Topic: James Randi Posts $1M Award On Speaker Cables

[newscane]

From Slashdot:
http://science.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/10/04/1354224

"James Randi offered US$ 1 million to anyone who can prove that a pair of $7,250 Pear Anjou speaker cables is any better than ordinary (and also overpriced) Monster Cables. Pointing out the absurd review by audiophile Dave Clark, who called the cables 'danceable,' Randi called it 'hilarious and preposterous.' He added that if the cables could do what their makers claimed, 'they would be paranormal.'"

The slashdotters are having a good time...
Side note: James Randi spoke to one of my classes in college, I think it was something in the school of communication (broadcasting major).

[carlbeck]

Give him my number & have him come over here. Anyone who does not believe there is a difference in the quality of cables has either not tried the experiment or has two corn muffins on the side of their head instead of ears.

[Nick's Picks]

"eh"...

I bet we'd both fail.
granted, I like to believe I can hear a difference.  In fact, I tell myself that its fact.
On the recording side, I can hear a difference.  On the playback side...i've only noticed a difference one time, and that was going from MIT term2's > Gregg Straley VR cables.

BUT..
I have never been in a double blind test.  or even a blind test where I had no clue what cable I was hearing.
I bet you could use the same cable in each test and get wildly different reviews between them.

Yea, I am a believer in cables.
but i dont kid myself.

[carlbeck]

When I went from the MIT's to the Satoris it was like someone turning a light switch on, John was there that night & agreed 100% Nick, maybe you need some better cables 

[Nick's Picks]

or maybe i've just had good cables all along.
;-)

[carlbeck]

Very very possible, didn't think of that.

[boojum]

I'll bet that Randi does not lose his money.  All this audio mumbo-jumbo fails one test: prove it.  And that is the reason "audiophiles" pooh-pooh the mainstay of all scientific growth: testing.  Double blind test are sinful to them because the deal in fact, not whimsy.  What other reason is there??  Wire is wire is wire.  It passes AC current between the amp and the speakers.  The fact that it is AC kind of knocks the directionality of speaker wire and interconnects into a cocked hat.  I am running 1,200 watts per channel so I use heavy wire.  Other than that there is nothing significant about it.  And had I spent US$7,200 for speaker cables you can damned sure I would hear a difference.  Just as the Emperor enjoyed his new clothes.   As usual, YMMV   

[carlbeck]

I will gladly take a blindfolded test anywhere at any time but there has to be a good set of cables involved for it to be valid. I hate to push this point for those of you who feel wire is just wire & it is used to just carry current only. I will suggest that you have never really heard a set of very nice cables? I am not saying it to sound high & mighty because I am not but I did do the test at my home with my system with someone else who was very familiar with my system at the time (who also owns my old speakers at this point) When I speak of good cables I don't just mean in cost, I mean a very well enginered set of cables with excellent geometry. I have heard & in fact owned a very nice pair of Acoustic Zen Satori shotgun cables, I reluctantly sold them from my last system because I could not justify keeping a $1000 retail set of speaker cables. I got $675 for my pair when I sold them & they were a steal at that price. I don't think it is all about how much you pay but really the quality of the design & materials. To compare a $200 set to a $300 set there will be no comparison but take those Satori's & compare them to a shotgun run of MIT terminators like we did & I can promise you there will be a difference. Is it all worth it in the end? I have no idea for you but for me at the time it sure was. I still use a very nice pair of Zu Cables for my speakers, they are very nice but not as nice as the Satori's. I also ALWAYS run a shotgun wire when the speakers can be bi-wired, it is probably the most important aspect of all IMO.

[Tim]

The only testing I ever did was between copper based cables and leegeddy's silver cables. They sound different, very different. Silver cables are much cleaner whereas coppers have a low end bloom. I know what I heard, it was obvious.

[boojum]

I will gladly take a blindfolded test anywhere at any time but there has to be a good set of cables involved for it to be valid.

Not a "blindfolded" test, a "doubler blind" test.  That may be why you are having trouble understanding the concept.  If you are that confident, take Randi's test.  That's what we are talking about.  Go take his test.  You have just put yourself out there as being willing so let the feet follow the words.

Yes, I have listened to excellent, high-priced cables.  I got to know the fellows in the audio shop quite well over a period of years.  And, on the QT, they told me Monster Cable is as good as any and to not waste my money on the exotic stuff.  And they were selling the high-priced stuff (Nakamichi, ReVox, B&W, KEF) and cables to match.  Later they were selling even higher-priced gear.  They had been to all the audio shows, set up audio shows, bought and sold high end gear for years, wired it, built it, and attended the SF Symphony and SF Ballet, so they knew what music is supposed to sound like.  Yup.  As usual, YMMV 

[Nick's Picks]

well...
we can take a $50 pair of "anit cables" and put them up against just about anything and see whats what.

very cheap cables.  obviously.
I consider my system revealing.  we'll see.

[cshepherd]

I bet $1,000,000 that James Randi's stereo sounds like doo-doo. 

Chris

[davepeck]

This is not Randi's first clash with audiophile reviewers who claim to hear differences between various pieces of exotic equipment. He promises a million dollars (which he has waiting in an account for them) if any can prove in double-blind scientific testing that their extraordinary claims are true. None have stepped up so far.

imo, the fact that no one has come forward to do the test speaks volumes.

[boojum]

It is one thing to talk the talk but a whole other thing to walk the walk.  Looks like talkers here. 

And, as the audiophiles are so damned sure of themselves I am sure they are all rushing over to claim their US$1,000,000.  If they are not they just demonstrated that all they are doing is blowing smoke.

[carlbeck]

Again, any of you are more than welcome to come to my house & do whatever test you like & see if I can tell a difference. I say my house because I am very familiar with my system. Please take me up on my offer, if I am wrong I will gladly admit it. I have no problem admitting fault but I have already done the test, you are mentioning what another store told you about gear you have but they may not have heard. Come over here & perform the test, tell me the results then. I have performed this test blind or not & there is an audible difference, until you do the same I don't feel you can comment.

Also, have you ever OWNED a set of high quality cables? I don't mean listened in a session or two, I mean owned & paid for with your hard earned money? Unless you have owned a set & swapped them out at will you really are only going of speculation of someone elses opinion. I can respect that you have a relationship with a retailer so you trust there opinion but quite frankly until you do the test yourself you can not pass judgement. Nick is one of my closest friends but he & I are on two totally separate worlds when it comes to audio & perception. Doesn't make him a bad guy or you but until you do the test yourself please do not pass judgement on someone else's claims. In my opinion, the original authors reward claim was ridiculous & I feel not based in actual fact or taken out of true context.

Finally I do feel that for $7250 those cables better make me dance & hover above the listening room but to say that all wire sounds the same is preposterous at best & really shows a short sightedness that I am uncomfortable with personally from my own experience. Regardless, if you don't believe it you don't have too but again, I think you should take the test yourself & see if it improves your system at all, if it does it is a win win, if it doesn't then you can resell or return your cables with no harm done. In the end it is all about improving your home system to better your enjoyment.