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Gear / Technical Help => Microphones & Setup => Topic started by: ace5gt on August 11, 2013, 01:36:22 AM
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Are there any clips that work with CA CAF mics? Or any DIY methods? I'm also new to taping so I'm also curious where to mount them them...on my shirt?
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Are there any clips that work with CA CAF mics? Or any DIY methods? I'm also new to taping so I'm also curious where to mount them them...on my shirt?
No clips.. mount them up high wear a hat if possible. Place them on ether side of your head above your ears. Use thread and a needle to temporarily mount them.
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I have extensively used the CAFS and I didn't need any fancy mount. My favorite and less intrusive mount is this one. Just hold your head up with the mics pointed to the PA stacks, press the "rec" button and VOILÁ you got a killer recording with the smallest gear ever.
(http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/120/eg2t.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/42/eg2t.jpg/)
Here's a detail of the clip I use (I bought it off ebay for something like 3 bucks):
(http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/5334/vhfj.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/694/vhfj.jpg/)(http://img818.imageshack.us/img818/3258/euqu.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/818/euqu.jpg/)
:)
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Pretty nice looking solution there. Just might not get a lot of separation between the two channels that way and there's no boundary in between them (i.e., your head) but I'm not sure that would make a huge difference.
I've run those mics in the past just sticking out of a jacket and got a great capture so... ;)
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The modified "croakie" mount, I love it!!
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Pretty nice looking solution there. Just might not get a lot of separation between the two channels that way and there's no boundary in between them (i.e., your head) but I'm not sure that would make a huge difference.
I've run those mics in the past just sticking out of a jacket and got a great capture so... ;)
It makes a big difference. I think it is sort of useless to do coincident, non-baffled omnis unless you want an essentially mono recording...
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^ The OP said he was stack taping, which is essentially mono anyway, unless you're super-concerned about the stereo image of the people jabbering around you :P
Not that I disagree with you. But for stack taping, this seems pretty interesting.
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^^^ I didn't see that the OP was interested in stack taping (I still don't, actually). But in that case, you're definitely right. Generally, I think polar patterns/configurations for stack taping don't matter very much...
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Do you know what brand of clip that is??
I have extensively used the CAFS and I didn't need any fancy mount. My favorite and less intrusive mount is this one. Just hold your head up with the mics pointed to the PA stacks, press the "rec" button and VOILÁ you got a killer recording with the smallest gear ever.
(http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/120/eg2t.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/42/eg2t.jpg/)
Here's a detail of the clip I use (I bought it off ebay for something like 3 bucks):
(http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/5334/vhfj.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/694/vhfj.jpg/)(http://img818.imageshack.us/img818/3258/euqu.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/818/euqu.jpg/)
:)
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not a lot of separation
makes a big difference
stack taping is essentially mono anyway
don't matter much
I think it matters, but for different reasons and with different implications and importance.
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not a lot of separation
makes a big difference
stack taping is essentially mono anyway
don't matter much
I think it matters, but for different reasons and with different implications and importance.
Lee one thing I should say about these mics.. Is for some reason and I am not quite sure why.. They seem much more directional than most omni mics. I have used in my products. Maybe it has something to do with the size of the opening.. And the length of the body of my CAFS. I dont think this is an ideal stereo separation but.... It could work. One other thing that can be done here is simply attach the mics to ether side of these sun glasses on the arms... That way they still look natural and they are getting the head for stereo separation.
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Thanks for the kind words people! This is seriously a super non-intrusive solution and it's gotten me awesome recordings.
Indeed, as pointed out, I use the CAFS when taping in small venues and always close to the stacks so stereo image is pretty inexistant anyway.
I sincerely have no idea regarding the clip brand but I can dig it for you in my past won articles from eBay.
Here's a sample from the same night when the pic of my head was taken. Brit Floyd (best Pink Floyd tribute band of the planet) rocking a venue known for its irregular sound here in Madrid. I was second row, standing, CAFS pointed to the stacks just above my head and plugged right into my Roland R-05 (no preamp or bbox).
Lineage: CAFS > Roland R-05 (WAV, 44 kHz / 24 bit) > PC > Audacity (No EQ of any type, just normalized, added fades and downsampling) > MP3 (320 kbps)
http://www.goear.com/listen/fd600c9/high-hopes-2012-12-11-madrid-brit-floyd
<iframe width="580" height="115" src="http://www.goear.com/embed/sound/fd600c9" marginheight="0" align="top" scrolling="no" frameborder="0" hspace="0" vspace="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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I think it matters, but for different reasons and with different implications and importance.
Can you clarify this a little? There were two topics you quoted (the difference a baffle makes and the mono-ness of stack taping) and I'd be curious to hear your thoughts on either or both! From my own experience, though, the baffle makes quite a difference...
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Yeah, I was just writing something tangentially about that now..
