Topic: OPPO 980 supports DSD?

[Sanjay]

http://www.oppodigital.com/dv980h/default.asp

I noticed it supports DSD playback through HDMI.

Does this mean we could play back raw DSD to our stereos?

If so I'm ordering one of these instead of the 970.

[audBall]

found this...

http://www.sa-cd.net/showthread/22648//y?page=first

[Nick's Picks]

cool and all...but what do you send it to?  I have not seen many DSD dacs around, and the ones that I have seen do not have HDMI inputs.
perhaps we will see some.

even still...
how does one get the DSD *into* the transport to begin with?

[Nick's Picks]

personally...
I do believe that DSD/WSD will be released from the cage at some point.  then we'll all be stylin' w/our masters.  I've me a good stack of them now.

one thought...
I was thinking about posting to RAP about my masters, and offering to send one off to a studio for them to tinker with...just for shits and giggles.  might actually spin me a SACD of the show...if I'm lucky.
there are plenty of studios who have that ability (just takes $$)...so we'll see.

[RebelRebel]

personally...
I do believe that DSD/WSD will be released from the cage at some point.  then we'll all be stylin' w/our masters.  I've me a good stack of them now.

one thought...
I was thinking about posting to RAP about my masters, and offering to send one off to a studio for them to tinker with...just for shits and giggles.  might actually spin me a SACD of the show...if I'm lucky.
there are plenty of studios who have that ability (just takes $$)...so we'll see.

Bruce. A. Brown , puget sound studios...

Very nice fella. He is a man of the people. 

[macdaddy]

cool and all...but what do you send it to?

you send it to a receiver that accepts hdmi. sunfire has one of these that i like alot, and there are a few other makes models that i have seen. for example, i would use it in the living room with the directv and ps3, which also output via hdmi...  the receiver deals with it - both the audio and the video - and passes the appropriate signals along, losslessly, in the digital realm (unless you want processing done by the receiver).

 

[Nick's Picks]

right...

lots of unanswered questions here, and i'm still certain this doesnt' help us at all.

1. it sends a DSD signal...is that for real?  is it not 24/88 "downsampled" to PCM ?
2. *if* if did send the DSD protocol, show me any receiver that can accpet and deal with that signal?  just becaues it has HDMI doesn't mean it can read whats being sent.
PCM, im' sure.

[macdaddy]

right...

lots of unanswered questions here, and i'm still certain this doesnt' help us at all.

1. it sends a DSD signal...is that for real?  is it not 24/88 "downsampled" to PCM ?
2. *if* if did send the DSD protocol, show me any receiver that can accpet and deal with that signal?  just becaues it has HDMI doesn't mean it can read whats being sent.
PCM, im' sure.

i dont know - i am pretty sure you get dsd out, and that receivers can (or at least will be able to) handle the signal properly. the ps3 (which is made by sony, and IS billed as a sacd player) does this, too - analog out for two channel, and hdmi out for multichannel. havent done anything with the multichannel yet ('cos i dont have the capability yet), but the two channel out of the analogs is great.

[Nick's Picks]

look at any "real" SACD player.
there are no multi-channel outputs that are digital.  nada.

[macdaddy]

look at any "real" SACD player.
there are no multi-channel outputs that are digital.  nada.

agreed - you connect via the analog outputs, and the chip onboard the player does the d>a step...

the receivers i am reading about would have a flow like the one shown below... the dsd is taken to the receiver, and the receiver has the dsd dac chip inside it. this is the only way it would seem to really work, otherwise you are throwing pcm in the mix (i agree with you there). but from what i have read, this former signal path is what sony is thinking when having only the hdmi output on the ps3, which along with being the bluray player and game console, is also a fully-spec'd sacd player.



(thiis flowchart is from a chip manufacturer that touts the thing as handling the sacd spec; more info here)

[Nick's Picks]

again, it comes down to the DSD capable DAC.
which...doesn't exist right now outside of very high end gear.  the lowest of which that I can think of is the Sony STR-DA7100ES receiver and matching XA9100ES SACD player.
and they use a proprietary firewire type I/O for that transmission.

the others, EMM, dCS use something else entirely I believe (but am not sure) as their I/O.

so, who is building A/V recievers that can handle DSD outside of the$ 5k Sony ?

[macdaddy]

not too many. hit this link and scroll down, the black pioneer unit does it, i think. if you scroll further down, there is a sony unit that accepts dsd via hdmi, too...

and i have read that the next sunfire will, as well...

[Jammin72]

Nick... do a quick search for "iLink SACD", if I remember correctly there were also some, Denon, Yamaha, and  Pioneer Elite models that received DSD over firewire.

