Author Topic: Arena taping : where's the best spot ? (Read 5770 times)

fandelive · « **on:** October 01, 2009, 04:05:24 AM »

Hi,

I'd like to tape a loud rock show in an arena. There are only a limited number of tickets left to buy, thus a limited choice of where to stand.

I have the choice between sitting in the 416 or 210 section, or standing somewhere in the orange area, in front of the stage.
The 416 section has 2 type of tickets, so I assume the higher price/the better place

I use cardioid mics (MM-HLSC-1).
What would you do ?

EDIT : I'd say 416 (higher price seat) and trying to find a good mic config to get the best stereo effect...

setboy · « **Reply #1 on:** October 01, 2009, 07:04:37 AM »

you want to be in the orange

su6oxone · « **Reply #2 on:** October 01, 2009, 07:22:44 AM »

Quote from: setboy on October 01, 2009, 07:04:37 AM

you want to be in the orange

Agree, somewhere in the middle of the orange. Depending on the overall size of the venue (looks like a basketball size arena), if I had to choose between the two I would pick 210 since at least you'll be in front of the speakers rather than off to the side. Neither are really ideal though.

Big Perm · « **Reply #3 on:** October 01, 2009, 09:29:20 AM »

Orange you glad you ask?

page · « **Reply #4 on:** October 01, 2009, 09:56:58 AM »

Quote from: su6oxone on October 01, 2009, 07:22:44 AM

Quote from: setboy on October 01, 2009, 07:04:37 AM
you want to be in the orange

Agree, somewhere in the middle of the orange. Depending on the overall size of the venue (looks like a basketball size arena), if I had to choose between the two I would pick 210 since at least you'll be in front of the speakers rather than off to the side. Neither are really ideal though.

I concur, go for the middle of the orange for the best sound, and if you arn't going to do that, then 210 is as good as it gets in a seat with what you have remaining.

Belexes · « **Reply #5 on:** October 01, 2009, 11:15:10 AM »

416 would be the worst. Orange is the best and I have taped in the 210 area of an arena...results can be decent there but not optimal.

sleepypedro · « **Reply #6 on:** October 01, 2009, 04:17:51 PM »

i've done some arena recording in the equivalent of your section 213 with very nice results.

DisturbedPyro · « **Reply #7 on:** October 01, 2009, 07:14:35 PM »

i agree with the majority, go for the orange floor. however my opinion differs from the majority on where to stand on the floor. personally, i like stack taping. it picks up more of the music being pumped out of the pa and tends to drown out more crowd noise. i personally hate hearing clapping, yelling, screaming, etc during a song. in between songs, sure, but not while the song is playing. however, some ppl prefer the 'full concert atmosphere' in their recordings and like all the crowd noise mixed in. so it depends on what youre after. but if it were me, i would try to get right in front of the pa so the recording picks up most of the audio directly from the pa. just curious, who are you taping? best of luck

setboy · « **Reply #8 on:** October 01, 2009, 07:30:24 PM »

Quote from: DisturbedPyro on October 01, 2009, 07:14:35 PM

i agree with the majority, go for the orange floor. however my opinion differs from the majority on where to stand on the floor. personally, i like stack taping. it picks up more of the music being pumped out of the pa and tends to drown out more crowd noise. i personally hate hearing clapping, yelling, screaming, etc during a song. in between songs, sure, but not while the song is playing. however, some ppl prefer the 'full concert atmosphere' in their recordings and like all the crowd noise mixed in. so it depends on what youre after. but if it were me, i would try to get right in front of the pa so the recording picks up most of the audio directly from the pa. just curious, who are you taping? best of luck

I have no problem with stack taping just as long as the mix is mono.

su6oxone · « **Reply #9 on:** October 01, 2009, 07:48:09 PM »

Quote from: DisturbedPyro on October 01, 2009, 07:14:35 PM

personally, i like stack taping. it picks up more of the music being pumped out of the pa and tends to drown out more crowd noise. i personally hate hearing clapping, yelling, screaming, etc during a song.

I am with you on that. I just hate clapping, talking, whistling, and any other type of crowd noise except for crowd cheering (not chatting) from a distance. But the few times I've done stack tapes I've not been pleased with the results because it sounds very 'two dimensional' and without any depth, which is not surprising since it's basically a mono tape. Bottom line, is that it's tough to get a good stealth tape (the only time I would do a stack tape) that sounds good and is low on the crowd noise.

Belexes · « **Reply #10 on:** October 01, 2009, 11:16:01 PM »

Quote from: setboy on October 01, 2009, 07:30:24 PM

I have no problem with stack taping just as long as the mix is mono.

I agree. If it's a small club and you are getting a mono mix, stack taping is fine. However a large arena show is likely to be a stereo mix, so FOB on the floor center is where I'd be.

itook2much · « **Reply #11 on:** October 04, 2009, 04:18:08 PM »

In the end, the answer is "it all depends on..." unfortunately.

In general, I would say the floor is your best bet. The size of the arena comes into play a lot too. In an arena that's probably a bit smaller than this, I've made great recordings on about your 203/206 line as well as 207/208. It depends on the sound (like always) & more so on how/where the stacks are arranged.

