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Author Topic: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend  (Read 44354 times)

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Offline bdasilva

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #60 on: June 06, 2011, 02:54:35 PM »
Recording on the Tascam 680...  It works like a champ
Cad E300S set.. AT822  AKG C 414 B-XLS/ST  
Dorsey-Mod MK-012 w/ O, C, H and RED L/D Caps
Superlux S502 ORTF   LSD2
Silverpath  Cables> 
Tascam DR-680MKii    DR- 680 (X2)   Tascam DR-40     Sound Devices USBPre    SONY  PMD-M10   Zoom F8

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Offline ashevillain

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #61 on: June 10, 2011, 07:05:25 PM »
Can someone help me out for a second? I'm still trying to wrap my head around this technique. I've got a show that I'm working on where I recorded 4 channel SBD/AUD. I've duplicated the SBD tracks in Audition so I effectively have 6 channels that I'm looking at right now. I think I only want to use this technique on the SBD channels and just let the AUD be there a couple dB down for the ambience factor (the SBD mix was pretty good). The band was sort of an Indian fusion band so there are traditional elements like sitar and tablas and other percussion...but there are also electric guitars, bass and keys/samples at some points. A lot of the songs begin with just the sitar and percussion at relatively low levels and then work there way up into a frenzy. So there are very quiet parts and very loud parts.

I think what I'm going for with the compression is during the quiet parts I want the compressed track to be higher levels than the original and during the loud parts I want the original uncompressed track to be higher. Overall so the highest levels aren't touched but the lowest levels are brought up a bit? Also I think I saw this in a previous post but should I also be limiting the compressed track? (basically so the loudest parts of the compressed track are kept away from the loudest parts of the original?) Does this make sense?

I can tell as I'm fiddling around that I'm able to make this sound better than, say, the raw untouched matrix would sound but I want it to sound the best that it possibly can!
« Last Edit: June 10, 2011, 07:09:07 PM by ashevillain »

Offline bdasilva

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #62 on: June 13, 2011, 04:01:03 PM »
 Put  one of these tracks into the multitrack side straight up.  on the other I use "hard limiting process"  I boost the input 13 to 15 db  and then "limit max amplitude" to -1 and then move this on to the multitrack side. 
Cad E300S set.. AT822  AKG C 414 B-XLS/ST  
Dorsey-Mod MK-012 w/ O, C, H and RED L/D Caps
Superlux S502 ORTF   LSD2
Silverpath  Cables> 
Tascam DR-680MKii    DR- 680 (X2)   Tascam DR-40     Sound Devices USBPre    SONY  PMD-M10   Zoom F8

"Buy a Taper a Drink... Prime the Pumps of live Music"


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Online Gutbucket

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #63 on: June 13, 2011, 05:07:34 PM »
I think I only want to use this technique on the SBD channels and just let the AUD be there a couple dB down for the ambience factor (the SBD mix was pretty good).

I suggest mixing the AUD and SBD to taste first, then applying parallel compression to that stereo mix to bring up the details and softer parts.  Doing it that way keeps the process simple and also makes it much easier to hear what the parallel compression is doing to the final sound.  It's often the best aproach regardless.

Of course it's possible to process only the SBD or only the AUD, but mentally juggling what effect processing one or the other alone before combining them will have is not as obvious as one may imagine.  If you have the time and inclination, try it all three ways and make 3 mixes to compare: 1) EQ each source and mix 1st, then play with applying parallel comp to the resulting mix; 2) EQ each and parallel comp only the SBD before mixing the sources; 3) EQ each and parallel comp only the AUD, then mix.  The difference between them may not be what you expect.

Actually if using standard compression on one of the two sources, and not compressing the other, you end up with a form of parallel compression on the end product once mixed.  By performing parallel compression on just one source before mixing you effectively parallel your parallel compression.  In otherwords, the relationship between things get complicated.  It' might sound fine, but it gets harder to draw clear conclusions about why it does and exactly what is going on.

