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Author Topic: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file  (Read 24754 times)

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Offline danlynch

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MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« on: November 06, 2005, 07:37:56 PM »
Ran the MT24/96 for two sets tonight.  First set wav file is 1 GB, all the data is there (with ridiculously low levels, but that's another topic--the useless level meters).  Second set ran exactly the same way, but the recording time ran out in the middle of the encore.  Fine.  The resulting wav file has 0 bytes on the MT, and on the harddrive.
Is there any data here that I can recover, or is this just another bug that is resulting in my losing an entire set of music? :'(

I regret having purchased this buggy piece of garbage.
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Offline neutrino

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2005, 11:21:17 PM »
Dan-
Your recording rig isn't mentioned in your post or signature. What's your setup? Were you recording via the digital optical in? What bit rate? What CF card are you using? Were you using the internal battery or an external source? What firmware do you have loaded? The answers to these questions can help people respond to help you.
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Offline danlynch

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2005, 09:15:31 AM »
Dan-
Your recording rig isn't mentioned in your post or signature. What's your setup? Were you recording via the digital optical in? What bit rate? What CF card are you using? Were you using the internal battery or an external source? What firmware do you have loaded? The answers to these questions can help people respond to help you.
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I used this unit one week ago, with the 1/8" plug on mic in.  The recording was intact, but peak level distortion made about half the recording unlistenable.  Switched to 1/4" inputs with the adapter for this recording.

Basically, if you max out the recording time, you will lose the last wav file that was recorded.  That seems to be what happened, and also seems that after scanning the forum, this experience is not unique (I believe jcrab had the same problem).

In terms of the level meters, this unit is basically incapable of indicating appropriate levels, so that a pre-amp > digital in > MT  is the only way to guarantee levels will be listenable (not either microscopic on one hand or peak distorted on the other).  Pretty hard to stealth with a pre-amp.


So for me, the MT has become the most expensive walkman I've ever purchased.  Loaded some wav files onto the drive, packed the headphones, and now its a portable digital headset.
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Offline keepongoin

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2005, 10:21:50 AM »
Pretty hard to stealth with a pre-amp.


really? I have stealthed my V3 before a few times.  I have seen people stealthing V2/AD2K combos.
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Offline live2496

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2005, 12:50:22 PM »
Dan,
For any out of the ordinary conditions which might occur while recording to flash memory, you can try putting the media in a card reader and running chkdsk with the /f option. We do this to fixup pocket pc wav files also.

To do this go to the windows command prompt and type "chkdsk E: /f"  (where E: is the drive letter)

To get to the command prompt, Start->Run and enter "cmd" into the edit box. It will run cmd.exe
This will work on NT, Win2K, and XP. On Windows98 it is command.exe .

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Offline danlynch

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #5 on: November 08, 2005, 01:51:49 AM »
This was what I did.  I ran to the disc space to the end.  It was exactly the amount of recorded time reported when the MT was powered up at the outset, and again, was the disc space reported left at the power-up at the beginning of the second set.  When the drive was full, the MT stopped recording (no levels).  I powered-down the MT, and then unhooked all the cables--which included a battery-pack associated with the core sound mics.  I am absolutely certain that I powered down the MT first, because I wanted the back-light to be off as quickly as possible (stealthing). 
I believe that I probably should have depressed the menu selection and viewed the files before powering down.  Perhaps the last wav file did not save prior to my power-down.
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Offline gewwang

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2005, 02:20:51 AM »
This was what I did.  I ran to the disc space to the end.  It was exactly the amount of recorded time reported when the MT was powered up at the outset, and again, was the disc space reported left at the power-up at the beginning of the second set.  When the drive was full, the MT stopped recording (no levels).  I powered-down the MT, and then unhooked all the cables--which included a battery-pack associated with the core sound mics.  I am absolutely certain that I powered down the MT first, because I wanted the back-light to be off as quickly as possible (stealthing). 
I believe that I probably should have depressed the menu selection and viewed the files before powering down.  Perhaps the last wav file did not save prior to my power-down.

did you power off without stopping the record process?

that could cause the problem as well


boogie

I accidently shut mine off while recording and this is exactly what happened. It saved the file with a length of 0.

Offline live2496

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2005, 10:20:25 AM »
Another note...
Even if the file can be made accessible with chkdsk /f , also the file wav header probably needs updating.

You can use this...
http://www.gidluckmastering.com/audiohck.zip
This will read your wav file and write out the same RIFF attributes as the original, plus correct the header counters.  You can then import the files into any windows audio application.

