Topic: Zoom F8

[pohaku]

What he said.  I think the more interesting reaction will be from Tascam, Roland, Sony, Fostex, etc.  They may need to significantly raise their game in response.  Can't wait!

[carlbeck]

Just ordered mine from my guy at Sweetwater, they still don't know when they will see them but I'm on the list so the wait can begin.

[voltronic]

I do not see the market for the 7xx series anymore with firewire dead and so much other better competition out there now (i.e. Zaxcom Nomad Lite/Maxx, 633, etc) - I really don't think the F8 is taking the 702/722/744 etc out - these units days have been numbered for a number of years

You keep saying that the 7-series is on the way out, but there clearly is still a strong market for them among professionals.  For example:
http://www.sounddevices.com/in-action/ben-osmo-and-oliver-machin 

I also think SD is the first place you go for rugged build quality until you move into the realm of Nagra and Aaton, and that's a big price jump as well.  Zaxcom's weak point are those membrane buttons.

Sure, it would be good to see SD update everything to USB3 or something like that, but why change something that's selling well?  You can also use a FW > Thunderbolt adapter as an option, and the 788 has USB + FW.

The F8 isn't going to cut much into the professional market that much, although I'm also hopeful that it puts some competitive pressure on the market.  It all depends on how well it sells, I suppose.

[H₂O]

You keep saying that the 7-series is on the way out, but there clearly is still a strong market for them among professionals.  For example:
http://www.sounddevices.com/in-action/ben-osmo-and-oliver-machin 

I also think SD is the first place you go for rugged build quality until you move into the realm of Nagra and Aaton, and that's a big price jump as well.  Zaxcom's weak point are those membrane buttons.

Sure, it would be good to see SD update everything to USB3 or something like that, but why change something that's selling well?  You can also use a FW > Thunderbolt adapter as an option, and the 788 has USB + FW.

The F8 isn't going to cut much into the professional market that much, although I'm also hopeful that it puts some competitive pressure on the market.  It all depends on how well it sells, I suppose.

I don't think the 788 is on the way out just the 702/702t/722/744t and I read that article a few months back.

[2manyrocks]

There is so much money riding on professional films that they would be hesitant to use something new until its reliability and performance has been proven unless used in a very backed up or test mode. 

[404 Not Found]

So a major screw up happened to me this past weekend in that I didn't check my settings for the SD1 and SD2 slots and had recorded all 6 channels into 2 track stereo on both SD cards.  UHG!!!!!!

This will not happen again!!!!  Figures, since I had a green light to record and had no worries and too much smugness.  Murphy's Law!!

One thing that I can attest to, w/o the end result from the mix-down, was that running an SD MixPre-D in-line before the F8 is not necessary IMHO.  The F8 by itself handled it just as well in a prior recording when I was all direct input. 

Other than having the final result of the evening as a 2 track stereo mix, the recorder itself is perfect for audio field recording. It ran well and it was the user this time who was not working properly. 

I am liking the F8 and will make sure I set each SD card slot to the correct settings next run.

Lots of music to be recorded coming up, except during the Pope visit, of which I will stay as far away from Philly as I can  

[stevetoney]

One thing that I can attest to, w/o the end result from the mix-down, was that running an SD MixPre-D in-line before the F8 is not necessary IMHO.  The F8 by itself handled it just as well in a prior recording when I was all direct input. 

Thanks for the feedback.  Could you please elaborate on this statement a bit? 

Are you simply referring to the levels you got (were you using XLRs therefore Mic Input?) or are you referring to the quality of the preamps in the F8 versus those of the Mix Pre D?  I assume you're talking about the levels, since if I understand correctly, because of your mess-up that would mean that you can't check the sound on individual mic outputs other than the final mixed channels.  What type of music were you recording and what was the general ambient volume?

[404 Not Found]

F8 & Headphones. 

I was using my Isolation Headphones on my prior outing with the F8 and I am even more impressed with this unit in re. to the monitoring of individual channels during recording.

The PFL button, when pressed per channel, has a great monitoring audio level.  In comparing to the SD552 in channel monitoring, I found it to be easier to access the setting as well as quickly change from one channel to the next to make any adjustments if necessary.

Not that the SD552 is bad, but if you are not familiar with the SD552 settings, it's not as simple as the F8.

Overall Headphones, in using Isolation phones as noted, are pretty damn good with the F8.

[stevetoney]

There is so much money riding on professional films that they would be hesitant to use something new until its reliability and performance has been proven unless used in a very backed up or test mode.

I conceptually agree, but when the SD633 first shipped, the market completely flooded with used 744s indicating that higher end users don't necessarily need any time before they're willing to jump on a new SD product.  Most higher end company's employ more recorders than a single 633 or 744 though.

I'm in the camp that thinks that the Zoom F8 won't have much, if any, impact on the Sound Devices market.  I think it'll impact Tascams DR680 sales much more than it will impact Sound Devices 744, 633 or 663 sales.

[404 Not Found]

One thing that I can attest to, w/o the end result from the mix-down, was that running an SD MixPre-D in-line before the F8 is not necessary IMHO.  The F8 by itself handled it just as well in a prior recording when I was all direct input. 

Thanks for the feedback.  Could you please elaborate on this statement a bit? 

Are you simply referring to the levels you got (were you using XLRs therefore Mic Input?) or are you referring to the quality of the preamps in the F8 versus those of the Mix Pre D?  I assume you're talking about the levels, since if I understand correctly, because of your mess-up that would mean that you can't check the sound on individual mic outputs other than the final mixed channels.  What type of music were you recording and what was the general ambient volume?