Sounds pretty good to me, with more important things satisfyingly correct than getting significant sharp Left/Right imaging and a strong sense of envelopment. By that I mean the direct/reverberant balance is good and the overall frequency balance is too. This gets the mics up on top of your head unmasked by the crowd around you with a clear line of sight to the sound sources and that is probably the most important thing to achieve in this recording situation. If I was to tweak it slightly to try and optimize things as much as possible, I'd keep the mics in the same clip, and try pointing them 180 degrees apart directly left and right, and maybe space them a little farther apart across the brow of the frames. Placed relatively close together and unbaffled like this, doing that would maximally leverage the bit of directionality Chris mentions they have, but I doubt they are directional enough that the maximum angle you can get between them would be too much.
I think that could increase the sense of spaciousness. Spacing them slightly farther still and baffling them with your head by mounting them separately on the arms of the glasses would probably do that even more so, but may not be as clear and well balanced in a direct/reverberant sense if you are standing in a crowd of people and aren't a full head above everyone else. I don't think you're going to get much left/right imaging anyway given what you have described, but increased envelopment and a tangible sense of spaciousness is possible even when stack taping.
I think you've selected a pretty good horse for the course here, and I'm impressed with the sound of these mics.
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Thanks for the cumpliments, Gut. Means a lot coming from you. I'm very happy with how this recording turned out (probably my best pull with CAFS), and I'll take your critics in consideration next time I tape with them -although I seem to be leaning towards my AT943 lately. Nevertheless I still like the CAFS a lot; after a year owning them, I am STILL amazed at how incredibly small they are. Each single time I pick them up I think "What the???", it seems unfeasible that such small things can record high fidelity sound like they do.
That being said, to me it's more important to have a *great* sound quality (aka good freq range, defined and balanced instruments, clear vocals) with little stereo imaging, than a *good* sound (muddier, or with less clear vocals) with a fantastic L/R separation. That's just personal preference, of course, but that's how it works for me ;D
If I understand your post correctly, this is basically what you propose isn't it?
(https://sphotos-a-vie.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/1176177_10201602833089935_129793567_n.jpg)
Well, if the mics are slightly directional as Chris says, I think the resulting recording wouldn't be just as good. Something tells me that, even with a conventional purely omnidirectional mic, having the capsule directly pointed to the sound source will give clearer recordings than having it pointed elsewhere. Of course, I could be easily wrong, but that's how my uneducated taper mind works :P
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Thanks for the cumpliments, Gut. Means a lot coming from you. I'm very happy with how this recording turned out (probably my best pull with CAFS), and I'll take your critics in consideration next time I tape with them -although I seem to be leaning towards my AT943 lately. Nevertheless I still like the CAFS a lot; after a year owning them, I am STILL amazed at how incredibly small they are. Each single time I pick them up I think "What the???", it seems unfeasible that such small things can record high fidelity sound like they do.
That being said, to me it's more important to have a *great* sound quality (aka good freq range, defined and balanced instruments, clear vocals) with little stereo imaging, than a *good* sound (muddier, or with less clear vocals) with a fantastic L/R separation. That's just personal preference, of course, but that's how it works for me ;D
If I understand your post correctly, this is basically what you propose isn't it?
(https://sphotos-a-vie.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/1176177_10201602833089935_129793567_n.jpg)
Well, if the mics are slightly directional as Chris says, I think the resulting recording wouldn't be just as good. Something tells me that, even with a conventional purely omnidirectional mic, having the capsule directly pointed to the sound source will give clearer recordings than having it pointed elsewhere. Of course, I could be easily wrong, but that's how my uneducated taper mind works :P
Your amazed at how small they are try soldering them :) Its quite a task. I am glad you like the mics.. With any mic on axis response will always be better.
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You really should just hold them in your hands, and listen to what spreading them apart sounds like. Get a good pair of closed-ear headphones. some loud music, and your rig.
You can twist them around and get a sense of their directionality, and combine a sweep of the distance from close together to arms-length apart. They are pretty remarkable. It doesn't take long to find the sweet setup for any occasion. Good thread.
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Best advice yet right there from Kevin. The only way to really know is to listen for the differences.
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What I ended up doing is wearing a military style shirt with two chest pockets. I then loop the mics through the button slit on each one. I'm fairly pleased with the results I've gotten.
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What I ended up doing is wearing a military style shirt with two chest pockets. I then loop the mics through the button slit on each one. I'm fairly pleased with the results I've gotten.
If
a) you don't have someone taller than you blocking the sound that reaches to the mics,
b) you're able to keep your mouth shut (which I can't)
and c) you don't breathe in the direction of the mics,
then I would say that's a valid mounting option :)
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Here's a variation on the CAFS "glasses" mount. Another member here did this a couple of years ago, said it worked great, so I tried it and haven't had a problem with it.
They are fake glasses - no glass.
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s492/planetrockstaff2012/rs2000/P9032022_zps3db4809b.jpg) (http://s1054.photobucket.com/user/planetrockstaff2012/media/rs2000/P9032022_zps3db4809b.jpg.html)