being setup correctly and simply working right.

This…. All this, is excellent advice.

Thank you for your contribution.

Offline tonyjuliano

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Re: Unconventional Requirements (iPhone, Roland r-07, Shure MV88+, Zoom F3)
« Reply #19 on: September 27, 2022, 08:08:02 PM »
Ok, have had the chance to test out scenario’s 2 and 3

Setup 2 - r-07 and cs-10em binaural headset:
Worlds better than setup 1 (iPhone with Sennheiser binaural headset). Having full gain control, along with adequate plug in play voltage applied (neither of which the iPhone setup can do) makes a huge difference. I also tested the addition of a 9v battery box, and it works out great for high SPL.

Setup 3 - r-07 and audioreality.com mics & battery box:
Also works very well. This is a decent cardioid option to setup 2’s omni mics.

Looks like I’ll relegate the iPhone/Sennheiser combo to just “walking about” duty. Nice to have this option with me, anywhere, all the time, but knowing it’s limitations.

Setups 2 and 3 will be my go-to “stealth” setups, having the option between omni or cardioid patterns is a flexible nicety.

This just leaves setup 4, the non-stealth “quality” option (zoom f3 and a matched pair of condensers).  I really don’t think I need to test this scenario, I know it will work - and well, but I need to decide which matched pair of condensers is right for me (and my budget).  Also need to figure out the best way to adapt the setup 3 mics and battery box for use with the zoom f3, as it is XLR input only.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2022, 08:11:32 PM by tonyjuliano »

Offline jefflester

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Re: Unconventional Requirements (iPhone, Roland r-07, Shure MV88+, Zoom F3)
« Reply #20 on: September 27, 2022, 08:59:24 PM »
Ok, have had the chance to test out scenario’s 2 and 3

Setup 2 - r-07 and cs-10em binaural headset:
Worlds better than setup 1 (iPhone with Sennheiser binaural headset). Having full gain control, along with adequate plug in play voltage applied (neither of which the iPhone setup can do) makes a huge difference. I also tested the addition of a 9v battery box, and it works out great for high SPL.

Setup 3 - r-07 and audioreality.com mics & battery box:
Also works very well. This is a decent cardioid option to setup 2’s omni mics.

Looks like I’ll relegate the iPhone/Sennheiser combo to just “walking about” duty. Nice to have this option with me, anywhere, all the time, but knowing it’s limitations.

Setups 2 and 3 will be my go-to “stealth” setups, having the option between omni or cardioid patterns is a flexible nicety.

This just leaves setup 4, the non-stealth “quality” option (zoom f3 and a matched pair of condensers).  I really don’t think I need to test this scenario, I know it will work - and well, but I need to decide which matched pair of condensers is right for me (and my budget).  Also need to figure out the best way to adapt the setup 3 mics and battery box for use with the zoom f3, as it is XLR input only.
Are the audio reality mics an older model? The mics on his current site are omni binaural mics as well, I'm not sure you are going to see much of difference between them and the cs-10em binaurals.
http://audioreality.com/

If you want to adapt the audio reality mics to use with a Zoom F3, you would just use 1/8" to XLR adapter(s). If you were relying on the R-07 (or other small deck) to provide low voltage ("plug-in power") for the mics you would have more of a challenge. But since you are using the battery box you are all set. But if you are going to create a setup for open taping situations, you'd really want to get that pair of cardioid mics. You can use omnis, but you need to either spread them wide (3 feet) or put a baffle of some sort ("Jecklin Disc") between them to get any stereo.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2022, 09:18:28 PM by jefflester »
DPA4061 HEB/AT943 -> CA-UGLY -> R-09
AKG CK63 -> nBob actives -> Baby NBox -> R-09/DR2d
AKG CK63 -> AKG C460B -> Zoom F8/DR-680MKII
Samson C02/Superlux S502/iSK Little Gem/Sennheiser E609/Shure SM57 -> Zoom F8/DR-680MKII (multitracked band recordings)

Offline tonyjuliano

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Re: Unconventional Requirements (iPhone, Roland r-07, Shure MV88+, Zoom F3)
« Reply #21 on: September 27, 2022, 09:17:04 PM »
Quote
Are the audio reality mics an older model?