So go for the orange floor to have the best choice as far as location (since you can move). Otherwise, not knowing the venue, I would go for 210.

optimisticpessimist · « **Reply #12 on:** October 13, 2009, 05:08:10 PM »

I just have to chime in that I encountered a very similar situation earlier this summer, taping a loud rock concert in a large arena in San Antonio. I was sitting near the back of a section similar to 210, and as it turned out, another taper (running the same type of cardioid mics that I was, coincidentally) was taping from a section similar to your 416. In this case, some of the large flown speakers were actually pointed sideways/diagonally out from the stage, in addition to the main stacks pointing directly out. As a result, I prefer his tape, because he was basically twice as close to the sound source compared to me.

So if you can't secure a floor ticket, I'm going to contradict most of the answers here and go with 416, based on that actual experience.

su6oxone · « **Reply #13 on:** October 13, 2009, 05:24:26 PM »

Quote from: optimisticpessimist on October 13, 2009, 05:08:10 PM

So if you can't secure a floor ticket, I'm going to contradict most of the answers here and go with 416, based on that actual experience.

That's a good point in arenas that have speakers oriented towards to sides.

Belexes · « **Reply #14 on:** October 13, 2009, 08:24:01 PM »

Quote from: su6oxone on October 13, 2009, 05:24:26 PM

Quote from: optimisticpessimist on October 13, 2009, 05:08:10 PM
So if you can't secure a floor ticket, I'm going to contradict most of the answers here and go with 416, based on that actual experience.

That's a good point in arenas that have speakers oriented towards to sides.

It's probably going to be a stereo mix in a large hall. Not being center can have its disadvantages. I am not a big fan of stack taping if it can be avoided.

optimisticpessimist · « **Reply #15 on:** October 13, 2009, 10:04:45 PM »

Quote from: Belexes on October 13, 2009, 08:24:01 PM

It's probably going to be a stereo mix in a large hall.

What is this statement based on? I have to respectfully disagree.

First of all, stereo panning in a larger hall would mean that a large percentage of the people on one side or the other of the venue would be missing a significant portion of the music. That makes no sense to me.

Secondly, I think it might depend on what kind of music we're talking about. I can only think of one example of stereo panning out of all the rock/metal shows that I've seen in arena size venues, and that was just an effect in between songs, during a seque/intro. With that in mind, I'd rather have a clearer, more upfront tape of 99% of a show, with perhaps small moments of one guitar, or effect, coming in more distant, than I would a more distant recording of 100% of the show. But I suppose that's a matter of opinion/taste.

Belexes · « **Reply #16 on:** October 14, 2009, 08:37:14 AM »

Quote from: optimisticpessimist on October 13, 2009, 10:04:45 PM

But I suppose that's a matter of opinion/taste.

It is. My opinion is based on over two decades of a arena rock concerts in which music is panned. I have seen two guitarists take solos on separate sides of the stage and they can only be heard on the side of the stage they are on...as odd as that may seem. To me, you want to try and capture what the FOH engineer is working on from not far from his location. Stack taping to me takes out the acoustics of the hall and gives the recording a soundboard type feel to it. I only do it with a chatty crowd in a room with very poor acoustics.

optimisticpessimist · « **Reply #17 on:** October 15, 2009, 08:51:15 AM »

Quote from: Belexes on October 14, 2009, 08:37:14 AM

It is. My opinion is based on over two decades of a arena rock concerts in which music is panned. I have seen two guitarists take solos on separate sides of the stage and they can only be heard on the side of the stage they are on...as odd as that may seem. To me, you want to try and capture what the FOH engineer is working on from not far from his location. Stack taping to me takes out the acoustics of the hall and gives the recording a soundboard type feel to it. I only do it with a chatty crowd in a room with very poor acoustics.

Understandable.

From my end, I've been going to shows for over 13 years, have been taping for 10 of them, and have rarely experienced this. Not to mention that I find it rare that a sports arena has good acoustics, coupled with the fact that I'm usually taping loud rock shows with rowdy crowds and want to eliminate as much crowd noise as possible. Lastly, I prefer a closer recording, that often picks up nuances in the performance that can be missed by a FOB tape.

alzeppelin · « **Reply #18 on:** October 15, 2009, 10:06:57 AM »

Another thing I like to do is research the band's PA setup for the tour by doing a quick image search on Google. Like one of the previous posters said, you can often get a nice tape from the upper level on the side since the PA stacks are more often than not hanging from the ceiling. The lower rows of the upper level work out great for this *if* there is a side facing PA.

Taping from the floor is your best chance of getting a nice sounding recording if you want to play it safe. Get as close to the PA stacks as possible but just make sure you are not underneath them.

page · « **Reply #19 on:** October 15, 2009, 10:22:41 AM »

I think the universal lesson here is that on the floor, you have options, in the seats, you don't. Whatever happens, happens there. I think stack tapes from the floor will sound better then stack tapes from the seats (all distances equal) since your closer to the sidewalls for reflections. It's still a stack tape, but I think the room reflection will be deminished (which I agree, for most arenas, thats not a positive).