Quote
I think what I'm going for with the compression is during the quiet parts I want the compressed track to be higher levels than the original and during the loud parts I want the original uncompressed track to be higher. Overall so the highest levels aren't touched but the lowest levels are brought up a bit?

This is exactly what parallel compression applied to the stereo mix does.

Quote
Also I think I saw this in a previous post but should I also be limiting the compressed track?

Parallel compression is 'bottom up' and does nothing to the peaks of the uncompressed paralleled material.  That's the whole point really.  You may want to control the peaks of the final mix, or the components making up that mix, but that is a seperate issue. 

What bdasilva is doing might be more accurately called 'parallel limiting'.  Its attractive since he has extra tracks available on the recorder that would otherwise go unused.  By doing that he eliminates the work in the DAW of setting up the compressor on the paralleled tracks, at the expense of flexibility in dialing in the compression characteristics.  Because the compression applied with the parallel technique needs to be pretty heavy to be effective, and because the technique does a pretty good job of obscuring the compression artifacts of standard compression in general, pushing the limiter on the recorder hard on those extra tracks is an effective way to do this 'quick and dirty' in the field.
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<< (note: This is a 1st draft, now several years old and in need of revision!  Stay tuned)

Offline ashevillain

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #64 on: June 13, 2011, 05:31:34 PM »
^Thanks

Offline bdasilva

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #65 on: June 14, 2011, 11:29:12 PM »
I guess what i do could be called Parallel Limiting but I've only done it on the fly once (with great results)  I use this technique all time in my DAW during post using Hard limiting instead of compression... I have done both... compared them side by side and I like my method (and results)  better.
Cad E300S set.. AT822  AKG C 414 B-XLS/ST  
Dorsey-Mod MK-012 w/ O, C, H and RED L/D Caps
Superlux S502 ORTF   LSD2
Silverpath  Cables> 
Tascam DR-680MKii    DR- 680 (X2)   Tascam DR-40     Sound Devices USBPre    SONY  PMD-M10   Zoom F8

"Buy a Taper a Drink... Prime the Pumps of live Music"


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Offline Sloan Simpson

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #66 on: July 15, 2011, 03:05:33 AM »
Have made a couple of my recent recordings better with this technique this week, very happy with it!

Offline bdasilva

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #67 on: September 14, 2011, 03:36:21 PM »
To the top....    This is an important thread...
Cad E300S set.. AT822  AKG C 414 B-XLS/ST  
Dorsey-Mod MK-012 w/ O, C, H and RED L/D Caps
Superlux S502 ORTF   LSD2
Silverpath  Cables> 
Tascam DR-680MKii    DR- 680 (X2)   Tascam DR-40     Sound Devices USBPre    SONY  PMD-M10   Zoom F8

"Buy a Taper a Drink... Prime the Pumps of live Music"


               On the "music" side of the "Music Business"

Online Gutbucket

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #68 on: September 14, 2011, 08:34:19 PM »
I've been really digging this simple little VST compressor recently, just used normally & not paralleled.  My editing computer with DAW software is down and I've been using this for playback in Foobar with a VST wrapper on a work laptop I have at home.  Very paralley sounding in bringing up details, clarity and a subtle shimery air in the 'clear mode' with conservative settings around those shown below.  Simple enough interface and one of the eaiser comps to get a good sound of the ones I've messed around with.  The only thing that slighly concerns me is that subtle settings like those shown here seem to make most every live recording I put through it sound better, which sets off alarm bells in the moderating, skeptical part of my brain.
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<< (note: This is a 1st draft, now several years old and in need of revision!  Stay tuned)

Offline Sloan Simpson

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #69 on: November 12, 2011, 02:50:26 PM »
I was using this technique on a show this morning and got a noticeable amount of PA hiss between songs. Any idea what I should do differently to avoid making that so prominent?