Custom made for me, with cardioid capsules I supplied (with help from him in terms of specification).

Quote
If you want to adapt the audio reality mics to use with a Zoom F3, you would just use 1/8" to XLR adapter(s).

That’s what I figured, but want to see if I can find the mist “elegant” adapter situation.  Right now that looks like female 3.5mm stereo to twin male XLR connectors.

Quote
If you were relying on the R-07 (or other small deck) to provide low voltage ("plug-in power") for the mics you would have more of a challenge. But since you are using the battery box you are all set. But if you are going to create a setup for open taping situations, you'd really want to get that pair of cardioid mics. You can use omnis, but you need to either spread them wide (3 feet) or put a baffle of some sort ("Jecklin Disc") between them to get any stereo.

Yes, battery box was key.  In regard to open taping, it would be marched cardioids all the way, but whose pair is the question.

Offline jefflester

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Re: Unconventional Requirements (iPhone, Roland r-07, Shure MV88+, Zoom F3)
« Reply #22 on: September 27, 2022, 09:21:07 PM »
Quote
Are the audio reality mics an older model?

Custom made for me, with cardioid capsules I supplied (with help from him in terms of specification).
Ah, nice!

Are they still that small? If you put 'em on a stand for open taping how are you going to hold/position them?

Quote
That’s what I figured, but want to see if I can find the mist “elegant” adapter situation.  Right now that looks like female 3.5mm stereo to twin male XLR connectors.
Is it the battery box in his photo or a hard-wired cable out with 1/8" male plug? If it is a female 1/8" jack in the battery box it's just one cable/splitter.
Like:
https://www.zzounds.com/item--HOSHMX015Y?siid=285490
« Last Edit: September 27, 2022, 09:24:24 PM by jefflester »
DPA4061 HEB/AT943 -> CA-UGLY -> R-09
AKG CK63 -> nBob actives -> Baby NBox -> R-09/DR2d
AKG CK63 -> AKG C460B -> Zoom F8/DR-680MKII
Samson C02/Superlux S502/iSK Little Gem/Sennheiser E609/Shure SM57 -> Zoom F8/DR-680MKII (multitracked band recordings)

Offline tonyjuliano

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Re: Unconventional Requirements (iPhone, Roland r-07, Shure MV88+, Zoom F3)
« Reply #23 on: September 27, 2022, 09:36:47 PM »
Quote
Are they still that small? If you put 'em on a stand for open taping how are you going to hold/position them?

Ever so slightly larger.  Won’t be used for open taping, will use a matched pair of traditional condensers for that, but want to see if I can adapt the stealth mics for use with the f3 (if I could possibly find a way to make the recorder more stealthy).

Quote
Is it the battery box in his photo or a hard-wired cable out with 1/8" male plug?

Yes - the battery box shown on audioreality.com site, which has two 3.5mm female stereo connectors.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2022, 09:38:40 PM by tonyjuliano »

Offline drgary

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Re: Unconventional Requirements (iPhone, Roland r-07, Shure MV88+, Zoom F3)
« Reply #24 on: October 02, 2022, 07:26:40 AM »
I have had a set of Audioreality mics for a few years now and they've worked very well.  I have them taped to a "U" shaped piece of rigid wire, taken from a coat hanger, that I fit under my collar when I'm out taping.  That seems to work great except when I accidentally say something to my wife that needs to be edited out.  :)

Offline swordfish

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Re: Unconventional Requirements (iPhone, Roland r-07, Shure MV88+, Zoom F3)
« Reply #25 on: October 02, 2022, 09:17:32 AM »
I have had a set of Audioreality mics for a few years now and they've worked very well.  I have them taped to a "U" shaped piece of rigid wire, taken from a coat hanger, that I fit under my collar when I'm out taping.  That seems to work great except when I accidentally say something to my wife that needs to be edited out.  :)
+1
I use a piece of 4 mm Chopper wire with a black shirt,
 used it with in the past with CA 14 cards and
Sound Professionals CMC 25

 

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