It is usually used to cut down the size of a file recorded larger than 2gb (you get two output files). On the pocket pc I allow files of up to 4gb in size to be recorded. I needed a way to split files afterwards.

Gordon
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Offline gewwang

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2005, 11:50:03 AM »
You can use this...
http://www.gidluckmastering.com/audiohck.zip
This will read your wav file and write out the same RIFF attributes as the original, plus correct the header counters.  You can then import the files into any windows audio application.

Are you saying I can run this app on my 0 length wav file and save the contents using wavelab?

Offline live2496

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2005, 03:19:27 PM »
Not necessarily. Just if chkdsk /f recovers the file. If pcm data is actually in the file, then the application should be able to restore the wav file integrity.  It will keep the wav header attributes, skip any extraneous chunks and skip to the data chunk and write that out to a new file.

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Offline jcrab66

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #10 on: November 08, 2005, 06:06:54 PM »


I accidently shut mine off while recording and this is exactly what happened. It saved the file with a length of 0.

hey george, on the CF card with the 0 length file is the space on the card usable, meaning does windows show the space that was used to record the show as being available or is the available space less by the amount of data written during the record session, i know this is confusing but the reason i am asking is that on my 0 length file it still used the space on the CF card so I am thinking the data is there but I cant figure out how to get it to it, guess i will try the chkdsk thing...
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Offline musicsherlock

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #11 on: November 15, 2005, 08:21:54 AM »
I have the same problem as jcrab66:



It is still holding the space on the microdrive and when I open in CEP2 it shows the proper lenght (approx. 1hr 50min).

I did the chkdsk with /f but it is still unplayable...I downloaded a bunch of file restoration software (demo versions) and am unsure if those will repair the file.

what do you all recommend?  Is this file salvageable?

I attribute this to a mix of bugs and operator error.  The unit froze when reaching the 2hr limit (24/48 spdif from UA-5) and I was trying to begin a new file and the machine would not respond to anything (on/off, rec, etc.).  I pulled the microdrive out of the machine to re-boot and nothing changed.  I think the data was recorded but not "finalized"...however, I'm a complete newb to these types of things...HELP!

Offline Brian Skalinder

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2005, 09:31:59 AM »
It is still holding the space on the microdrive and when I open in CEP2 it shows the proper lenght (approx. 1hr 50min).

I did the chkdsk with /f but it is still unplayable...I downloaded a bunch of file restoration software (demo versions) and am unsure if those will repair the file.

Sorry if you've already tried this, but I wasn't sure from your comments above:  have you tried opening it in CEP as a RAW file and then re-saving as WAV?
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Offline musicsherlock

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2005, 09:47:26 AM »
I've tried opening as 24/48 file but it comes up as static or "white noise" or something...I'll try other options tonight.

Offline live2496

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #14 on: November 15, 2005, 05:16:23 PM »
Samples must be correctly aligned into frames or 24-bit samples can end up sounding like white noise.

There are six bytes per stereo frame, so six possibilities exist ---one of which is correct, one of which will give you swapped channels.

Audiohack will scan to the data chunk and then begin writing it, so it should maintain proper framing. You can alternatively import into Samplitude 7 using the import as raw and hit the "offset" checkbox to tell it where the data begins. Usually byte 45 in most files unless there are extraneous chunks.

There are likely ways to do this in CoolEdit as Brian mentioned (or Adobe Audition) by importing the data as raw and then writing it out.

Audiohack will maintain the frame integrity and also if the file exceeds 2gb, the break to the second file will also be on a frame boundary. I had to have something to do this as I allowed recordings to exceed 2gb on windows CE.

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Offline musicsherlock

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #15 on: November 15, 2005, 08:23:58 PM »
No luck yet >:(

perhaps all is lost. "Input file has no data chunk!"

think I'm gonna send the file to an engineer and see if he can salvage...

Offline musicsherlock

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #16 on: November 15, 2005, 08:51:43 PM »
Woot! not sure which part did it, but we're back in business...+T's all around

now, why did the MT freeze up at 1hr and 05 minutes?...perhaps one of the false remaining time bits...?

Offline jcrab66

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #17 on: November 15, 2005, 09:43:22 PM »
Woot! not sure which part did it, but we're back in business...+T's all around

now, why did the MT freeze up at 1hr and 05 minutes?...perhaps one of the false remaining time bits...?

damn man, i gotta know how you did that!
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Offline jcrab66

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #18 on: November 15, 2005, 10:38:44 PM »

Sorry if you've already tried this, but I wasn't sure from your comments above:  have you tried opening it in CEP as a RAW file and then re-saving as WAV?