Offline page

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #70 on: November 12, 2011, 05:39:13 PM »
The only thing that slighly concerns me is that subtle settings like those shown here seem to make most every live recording I put through it sound better, which sets off alarm bells in the moderating, skeptical part of my brain.

That's a trademark sign of audio crack right there. Starts out nice but you get addicted to it.

I can't say much though, I get the same sensation from Ozone. Use a little bit all the time (in various areas or conservative settings) and everything sounds wonderful compared to before, but crank on something and it can turn to ass quickly. I actually got to the point where I looked for an mp3/ogg/flac playback program for osx that would do VST bridging so I could insert Ozone into everything I was listening to (for pleasure)...  :-X
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"Nostalgia ain't what it used to be." - Jim Williams

Offline ScoobieKW

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #71 on: November 12, 2011, 06:14:27 PM »
Read this thread, started trying NY Compression. My 2011-10-31 New Monsoon show got the treatment, http://www.archive.org/details/nm2011-10-31.scoobiesnax.flac16.

What do ya think?

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Offline capnhook

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #72 on: November 12, 2011, 06:36:32 PM »
The only thing that slighly concerns me is that subtle settings like those shown here seem to make most every live recording I put through it sound better, which sets off alarm bells in the moderating, skeptical part of my brain.

That's a trademark sign of audio crack right there. Starts out nice but you get addicted to it.

I can't say much though, I get the same sensation from Ozone.

A parallel thought....I guess I do the same thing somewhere else.  I send my PC analog out to my audio rack, and the first thing it goes through (besides a Behringer HD400 2-Channel Hum Destroyer to break the ground loop) is a BBE Sonic Maximizer......

I see there is a VST plug-in for that, too...........M U S T   M O D E R A T E   :bigsmile:
Proud member of the reality-based community

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"Don't ever take an all or nothing attitude when it comes to making a difference
and being beautiful and making the world a beautiful place through your actions.
Every little bit is registered.  Every little bit.  So be as beautiful as you can as often as you can"

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #73 on: November 12, 2011, 11:52:57 PM »
A parallel thought....I guess I do the same thing somewhere else.  I send my PC analog out to my audio rack, and the first thing it goes through (besides a Behringer HD400 2-Channel Hum Destroyer to break the ground loop) is a BBE Sonic Maximizer......

I see there is a VST plug-in for that, too...........M U S T   M O D E R A T E   :bigsmile:

you seriously need a DAC.  :o
"This is a common practice we have on the bus; debating facts that we could easily find through printed material. It's like, how far is it today? I think it's four hours, and someone else comes in at 11 hours, and well, then we'll... just... talk about it..." - Jeb Puryear

"Nostalgia ain't what it used to be." - Jim Williams

Offline capnhook

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #74 on: November 13, 2011, 02:05:00 AM »
A parallel thought....I guess I do the same thing somewhere else.  I send my PC analog out to my audio rack, and the first thing it goes through (besides a Behringer HD400 2-Channel Hum Destroyer to break the ground loop) is a BBE Sonic Maximizer......

I see there is a VST plug-in for that, too...........M U S T   M O D E R A T E   :bigsmile:

you seriously need a DAC.  :o

Haven't found one that i like the sound of   ;D :P

/hijack off
Proud member of the reality-based community

BSCS-L->JB-mod [NAK CM-300 (CP-3) and/or (CP-1)]->LSD2->CA CAFS-Omni->Sony ECM-907**Apogee MiniMe Rev. C->CA Ugly II->**Edirol OCM R-44->Tascam DR-22WL->Sony TCD-D8


"Don't ever take an all or nothing attitude when it comes to making a difference
and being beautiful and making the world a beautiful place through your actions.
Every little bit is registered.  Every little bit.  So be as beautiful as you can as often as you can"

"It'll never be over, 'till we learn."
 
"My dream is to get a bus and get the band and just go coast to coast. Just about everything else except music, is anti-musical.  That's it.  Music's the thing." - Jeb Puryear

 

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