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Author Topic: what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?  (Read 26142 times)

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Offline robertmode

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what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?
« on: January 17, 2012, 06:51:50 AM »
Hello

who can give his viewpoint and experience?

Yours sincerely.
Robert
« Last Edit: January 17, 2012, 06:53:49 AM by robertmode »

Offline vanark

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Re: what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2012, 08:22:46 AM »
The devil is in the details...  As in, if you provide even a little, you might get better answers.  What equipment is the jack used with?  What issues are you having?  Do you have a sample?

In a very general sense, cheap cables tend to be unshielded which could lead to unwanted interference from other devices, such as cell phones.  I've not had the problem, but it has been reported.
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Offline Gutbucket

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Re: what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2012, 10:34:45 AM »
#1 is a noisy/intermittant connection due to dirt/contamination in the jack or on the plug.  Clean well with isopropyl alcohol, or a product like Deoxit.
#2 is a noisy/intermittant connection due to a mechanical problem, such as a broken solder joint or conductor.  Resolder it or replace the connector. 

Be careful to keep your plugs and jacks clean and to reduce the mechanical stress on them by gaff taping the connection down and using small right angle plugs where possible instead of straight plugs that stick out like a lever.
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Offline robertmode

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Re: what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2012, 01:26:48 PM »
Hello,
Thanks for your help!
I wrote this topic  in a very general sense.

Yours sincerely.
Robert

Offline Church-Audio

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Re: what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2012, 02:45:24 PM »
Cheap mini jacks have crap coatings on them that dont conduct signals very well. The best mini jacks in the world are made by switchcraft and Neutrik.
Also the cable used in cheap patch cables can be crap high in capacitance and poor shielding.

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Offline hi and lo

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Re: what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?
« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2012, 11:12:15 PM »
Since you asked in a general sense, I'll gladly reinforce something I and others have echoed on this board multiple times. The 3.5mm stereo mini connector is quite possible the single worst option for 'what we do.' Anytime you are recording in the field, you should opt to use locking type connectors from high quality, reliable manufacturers. It's all to easy to accidentally unplug a mini jack and they are, in general, more prone to cable strain relief problems and developing shorts over time.

Chris will probably disagree with me, which is fine, but personally I avoid these connectors at all costs. Quality mini xlr connectors can be had at marginally higher cost and are a much better option when their larger size is permitted. And of course... if you have to use a mini jack, do use a high a quality neutrik or switchcraft and Mr. Church recommends.

Offline TimeBandit

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Re: what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?
« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2012, 12:44:19 PM »
cheapo connectors or just the straight ones will disconnect easy. but the neutrik / switchcraft ones (which Chris usually uses) fit really tight and aren't that easy to remove (+ in combination with 90degree angled connector).

no matter locking connectors will be the best, but the difference between those cheapo minijack and some really good ones real matters.
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Re: what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?
« Reply #7 on: January 18, 2012, 01:41:16 PM »
Agreed on the preference for mini-XLR where possible, partly the more substantial mechanical conection, partly the locking feature (the ability to have multi-pins for more conductors is another an advantage for some applications).

But mostly a reminder to gaff tape your mini TRS plugs and connections, even the good quality ones!  It's cheap, effective insurance!
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Offline Church-Audio

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Re: what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?
« Reply #8 on: January 18, 2012, 01:48:36 PM »
Agreed on the preference for mini-XLR where possible, partly the more substantial mechanical conection, partly the locking feature (the ability to have multi-pins for more conductors is another an advantage for some applications).

But mostly a reminder to gaff tape your mini TRS plugs and connections, even the good quality ones!  It's cheap, effective insurance!
No Gaff on my gear please. Its not a good idea to tape down a connection better to have a proper case or put it in a location where the cable will not get unplugged, then to gaff it.
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Offline hi and lo

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Re: what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?
« Reply #9 on: January 18, 2012, 02:12:56 PM »
Agreed on the preference for mini-XLR where possible, partly the more substantial mechanical conection, partly the locking feature (the ability to have multi-pins for more conductors is another an advantage for some applications).

But mostly a reminder to gaff tape your mini TRS plugs and connections, even the good quality ones!  It's cheap, effective insurance!
No Gaff on my gear please. Its not a good idea to tape down a connection better to have a proper case or put it in a location where the cable will not get unplugged, then to gaff it.

???

As long as the gaff tape isn't directly on the connector which would leave residue, I don't see why this isn't sound advice. Velcro is better, but I recommend you always gaff tape your stereo mini plug when in the field when possible. It's easy to do and shouldn't put any undue stress on the connector if done correctly.

Offline Church-Audio

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Re: what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?
« Reply #10 on: January 19, 2012, 07:04:11 AM »
Agreed on the preference for mini-XLR where possible, partly the more substantial mechanical conection, partly the locking feature (the ability to have multi-pins for more conductors is another an advantage for some applications).

