Topic: Recording a 24-bit soundboard output with a 32-bit (float) recorder

[captainentropy]

Will there be any issues that I should be aware of if I were to record a 24-bit soundboard output with a 32-bit recorder (MixPre-3 II, Zoom F3, etc.)? I've only used a 24-bit MixPre-3 for soundboards in the past. (48 kHz all)

[morst]

The only "con" I can think of is the 33% increase in file size, with the main "pro" being that you no longer have to worry about levels versus noise floor.
Sounds like a great trade-off to me.

[Dan33185]

I've never had an issue (Zoom H4E)

[Gutbucket]

I don't think this is what you are doing or asking about, but "24bit soundboard" makes it sound as if you are trying to record a digital output from the soundboard via a digital connection.  If that were the case the recorder would typically need to run at the same rate as the board, and would use that digital input signal as its clock source.  Atypically, if capable of doing so, a digital-input recorder might be set to resample in real-time to some other sample rate and/or bit-depth. 

But it's much more likely that the soundboard output you will be recording is analog, an in that case it doesn't really matter which sample rate and bit-depth the board uses. Your recorder simply receives an analog input and does its thing recording to whatever rate and bit depth you set it for.  Assuming that's the case, morst's post above covers it.

[captainentropy]

I don't think this is what you are doing or asking about, but "24bit soundboard" makes it sound as if you are trying to record a digital output from the soundboard via a digital connection.  If that were the case the recorder would typically need to run at the same rate as the board, and would use that digital input signal as its clock source.  Atypically, if capable of doing so, a digital-input recorder might be set to resample in real-time to some other sample rate and/or bit-depth. 

But it's much more likely that the soundboard output you will be recording is analog, an in that case it doesn't really matter which sample rate and bit-depth the board uses. Your recorder simply receives an analog input and does its thing recording to whatever rate and bit depth you set it for.  Assuming that's the case, morst's post above covers it.

Ah! Yes, that makes total sense, Gutbucket. The soundboard I most recently recorded at (that worked) was XLR output. I shoulda used my F3 for that then*. My most recent soundboard was at a small venue here in SF and the sound guy messed up the patch and I only got a single channel (as well as the mix itself as the guitar was way too low in the mix ). That was also XLR. But. He first asked if I had a thumb drive, so *that* would've been 24/48 as it was a digital out from the board.

OK, I got it now.

*Now for the asterisk. While the Zoom F3 sounds fine to me, I've read the preamps it uses are not as good as the MixPre3/6/10 preamps. Yeah? Any reason - from a sound quality perspective - would it be better to use a MixPre3 (24-bit) over a Zoom F3? When putting the matrix together I first have to downsample the 32-bit file (room mics) to match the SBD which was 24-bit. So, having it all 32-float source woulda made that exercise easier.

[morst]

If you take a line signal from the board into the MixPre in Line in mode, you will not be hitting your fancy Kashmir mic preamps.

When putting the matrix together I first have to downsample the 32-bit file (room mics) to match the SBD which was 24-bit. So, having it all 32-float source woulda made that exercise easier.

You sure about that? Audacity lets users mix stuff of all kinds of sample rates and bit depths.
If anything, upsample the 24 and mix at 32 bits. Never have to worry about peaks levels at the mix stage that way!
I just started mixing at 32 bit and smack my head why was I sending 24 bit to the mastering limiter when I could send it 32 and let it sort it out!?

[VibrationOfLife]

I think this is a case of overthinking.  Take the XLR sound source and record it at any bit depth you want to given your priorities for depth or file size.

If you take a usb out then you will have to match the bit depth (at least on my recorder).  I can't understand why a line input would not be routed through your SD preamps, but I don't own one.

[captainentropy]

If you take a line signal from the board into the MixPre in Line in mode, you will not be hitting your fancy Kashmir mic preamps.

When putting the matrix together I first have to downsample the 32-bit file (room mics) to match the SBD which was 24-bit. So, having it all 32-float source woulda made that exercise easier.

You sure about that? Audacity lets users mix stuff of all kinds of sample rates and bit depths.
If anything, upsample the 24 and mix at 32 bits. Never have to worry about peaks levels at the mix stage that way!
I just started mixing at 32 bit and smack my head why was I sending 24 bit to the mastering limiter when I could send it 32 and let it sort it out!?

Yep. I use Wavelab Pro 11 and I create a montage with all the sources (so I can also apply EQ to the room mics but not the soundboard since it's already mixed the way the band wants it) and if I have two different bit rates it resamples so they're all at the same bit rate. (Unless there's some magic happening I don't understand and it's not really being resampled :. But, that what it asks for permission to do when I import the SBD track.

[morst]

wave lab pro 12 is 64 bits internally.
11 has to be at least 32 already...
https://www.steinberg.net/wavelab/compare-editions/


Changing bit depth is not nearly as mathematically traumatic as changing sample rates with non-integer ratios...

[spyder9]

When a 32 bit recorder w/digi-in gets invented, let me know please.  Thanks.

[Gutbucket]

^ Laptop + digital interface is technically a recorder, but I know that's not what you mean.   Phone running 32bit input capable recording software with a digital interface might do it and is closer.

[grawk]

When a 32 bit recorder w/digi-in gets invented, let me know please.  Thanks.

Let me introduce you to the Sonosax R4+.  It's not 32 bit float, but instead actual 32 bit.

[Gutbucket]

Nice piece of kit, as they say.

[rocksuitcase]

When a 32 bit recorder w/digi-in gets invented, let me know please.  Thanks.

Let me introduce you to the Sonosax R4+.  It's not 32 bit float, but instead actual 32 bit.

Damn, made me look. $6500 at Gotham sound today.
"Up to 12 Mic level inputs can be added when the unit is connected to the Sonosax AD8+"
Aside from THAT added cost, I would never need 16 channels but this thing looks amazing and rugged for those who do.

[grawk]

The base recorder is 4 channels. But I’ll be adding another 8 eventually.