Not that it helps much in the "how do we play our shows" discussion but the gear to receive the signal is out there.  HDMI from 1.2 on does have the capacity to send/receive DSD signals, once again I believe that Denon and NAD are licensed to make this happen but I'm not sure if it's out in the public yet as far as pres, integrateds and receivers go.  The EMM Labs gear uses the SDIF-3 interface which is a beast all it's own.

[RebelRebel]

  The EMM Labs gear uses the SDIF-3 interface which is a beast all it's own.

the 5 digit price tag from EMM, DCS, etc... is beast enough for me.

[Nick's Picks]

thats right...I guess I knew about the iLink.
now, what SACD decks have that output ?  corresponding model players from the respective companies ?
ala sony?

[Nick's Picks]

you can pick up an emm dcc6 for under $4k easily enough in the used market.
(fwiw).

[RebelRebel]

Yeah, although I dont see SACD being too much of a force in the future. I doubt I will be putting any more money into recording or listening to it. Professor Johnson(reference recordings) seems to think that Blue Ray and HD DVD hold promise for higher resolution Audio, so I will probably put my focus/energy there. SACD is too much of a Pain in the Ass to deal with. My Mytek DAC upsamples everything to 24/192(when superlock is enabled) regardless of the source, and I believe that it sounds as good or better as the same recordings in SACD format. I dont like the weird HF anomalies in DSD either.

you can pick up an emm dcc6 for under $4k easily enough in the used market.
(fwiw).

[Jammin72]

  The EMM Labs gear uses the SDIF-3 interface which is a beast all it's own.

the 5 digit price tag from EMM, DCS, etc... is beast enough for me.

Have you laid ears on one though...  The DCC2 does the most amazing thing to PCM I've ever heard.  Truly holographic sound.  If I had that kind of cash I would be an owner.

[RebelRebel]

I have heard both the DCS and Meitner converters(one of the guys who took me under wing to teach me about recording engineering had every thing a body could dream of)the DCS was actually a  Player with their DAC built in). Kavi Alexander(owner/engineer of Waterlily Acoustics) actually has a pair of the meitner DAC/ADCs for sale for dirt cheap, as well as a Sony Sonoma System....If you are interested in them(or if anyone else is) shoot me a pm.

The most pristine , lifelike, holographic sound I have ever heard came from the Pacific Microsonics Model 1..but that is some serious dough too.

  The EMM Labs gear uses the SDIF-3 interface which is a beast all it's own.

the 5 digit price tag from EMM, DCS, etc... is beast enough for me.

Have you laid ears on one though...  The DCC2 does the most amazing thing to PCM I've ever heard.  Truly holographic sound.  If I had that kind of cash I would be an owner.

[Jammin72]

I have heard both the DCS and Meitner converters(one of the guys who took me under wing to teach me about recording engineering had every thing a body could dream of)the DCS was actually a  Player with their DAC built in). Kavi Alexander(owner/engineer of Waterlily Acoustics) actually has a pair of the meitner DAC/ADCs for sale for dirt cheap, as well as a Sony Sonoma System....If you are interested in them(or if anyone else is) shoot me a pm.

The most pristine , lifelike, holographic sound I have ever heard came from the Pacific Microsonics Model 1..but that is some serious dough too.

Then it sounds like I have a new listening goal for the future!

[RebelRebel]

the new reference recordings discs(or newer I should say, they went belly up for a while) use the Pacific Microsonics system. The lead(and only??) sound engineer at that label, "prof" johnson, designed those converters.

I have heard both the DCS and Meitner converters(one of the guys who took me under wing to teach me about recording engineering had every thing a body could dream of)the DCS was actually a  Player with their DAC built in). Kavi Alexander(owner/engineer of Waterlily Acoustics) actually has a pair of the meitner DAC/ADCs for sale for dirt cheap, as well as a Sony Sonoma System....If you are interested in them(or if anyone else is) shoot me a pm.

The most pristine , lifelike, holographic sound I have ever heard came from the Pacific Microsonics Model 1..but that is some serious dough too.

Then it sounds like I have a new listening goal for the future!

[RebelRebel]

Just read about a possible reciever...The Yamaha RX-V2700 processes DSD signals through its HDMI input. There are possible operating modes..1.)"purist mode"The virgin signal( bypassing all DSP processing) is passed to a TI DSD 1791 DAC(that chip has a DSD passthrough mode for converting the DSD Signal to a bipolar voltage) and  filtered in the analog domain. 2.) second mode -one of the DSP processors converts the DSD stream to PCM, allowing consumer to utilize the bass management, time delays, etc..




 

again, it comes down to the DSD capable DAC.
which...doesn't exist right now outside of very high end gear.  the lowest of which that I can think of is the Sony STR-DA7100ES receiver and matching XA9100ES SACD player.
and they use a proprietary firewire type I/O for that transmission.

the others, EMM, dCS use something else entirely I believe (but am not sure) as their I/O.

so, who is building A/V recievers that can handle DSD outside of the$ 5k Sony ?