But mostly a reminder to gaff tape your mini TRS plugs and connections, even the good quality ones!  It's cheap, effective insurance!
No Gaff on my gear please. Its not a good idea to tape down a connection better to have a proper case or put it in a location where the cable will not get unplugged, then to gaff it.

???

As long as the gaff tape isn't directly on the connector which would leave residue, I don't see why this isn't sound advice. Velcro is better, but I recommend you always gaff tape your stereo mini plug when in the field when possible. It's easy to do and shouldn't put any undue stress on the connector if done correctly.
I dont feel like arguing with you after being a sound engineer for over 20 years now I know from personal experience that using gaff tape on cables ruins them with that sticky residue that it leaves on the cable I have actually seen some gaff tape destroy cables when used in high heat or in the sun for extended periods of time. But more than that using gaff tape on a cable can actually cause strain on the connector and straight relief of the cable it self causing it to fail. I personally think if you must use something get a strip of Velcro and use that. Its removable with no residue.


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Offline Hypnocracy

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Re: what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?
« Reply #11 on: January 19, 2012, 07:43:53 AM »
I've been told the money I spent for mini-XLR's on my Church Preamp was money wasted...


I'll think back to this thread and laugh if I ever hear that again...
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Re: what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?
« Reply #12 on: January 19, 2012, 09:25:32 AM »
I've been taping for about three years now. Every tape I've made with my gear has used 3.5mm mini-plug at every connection. I had one issue where I didn't fully engage the plug (idiot taper error), but have never had anything become unplugged while taping.

I have had two issues with RF interference. One of these times I was taping on a college campus in front of the building that contained their radio station. I picked up their signal on one source ("Hey, where did that banjo come from?") I was running two rigs that day, all with mini-jack plugs (CA-14 c&o, CA-BB, CA-9100). The patch cable used on the affected source was thrown out and haven't had an issue since. The other source was unaffected. The other time I had another taper beside me using XLR cables and he got hit also.

I've also used a 20' Radio Shack extension cable several times from the 9100 to the Sony PCM D50 with no issues. I did spring for the right angle Neutrik plugs on my CA-14s and would probably only buy patch cables made that way from now on. The patch cables I use to go from the CA-9100/CA-BB to the recorders now are from Radio Shack. Some of the alarmists here on taperssection will tell you I'm playing with fire and have gotten lucky on the 200+ quality (IMO) recordings I've made. Whatever.

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Offline Church-Audio

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Re: what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?
« Reply #13 on: January 19, 2012, 09:26:22 AM »
I've been told the money I spent for mini-XLR's on my Church Preamp was money wasted...


I'll think back to this thread and laugh if I ever hear that again...
I dont get it? I never said buying mini xlr connectors was a waste of money. I just said for most people 3.5 mm connectors used on my preamps and lots of other consumer products also work just fine as long as you take care not to unplug them.... I have two options for locking connectors now on all of my preamps. I dont consider them a waste of money. But for most people they get along just fine with 3.5 mm connectors.
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Offline hi and lo

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Re: what problems with cheap mini jack cable on a recording?
« Reply #14 on: January 19, 2012, 10:11:34 AM »
Agreed on the preference for mini-XLR where possible, partly the more substantial mechanical conection, partly the locking feature (the ability to have multi-pins for more conductors is another an advantage for some applications).

But mostly a reminder to gaff tape your mini TRS plugs and connections, even the good quality ones!  It's cheap, effective insurance!
No Gaff on my gear please. Its not a good idea to tape down a connection better to have a proper case or put it in a location where the cable will not get unplugged, then to gaff it.

???

As long as the gaff tape isn't directly on the connector which would leave residue, I don't see why this isn't sound advice. Velcro is better, but I recommend you always gaff tape your stereo mini plug when in the field when possible. It's easy to do and shouldn't put any undue stress on the connector if done correctly.
I dont feel like arguing with you after being a sound engineer for over 20 years now I know from personal experience that using gaff tape on cables ruins them with that sticky residue that it leaves on the cable I have actually seen some gaff tape destroy cables when used in high heat or in the sun for extended periods of time. But more than that using gaff tape on a cable can actually cause strain on the connector and straight relief of the cable it self causing it to fail. I personally think if you must use something get a strip of Velcro and use that. Its removable with no residue.

Arguing?

Good tape should leave little-to-no residue and a proper tape job shouldn't put unnecessary stress on a connector, it should do the opposite and prevent stress.

Sound engineering experience is quite frequently not applicable to our hobby. We are in the field running hand-held recordings in the pockets of our jeans. It's far more important to ensure an accident won't occur that worry about long-term damage to what is, generally, very inexpensive audio equipment.


 

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