The Sound Devices MixPre-D was redundant IMHO when running prior to the F8.  I had the same results from the Shure VP88 going direct to the F8 set as MS Mode as I did using the MixPre-D in MS.  It was just an extra item that I did not need to use IMHO.  After my 1st outing using the F8 and no pre-mix, the point of the MixPre-D was to test the MS setting and see if it was any better than running the MS as a direct input to the F8.   

I was able to monitor everything from the headphones per channel.  The SD Card settings for SD slots 1 & 2 happened to have been set incorrect by me for Slot 1 from when I was experimenting with the recorder at home days prior with XLR inputs vs. TRS.  I thought I had changed the Slot 1 back to record each channel separately, other than ch.'s 1 & 2 being linked and set as Mid and Side.

I was able to monitor the channels.  The Slot settings do not effect monitoring of each channel/input, unless they are linked as well as in MS.

The music was a 17 piece Big Band playing the music of Frank Zappa with Napoleon Murphy Brock on Vocals, Flute and Sax,

[pohaku]

There is so much money riding on professional films that they would be hesitant to use something new until its reliability and performance has been proven unless used in a very backed up or test mode.

I conceptually agree, but when the SD633 first shipped, the market completely flooded with used 744s indicating that higher end users don't necessarily need any time before they're willing to jump on a new SD product.  Most higher end company's employ more recorders than a single 633 or 744 though.

I'm in the camp that thinks that the Zoom F8 won't have much, if any, impact on the Sound Devices market.  I think it'll impact Tascams DR680 sales much more than it will impact Sound Devices 744, 633 or 663 sales.

I agree about the projected impact of the F8 on the SD and Tascam markets and hope that it prompts Tascam to develop a new and competitive product.  I don't think it will kill off the DR680 as there is still a substantial price differential between the two that will appeal to some.

[2manyrocks]

If the F8 proves itself for early users, folks who really want time code are likely to opt for the F8 at $1,000 over the R-88 at $2,000 or the HS P82 at $2,400.

Hard to say about the DR680. I paid $429 for the first version.  I thought about picking up another unit to cascade, but I find it hard to swallow $600 for the mkii. If they drop the 680 price down to $400-$500, I think it may continue to sell.  But at $600 for the 680, I think buyers are looking to look hard at the F8 feature set before deciding what to buy. 

 

 

[BonoBeats]

If the F8 proves itself for early users, folks who really want time code are likely to opt for the F8 at $1,000 over the R-88 at $2,000 or the HS P82 at $2,400.

Hard to say about the DR680. I paid $429 for the first version.  I thought about picking up another unit to cascade, but I find it hard to swallow $600 for the mkii. If they drop the 680 price down to $400-$500, I think it may continue to sell.  But at $600 for the 680, I think buyers are looking to look hard at the F8 feature set before deciding what to buy. 

Amazon has the mkii at $500, which I agree is probably the upper threshold of what I'd pay. My question is whether to buy the 680mkii now, or going all in on the F8, which would probably require me to sell off a bunch of gear (with my wedding in five weeks, my budget is a bit tight for buying new toys).

The other question is how often would I actually use eight inputs in a taping situation...

[carlbeck]

If the F8 proves itself for early users, folks who really want time code are likely to opt for the F8 at $1,000 over the R-88 at $2,000 or the HS P82 at $2,400.

Hard to say about the DR680. I paid $429 for the first version.  I thought about picking up another unit to cascade, but I find it hard to swallow $600 for the mkii. If they drop the 680 price down to $400-$500, I think it may continue to sell.  But at $600 for the 680, I think buyers are looking to look hard at the F8 feature set before deciding what to buy. 

Amazon has the mkii at $500, which I agree is probably the upper threshold of what I'd pay. My question is whether to buy the 680mkii now, or going all in on the F8, which would probably require me to sell off a bunch of gear (with my wedding in five weeks, my budget is a bit tight for buying new toys).

The other question is how often would I actually use eight inputs in a taping situation...

The reality is that there aren't many F8's out there so coming up with one prior to your wedding shouldn't be a concern. I placed my preorder yesterday at Sweetwater & have no idea of delivery. For my money I chose the F8 over another 680 since I've never really been impressed with mine. It works but the metering is horrible & it doesn't exactly feel like the quality Tascam once was so I figured I'd give the new Zoom a shot. The 8 channels is nice for me sometimes at my local venue when I want to run three pairs of mics & a board feed but that's more of a nice feature just in case, I bought the Zoom for that & the superior metering. I'm hoping the quality is better than the Tascam ( which shouldn't be too hard IMO) & if the preamps sound good for my additional channels I'll be very pleased.

[H₂O]

If the F8 proves itself for early users, folks who really want time code are likely to opt for the F8 at $1,000 over the R-88 at $2,000 or the HS P82 at $2,400.

Hard to say about the DR680. I paid $429 for the first version.  I thought about picking up another unit to cascade, but I find it hard to swallow $600 for the mkii. If they drop the 680 price down to $400-$500, I think it may continue to sell.  But at $600 for the 680, I think buyers are looking to look hard at the F8 feature set before deciding what to buy. 

 

I think the hs-p82 still has lot to offer at $2000 (which is about what they are selling for nowadays) with 8 channels of digital in and out and optional real-time sample rate conversion on all digital inputs.  It is big and power hungry though.  You have to step up to $4k+ to find another recorder with 8 channels of digital input - which makes this unit a good cart backup unit.


The R-88 offers one digital input.