Topic: ua5 matrix?

[caymanreview]

so i just bought a warm/digi mod ua5 that i hope to use with a picturebook very soon, but with my m1 untill it sells

i will be recording a little annual thing here locally, i was contacted by thier management to record them, and am being paid for all my time...

i will be running akg 391s > wmod ua5 > m1 or hopefully a sony vaio picturebook by then

i will also have access to the sbd signal also, was wondering about makin a sbd/aud matrix with the ua5 using the rca ins for the sbd

i will be able to set my gear up as close as i want, i will basically be on thier staff... i think the distance where you need a delay is something like 35ft? i could be wrong

how would having a 20-25ft rca coming from the board, all the way to me? would that add any kind of a delay?

is this possible?

[joeshambro]

Here's how I do things when I'm doing a pro recording of a band and they're on a real hardcore budget...

Take your 391's and put them on either side of the stage facing the crowd.  They'll pick up the crowd as well as some ambient noise from the room.  Little to no delay compared to the stage mics.

Plug them into the stage snake going back to the board.  Back at the soundboard, take the outputs from those snake channels into the mic ins on the UA5.  Run RCA's to the line in from the board.  Get the proper mix, and you're all set.

Ideally if you had access to the equipment, you could either 1) use a stereo delay to add just a touch of delay to the board feed to match to the aud mics on stage, or 2) use a limiter on the audience mics, set up in a way that when the level from the soundboard feed picks up, the mics are ducked out, and when the band quiets down, the aud mics fade up.

I'd be more than happy to post some samples from this technique...

Also, for reference, the audio delay is 1ms per foot every foot you go back from the audio source.

Let me know if I can be of any more help!

[caymanreview]

what if i ran them on the stage, i only have one stand, what kind of a stereo pattern would i use to get a good crowd mix? i can do everything else... great post...

[caymanreview]

how can i adjust the mix. that possible on the ua5?

i do have a 8 channel behringer eurorack mixer... has phantom power but no delay....

would that be a better solution to mix the signals and adjust the levels before it goes in the ua5?

[joeshambro]

You could run the mics into the Behringer but I'd reason to think the UA5's pres are much higher quality,  no need to.  The only reason I'd ever think of doing that is to roll off the bass from the stage rumble and bump the mids just a bit to bring some punch into the crowd mix.

What you COULD do -- and this is just a suggestion, but.. depending on the setup of the bands (and the willingness of the sound engineer doing the mix) take individual outs of channels that arent so hot in the mix (guitars usually, sometimes bass)...  look for the insert channels on the board, take your regular TRS 1/4th cable, and insert it just until it clicks once, not twice.  Then plug the other end in, and there you have a channel to add to the mix coming off the board to beef it up a bit in the behringer.  You can also buy a more expensive insert splitter, they have them at Guitar Center for about $3 a piece.  

Just remember, don't get fancy and pan shit around where it isn't in the original mix, or else you open up to phase issues, etc.

You can asjust the mix on the UA5 by the little level dial on the back end.  

http://webpages.charter.net/jshambro/promo-t04.mp3

I was in complete control of the FOH mix so that explains why it works out on tape so well    Two mics on either side of the stage facing crowd,  stage mix (Bass DI, acoustic guitar mic'ed with the new Taylor XPression System, vocals Neumann KMS105, crowd Oktava MC012) and then into a UA5 into a laptop, with a firewire drive attached.

Toured with that setup in one config or another for three months.    Made it easy to configure it for different rooms, etc... because I essentially had production manager duties on that tour, it made it easy to make a very HQ recording while doing FOH, monitors, sometimes lights, and supervising the local crew setting up for us and whatever headliner we were with, etc...

[joeshambro]

Oh, and to answer your question -- I'd put the crowd mics dead center of the stage, probably ORTF or maybe even NOS/DIN if it's a large outdoor kinda thing.... but definately the stage mics are a better idea.

If you need to borrow some stage stands/accessories, let me know, you're local and more than welcome whatever you need.

[caymanreview]

wow, that would be great. i only have the one stand, its a bogen.manfrotto 3078 13 footer. big and bulky...

some stands to split my 391s would be great. have any longer xlrs? i only have 15footers...

this seems like its going to turn out really well. im getting excited, even though, there is only going to be one band there that i like at all. just being out there taping makes me happy. and getting paid for my time, just an added bonus. im sure il think of other things and post again

[joeshambro]

Yeah, my stage stands are all yours pending the date's free...

I have some 15's and some 20's, but to get to the stage snake you wont need much more than that at all.

[caymanreview]

august 16th

i have at least one 15' set, so i should be ok i guess

i still ahve more info to get, but i think everythig will work out

my warm/digi mod went out yesterday... priority so i shoudl get it in 2 days or so

[DaryanLenz]

Is there a decent mixer out there that has delay effects?  I want to pick one up to start doing PAID location recordings.  Any input?

Daryan

[dklein]

Hey Joeshambro,

I don't know if anyone else noticed but the sample you put up at http://webpages.charter.net/jshambro/promo-t04.mp3 has the left and right channels out of phase.  It actually sounds quite good if you invert one of the channels.  Now quit wasting all that good equipment!

david

[joeshambro]

Yeah, actually, I was going to mention the phase...  I threw that sample up from a rough copy of a demo I was mixing, and I intentionally had the phase flipped... I forgot to redo it for the sample  

If anyone would like to hear a final mastered show from the Broussard archive using the UA5 matrix, I'd be more than happy to BT one or send out some freebies.

[joeshambro]

Is there a decent mixer out there that has delay effects?  I want to pick one up to start doing PAID location recordings.  Any input?

Daryan

Daryan:

I wholeheartedly reccomend the TC Electronics D-Two delay.  Fully tappable input, it'll delay both channels of the board feed several MS, whatever you need...

I used one and there wasn't a room that didn't allow me to do what I needed just fine.  Sound quality is excellent.

You can pick one up for about $450 or less if you go the eBay route (maybe as low as $350),  b ut around $450 new sounds right.

Also, I tried a Line6 DL4 and it worked good, but not as good fidelity and ease of operation as the DTwo.

[sexymexi]

personally depending on their board they use, i'd go with running stage mics through their snake, to the board, mute them from the main mix, run and aux out with the mics levels, and the boards levels set how you want, that way, its easy all you do is leave you settings, and connect your deck..  i've done that with mackie 8 buss mixers, but it depends on what their running...  if they are running main mix effects you wont get them unless you run another effects mix into your aux out.  might sound kinda nutz sorry, but its been done, and sounds great by me, gettin the SBD clarity, with room ambiance sound, i love it... go for it, try all kinds of ways... play with it, and have a good time...

peace

[rabhan]

dk, that avatar is killer! waaaaaaaay trippy!