Topic: R-09 bit rates and sampling rates

[SamtheMan65]

I spent a while searcing the archives to find as much information about bit / sampling ratres when using the Edirol R-09. I have to say that there are a lot of differences in opinions. Add to that, my inexperience and here I am with my first posting on these forums. I have an R-09 with the latest firmware update. I purchased an Audio Technica AT822 to use along with the R-09. I envision three typical recording scenarios when I might use this setup. 1. Capturing an acoustic duo or trio (violin, cello, etc). 2. Capturing a load output from the speaker system coming from either a band or DJ. 3. Using a lav instead of the 822 to capture spoken audio. I realize adding a pre-amp can make a big difference (that's my next task to tackle) but I haven't been able to determine which settings to use. I also understand the settings I choose could limit my workflow options. I don't anticipate doing too much post production work with the captured audio other than adjusting the levels (the audio will be used in conjunction with video production). So here's the question, what settings should I use and why? I know this isn't an easy question to answer but I would appreciate any advice.

regards,

Sam

[SamtheMan65]

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[Nick Graham]

I think I understand what you're asking....

The higher the bit depth/sample rate, the better the quality, but you also get a much larger file - which will indeed effect your workflow. Resampling can be a long and tedious process, but definitely worth it.

Another question - what will your end result be? Are you planning on transferring the files to CD? If so, the standard 16 bit / 44.1 kHz sampling rate is probably what you want. Does your playback system have 24 bit DVD-Audio ability? If so, you'll want 24 bit / 48 kHz sampling rate.

It really all depends on what you're wanting to do with the music once it's recorded, and what you have the capability to do as well.

[powermonkey]

I think I understand what you're asking....

The higher the bit depth/sample rate, the better the quality, but you also get a much larger file - which will indeed effect your workflow. Resampling can be a long and tedious process, but definitely worth it.

Another question - what will your end result be? Are you planning on transferring the files to CD? If so, the standard 16 bit / 44.1 kHz sampling rate is probably what you want. Does your playback system have 24 bit DVD-Audio ability? If so, you'll want 24 bit / 48 kHz sampling rate.

It really all depends on what you're wanting to do with the music once it's recorded, and what you have the capability to do as well.

Is it a pain to convert 24/48 wav files to 16/44.1? I'm thinking I may as well record in 24bit - a DVDAudio player is next on the list, and if conversion to 16bit is relatively simple then all the better.

[Brian Skalinder]

Is it a pain to convert 24/48 wav files to 16/44.1?

It does require additional effort / post-processing.  Whether that qualifies as a pain or not depends on one's specific tolerance for going through the proper steps, the s/w one uses, whether one hears an audible difference in 16- v. 24-bit, whether one wishes to retain highest quality for archival purposes and potential future post-processing, etc.

[hawghunter]

(the audio will be used in conjunction with video production). So here's the question, what settings should I use and why? I know this isn't an easy question to answer but I would appreciate any advice.

regards,

Sam

use 24/48 if the project is for DVD

[hawghunter]

Is it a pain to convert 24/48 wav files to 16/44.1? I'm thinking I may as well record in 24bit - a DVDAudio player is next on the list, and if conversion to 16bit is relatively simple then all the better.

I don't consider it a pain, it's kind of easy. I use Adobe Audition, so I could only speak for that program.

[powermonkey]

Is it a pain to convert 24/48 wav files to 16/44.1? I'm thinking I may as well record in 24bit - a DVDAudio player is next on the list, and if conversion to 16bit is relatively simple then all the better.

I don't consider it a pain, it's kind of easy. I use Adobe Audition, so I could only speak for that program.

I've only got Audacity at the mo, but my approaching birthday might just get me a copy of Sound Forge... that sounds to me like it should handle most of my needs.

 

[SamtheMan65]

Thanks to all who responded to my initial post. What I was trying to do was learn more about bit rates and sampling rates (on my R-09) and then how they would effect my workflow and how much I can edit.

I understand the higher the bit depth/sample rate, the better the quality. I also understand that the more information (depth) a file has the more it will stand up to editing. At this point all I typicaly do with my audio is try to adjust to the correct levels. I am a video editor (with an obvious need to raise my audio editing skills, hence my post). I don't have the ability to resample (yet).

So here's a scenario. I'm videotaping a wedding, I use my R-09 to capture audio from a band. I understand that 16/44.1 is the CD standard. So as far as work flow goes, I could transfer to CD to work with that particular file later. Most of the people I speak with don't seem to use 16/44.1 because 24/48 is better.
My system allows me to use 16 bit / 48KHz. I'm not sure how much better (in theory) that is from 16/44.1. I also assume I can't tranfer that to CD? So what are some possible work flow options? Should I just transfer the files and store them on one of my pc's harddrives?  Will I be able to do that via usb? I would like to be able to reuse the few Transcend 4gb SDHC cards I have (which in my tests have worked well thus far).

I'm sure some of these questions are really basic but I do appreciate all responses.

Sam

[dorrcoq]

Well, certainly you can transfer your file to your hard drive via USB (read your manual! ).  And once it is transferred safely, you can delete the file from your Transcend card, and re-use it.

"My system allows me to use 16 bit / 48KHz."

What system do you mean?  You should be able to use 24 bit/48 kHz without any problem.  Certainly the R-09 records in that format, and you can transfer it to your hard drive and edit it in that format.  Then you can dither and downsample it to 16/44.1

[powermonkey]

From what I can gather, it's a good idea to record in the best possible quality (ie 24bit) even if you intend to use the recording for CD - you can backup the 24bit files and just convert for CD - guarunteeing that you've still got the archived 24bit for later editing, or for use with video or whatever.

I don't know how much extra hard-drive space a 24bit file would take up rather than a 16bit file, but with the abundance of cheap external drives this seems like the way forward.

[Roving Sign]

Thanks to all who responded to my initial post. What I was trying to do was learn more about bit rates and sampling rates (on my R-09) and then how they would effect my workflow and how much I can edit.

I understand the higher the bit depth/sample rate, the better the quality...

So here's a scenario. I'm videotaping a wedding...

Shouldn't audio for video be mastered at 48khz?

[SamtheMan65]

I edit in Adobe Premier 6.5 (I know it's an older version but I still don't like the new version and am considering switching platforms). I checked all the presets and it seems the best quality I can use is 16/48. I don't see it having the ability to downsample to 16/44.1. I have never needed to downsample, so I'll check again to see if this is possible. I have been field testing the R-09 but I guess the best thing to do would be to transfer a couple of files into my pc to see what it can and cannot do.

Thanks.