I did it and it worked!, well, with one small difference, when i tried opening as raw pcm it prompted me for the sample rate then when i selected it said invalid file. I did it again, only this time instead of specifying raw pcm i opened it as "all files". It prompted me twice for the sample rate then opened no probs, saved as wav and everything is great. Thanks and +T!
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Offline Chris K

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #19 on: November 16, 2005, 12:30:04 PM »
this should be in the microtrack faq if it isnt already
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Offline keepongoin

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #20 on: November 16, 2005, 12:44:58 PM »
this should be in the microtrack faq if it isnt already

Woot! not sure which part did it, but we're back in business...+T's all around

now, why did the MT freeze up at 1hr and 05 minutes?...perhaps one of the false remaining time bits...?


so, what answer should i put in the FAQ about this issue? i was waiting for a firm solution before updating the FAQ... or should i link the thread for now and then change it once there is a conclusive answer.  I would prefer the former, as it is less work in the long-run... you know, let things get hashed out and developed here and then update when the answer become something somebody frequently needs.

also: has anyone else had these issues?  how prevelant is this? I have not had this problem... all sort of others but not this one.
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Offline musicsherlock

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #21 on: November 16, 2005, 01:02:34 PM »
I think this issue is a combination of bug and user error, atleast in my case it was...the unit definately froze after a little over an hour...if I had been on the ball, I would have started a new file at set break and could have avoided the whole issue...however, when the unit froze, I could not power down, start a new track or get the machine to respond whatsoever, so I pulled the microdrive (my second mistake).

As far as salvaging the recording goes I would include:
1) check disc options
Quote from: eupeptic
probably the easiest thing to try first is just to run chkdsk d: (I'm just using drive D: for this example...) from the command prompt to see if detects any errors, and if so, add the /f switch to repair those errors - then see if you can access the files.



2) audiohack.exe options:
Quote from: live2496 from PM
<snip>
First, setup a work area. Say c:\audio for example. You can make that folder in Windows.

Copy the audiohack.exe there.

Copy your file to be fixed there.
Rename your input file so that it does not have any embedded spaces in the filename.
For this example, let's rename it to be "big". (ie.big.wav)

goto a command prompt. Start->Run->cmd   (enter "cmd" into the box, press ok)

Navigate to the audio folder...
cd \ <enter>
cd audio <enter>

Let's see what's in the folder...
dir <enter>

At this point you should see...
audiohack.exe
big.wav

Clear the screen...
cls <enter>

Now we are ready to run the program...
audiohack.exe (/H or /N)<enter>

At the first prompt, enter the filename of the file to fix...
BIG <enter>

At the next prompt, enter the filename of the file which which will contain the first 2gb of the file we are fixing.
PART1 <enter>

At the final prompt, enter the filename of the file which will contain the remainder of the file we are fixing.
PART2 <enter>

(Important note: you can leave .WAV off of the filenames.)
The program will then go into run mode and process the data.
From Windows you should see all of the files as it is running.

When complete, rename PART1.WAV and PART2.WAV to be whatever you want them to be called.

this should be in the microtrack faq if it isnt already

and
3) open file as raw PCM file in Cool Edit Pro

Quote from: Brian Skalinder from PM
<1>  Rename .WAV to .RAW or .PCM
<2>  File | Open | Select files of type PCM Raw Data (.raw, .pcm) Use All Files option
<3>  At the Interpret Sample Format As dialogue, specify appropriate sample rate and bit-depth (if 24-bit, select 32-bit at this stage)
<4> At the PCM Raw Data dialogue, select Data Formatted As = proper bit-depth (if 24-bit, choose 24-bit Packed Intel), and try each Offset (0, 1, 2) and see if one of them works.

Offline live2496

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #22 on: November 16, 2005, 02:10:20 PM »
I should probably add that the audiohack.exe is in the zip file at this link...
http://www.gidluckmastering.com/audiohck.zip

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Offline keepongoin

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #23 on: November 16, 2005, 02:38:11 PM »
Ok, now i understand much better how to go about writing about this, musicsherlock.  I wasn't sure how to add this in, but now I do.  I will write a brief summary and link this thread in the FAQ. 

