Topic: Schoeps CMR Rig - Tinybox/MK4/CMR- Sarah Mclachlan Samples from 3/12/2011

[johnw]

I emailed someone at schoeps a bit over a year ago about the discrepancy between the 2 published sensitivities and the explanation was that when the CMRs were prototyped, the sensitivity was the same so they published that information. After development, it was not possible to build them to have the same sensitivity as the CMC6, so the newer brochure was printed with the correct information. There is a 40% loss in sensitivity between the CMR and the CMC6, but the difference in actual use may be negligible depending on the application.

[Dkrogh]

Is there any comps between the CMR > little box/tinybox setup and the nbox or cmc bodies yet?

I'd be interested in hearing them as I'm sure others would be too if they haven't been done yet.

[darktrain]

Is there any comps between the CMR > little box/tinybox setup and the nbox or cmc bodies yet?

I'd be interested in hearing them as I'm sure others would be too if they haven't been done yet.

here are some shows i did recently and there is a elton john sample back in the thread a page or so done with the bb

http://www.archive.org/details/cj2010-03-19.10pm
http://www.archive.org/details/cj2010-03-19.7pm
http://www.archive.org/details/cj2010-03-23.flac
http://www.archive.org/details/cj2010-03-25.flac

[Dkrogh]

Is there any comps between the CMR > little box/tinybox setup and the nbox or cmc bodies yet?

I'd be interested in hearing them as I'm sure others would be too if they haven't been done yet.

here are some shows i did recently and there is a elton john sample back in the thread a page or so done with the bb

http://www.archive.org/details/cj2010-03-19.10pm
http://www.archive.org/details/cj2010-03-19.7pm
http://www.archive.org/details/cj2010-03-23.flac
http://www.archive.org/details/cj2010-03-25.flac

Thanks!

[DSatz]

I just went back and looked at my email correspondence with Schoeps, because this all rang a bell with me. In January, 2008 I noticed the same discrepancy and raised a question about it.

Apparently an internal misunderstanding had led to the release of some projected specifications, while my contact there (the engineer in charge of their publications) was apparently under the impression that he'd been given actual, measured results. (Those came only a little later.) It was a mistake, in other words. The specifications on the Web site now should be the correct ones. By that I mean the ones on the HTML Web pages themselves, not in any downloadable PDFs.

However, the sensitivity was never intended to be the same as that which you would get with a CMC 6-- amplifier. The email correspondence reveals that another mistake occurred: My friend had clipboarded the CMC 6-- specifications into the new material for the CMR as a starting point, and at one point had simply failed to overwrite the CMC 6's sensitivity specification with the CMR's. So, Murphy strikes again.

Please note that the CMR circuit is optimized for minimum power consumption, so the dynamic range shouldn't be compared with that of the CMC 6-- amplifier in the expectation that they'll line up exactly. You can't get something for nothing in physics; you can get better dynamic range when you aren't on a super-tight current budget in an amplifier circuit. Thus the equivalent noise of the (much lower-current) CMR circuit is a little higher than that of the CMC 6-- amplifier, and not only as a function of the capsule polarization voltage.

--best regards

[illconditioned]

I would expect Schoeps designed these correctly, to get full dynamic range out of the capsules.  If I had to guess, I'd say the lower sensitivity is due to the (balanced) line driver on the CMC vs the unbalanced output of the CMR.  The other reason for lower sensitivity could be to make them suitable for input to wireless packs.  Anyway, these seem like they would be perfect for taper use, especially body worn or very small rigs clamped to a pole or ceiling.  If you're going for a cable longer run, just get regular XLR cable and some phantom adapters to run the CMR.

  Richard

[Dkrogh]

So what are the 'brains' behind the CMR cable and connector.  Is it the connector, or is it the cable.  What I mean by this is if a person was to purchase the connector and the cabling separately what would be the 'parts'.

Could a person purchase the same connector as is used for the nbox or is this connector different.
Could a person use different wires to mimic those used on the cmr's when purchased from schoeps, if so are there specs to be complied with?

[darktrain]

So what are the 'brains' behind the CMR cable and connector.  Is it the connector, or is it the cable.  What I mean by this is if a person was to purchase the connector and the cabling separately what would be the 'parts'.

Could a person purchase the same connector as is used for the nbox or is this connector different.
Could a person use different wires to mimic those used on the cmr's when purchased from schoeps, if so are there specs to be complied with?

everything is in the connection where the cap screws on, you provide your own power supply(5-12v) and termination

[NOLAfishwater]

So what are the 'brains' behind the CMR cable and connector.  Is it the connector, or is it the cable.  What I mean by this is if a person was to purchase the connector and the cabling separately what would be the 'parts'.

Could a person purchase the same connector as is used for the nbox or is this connector different.
Could a person use different wires to mimic those used on the cmr's when purchased from schoeps, if so are there specs to be complied with?

electronics are in the connector similar to the way CCM series is. they come from the factory either terminated or unterminated, so in this case you would order unterminated and have one of our veteran cable builders like Darktrain terminate them for you.

[Dkrogh]

so could a person like Nick buy the connectors from schoeps and put on some of his cabling and connector and sell them for less?

[nottingham]

No, the CMR’s are not just cables, they are similar to mike bodies designed for remote miking  with cables attached. The cables are not sold separately only the termination. You can get them unterminated and have Robb (Darktrain) terminate them however you please. Most of us are using 4 or 5 pin mini xlr’s with the same pin out configuration so we can mix and match gear, Little Box, tiny box, battery box, etc.

[Dkrogh]

I think I'm being misunderstood, but possibly not.

I realize that it's not just the cables and that the only supposed way to purchase this is to buy the entire unit (cables and mk connector) and that you can have schoeps terminate them for you or you will have to terminate them yourself.  I'm referring to a way to make this setup even cheaper to people using a similar process that Nick (scheopsnbox) uses with to make his nbox setup.  He purchases the connector from schoeps, so could he purchase the cmr connector from shoeps, put on his own cabling and termination and you would then have a cmr setup hopefully cheaper than the 1100 it costs from schoeps, and maybe even have him build a Bat box and have the entire setup, hopefully cheaper than the nbox setup, and smaller too. 

Or am I just thinking like I'm suffering from an i d 10 t error.

[darktrain]

I think I'm being misunderstood, but possibly not.

I realize that it's not just the cables and that the only supposed way to purchase this is to buy the entire unit (cables and mk connector) and that you can have schoeps terminate them for you or you will have to terminate them yourself.  I'm referring to a way to make this setup even cheaper to people using a similar process that Nick (scheopsnbox) uses with to make his nbox setup.  He purchases the connector from schoeps, so could he purchase the cmr connector from shoeps, put on his own cabling and termination and you would then have a cmr setup hopefully cheaper than the 1100 it costs from schoeps, and maybe even have him build a Bat box and have the entire setup, hopefully cheaper than the nbox setup, and smaller too. 

Or am I just thinking like I'm suffering from an i d 10 t error.

its not going to be cheaper than the nbox setup,  and schoeps doesn't offer to buy just the cmr end that i have seen like the active cables, but thats the difference, the cables for a nbox are just cable and connector for the caps and the nbox supplies everything to the caps, the cmr is cable and connector plus the electronics in the connector end(for the caps)

[Dkrogh]

thanks for the clarification! 

[darktrain]

Sample from last night's Jewel show at The Vic using MK41/CMR> BB> M10(gain all the way to 10), all i did was add some gain in post