+T
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Offline Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B)

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #24 on: December 15, 2005, 09:28:21 AM »
I know everyone knows this but THIS PLACE FUCKING RULES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I unpluged the power from my MT last night (battery also powers the UA5 and it was going dead). This resulted in the dreaded 0 byte file. I knew I had seen this thread. Thank god, one of the best sets of music I've seen this year.

I just did the chkdsk thing (using the MT as the card reader), this gave me a 656MB file which I copied to my HD. After that I just opened it in CEP (following the directions). Didn't have to use the audiohack program.

Thanks to you smart peoples! My recording sounds great. Too bad I lost about 1 minute during the encore. Luckily I was running the JB3 from the board, I'm going to mix them together, so I still have a complete show. I'll just have about a minute of SBD only.

MIKE B

PS. The show was Eric Bachmann of Crooked Fingers. He played quite a few new songs, so I would have been pretty disapointed if this didn't work.

PPS. Time to make a second power source for the MT only.
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Offline musicsherlock

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #25 on: December 15, 2005, 09:53:03 AM »
+T...salvaged recordings end up being my favorite recordings...

I use this to power the MT on it's own http://www.bixnet.com/hicamiexbapa.html On my first test, it recorded an MP3 file for 9hrs...

EDIT: You need to hack a mini-USB on one end of the included adaptaplug...thanks to ToddR for the cable, I just switched it to this box.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2005, 11:02:40 AM by musicsherlock »

Offline Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B)

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #26 on: December 15, 2005, 11:51:29 AM »
Now that I have opened the repaired file I am missing about half of it. I am certain the unit was recording through the encore, but the track just ends midway through the main set.

I guess that's better than losing all of it. I've learned my lesson...don't unplug the power cable. Kind of a bummer, but I guess it's to be expected with a new piece of equipment.

+T back to you!

MIKE B
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Offline jtessier

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #27 on: December 15, 2005, 04:18:52 PM »
Quote
I guess that's better than losing all of it. I've learned my lesson...don't unplug the power cable. Kind of a bummer, but I guess it's to be expected with a new piece of equipment.

I've removed and added power many times without having the Microtrack stop and/or lose recordings. This alone is not the trigger for this problem.  However, IF you have auto-off enabled and the auto off timeout gets reached in earlier versions of the firmware, the Microtrack goes to a kind of screen saver screen with a large (nearly full screen) battery icon on it if it's receiving external power even while recording.  If you were to remove power while this icon is showing, yes the Microtrack does seem to immediately power off. Even in the middle of recordings. To prevent this first wake the Microtrack back up by pressing once quickly on the power button. You could press the nav wheel thing instead but then you risk accidentally stopping or pausing your recording. Version 1.2.0 does not seem to have this issue while recording.

J.T.

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #28 on: May 12, 2010, 07:31:26 PM »
This thread has been very useful. I've had freezing/lost/0 byte files for years since I got my 24/96- they replaced the unit and problem remains. Has anyone narrowed down the parameters that may or may not cause it? I seem to have it occur more at .wav file settings as opposed to .mp3- but battery or AC makes no diff. Anyway was able to recover 9mins of a set and though is only a fraction is still meaningful. Thanks everyone for your time and effort. I think this year will be time for a new recorder.

Offline mrfang

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #29 on: June 23, 2010, 01:50:19 PM »
I wish I had seen this thread two years ago when I lost a recording of a NIN show that no one else covered!

This did save my Tool recording from last night, so thanks to everyone who posted useful info here.

I bought a Microtrack II to replace my Microtrack 24/96, but it looks like the same bugs are common to both.  Beyond the basic problem of files not always being saved when the unit runs out of power, I've had both models say that the media is full when it isn't, and have had both crash during some recordings that are over an hour.

I'll be buying a new CF card and hoping that some of these issues were related to the media and not always the MT.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2010, 01:52:37 PM by mrfang »

Offline dallman

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Re: MicroTrack Problem: 0 byte file
« Reply #30 on: June 24, 2010, 01:43:00 AM »
This thread has been very useful. I've had freezing/lost/0 byte files for years since I got my 24/96- they replaced the unit and problem remains. Has anyone narrowed down the parameters that may or may not cause it? I seem to have it occur more at .wav file settings as opposed to .mp3- but battery or AC makes no diff. Anyway was able to recover 9mins of a set and though is only a fraction is still meaningful. Thanks everyone for your time and effort. I think this year will be time for a new recorder.

Make sure you have the latest firmware. It should solve the problem.
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