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Author Topic: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170  (Read 14012 times)

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Offline twoodruff

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Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« on: August 02, 2008, 11:53:23 PM »
what's the difference? sonically mainly. And is the 170 internally shockmounted as well? I know about the u89i, nothing about the 170s.
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Offline eric.B

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2008, 09:14:36 AM »
the 170 is internally shockmounted as well..   and from what I understand (as Ive never run u87/u89's) the 170 is more neutral (transparent, uncoloured) than the u87/u87.. 
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Offline DSatz

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2008, 04:30:04 PM »
I've owned and used them both. I could hear no difference in sound between them and would expect none, except at the very, very bottom of the frequency range where the built in high-pass filtering in the amplifiers have different slopes. For that matter you can include the TLM 193, which is built around the same capsule--it sounds just like the cardioid setting of the TLM 170 or U 89 except that it has even less filtering at the bottom end in the amplifier.

All are very good microphones, but not very popular outside the classical world because they lack the usual "Neumann signature sound" (they don't emphasize the midrange or the high end to speak of). People who are into the "vintage Neumann" sound generally dislike this series. They're not "vocal microphones" in the sense of making a voice sound bigger or more impressive or professional than it really is, like a U 47 does. They are reliable, more or less neutral-sounding microphones. Again the frequency response in the upper midrange isn't quite as smooth as the (smoothed, idealized) printed graphs indicate, but the overall shape of the curves is about right.

Internal shock mounting in a microphone is an emergency measure, not magic--it can make an otherwise unusable recording usable, but you can still hear the effects of ordinary bumps and vibrations.

Let me know if you have any other questions about these.

--best regards
« Last Edit: December 26, 2009, 08:39:55 PM by DSatz »
music > microphones > a recorder of some sort

Offline twoodruff

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2008, 05:52:22 PM »
ok have you ever used the beyer mc740n or 840s? Just wanting to either try a new LD or go back to the u89s.

Trey
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stirinthesauce

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #4 on: August 03, 2008, 06:42:07 PM »
Trey, here are some vocals using the 740n on a session we did a year or so ago.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjda6a6vjUA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxBmmGgp9IU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0u5OhEqpNI

vocals were captured in subcard setting.  Pre/ad was a metric halo.  FWIW, the guitar had a beyer mc930 and ck703 (the other 930 had moisture issues causing static).  Pre/ad on that was a apogee mme.

As for in the field for concert taping.  Dirk probably has some samples to send you.  I played with them a couple times.  Here they are in blumlein at Smith's in Atlanta for NRPS.

http://www.archive.org/details/nrps2006-10-24..flac

opener with D. Gans

http://www.archive.org/details/nrps2006-10-24..flac

have a black keys show from workplay somewhere with these mics as well.  I'll see if I can dig it up and send you a sample.

These are some of my favorite ld's.  Sound very smooth and natural. 

Offline JasonSobel

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2008, 09:08:40 PM »
Just wanting to either try a new LD or go back to the u89s.

if you're open to suggestions, how about a pair of Microtech Gefell um900.
http://www.microtechgefell.de/eng/home.htm > Studio Condensers
or
http://www.microtechgefell.de/eng/prod/konden/um900/um900_0.htm



large diaphram tube mic, 48V phantom power, omni, wide cardioid, cardioid, hyper cardioid and figure 8
kick ass all around :)

Offline rowjimmy

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2008, 10:22:31 PM »
the um900 is so sexy it tempts me to type something inappropriate.
I'll simply say that I'd love to operate a pair of those...
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mic > wires > recorder

Offline twoodruff

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #7 on: August 04, 2008, 12:20:57 AM »
nice, a bit out of my price range
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Offline TNJazz

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #8 on: August 04, 2008, 07:42:05 AM »
ok have you ever used the beyer mc740n or 840s? Just wanting to either try a new LD or go back to the u89s.

Trey

MC740 stage lip, split omni:

http://www.bigpurpledog.com/audio/players1.flac
http://www.bigpurpledog.com/audio/players2.flac
Check out my band!  --> http://www.ninjadynamite.com

stevetoney

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #9 on: August 04, 2008, 08:32:15 AM »
ok have you ever used the beyer mc740n or 840s? Just wanting to either try a new LD or go back to the u89s.

Trey

MC740 stage lip, split omni:

http://www.bigpurpledog.com/audio/players1.flac
http://www.bigpurpledog.com/audio/players2.flac


Hey, you Beyer dudes KNOW you're talking to yourselves...we all know that Trey is a confirmed Neumann man!  Stick to your guns Trey!  I'm now Neumann-less and, while I'm loving the DPA's, that doesn't mean I don't miss my Neumann mics...ALOT!  I've heard those Neumann LD mics and I think they sound fantastic, although I'm not about to try and trump what Mr. Neumann (I mean, Mr. Satz) has to say about them...I do have to say that I think they sound more Neumann-ish than not. 

...and BTW, for those of you that have said that MG LD mic is sexy looking, it could be because it looks to have as many functional uses as a sexual aid device as it does a microphone!!!   ;D ;D
« Last Edit: August 04, 2008, 08:39:09 AM by tonedeaf »

Offline TNJazz

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #10 on: August 04, 2008, 09:45:06 AM »
Trey, you could always be bold and go Russian too.  You'd be untouchable with a pair of MC51 or MC416.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2008, 09:52:26 AM by TNJazz »
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Offline eric.B

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2008, 09:55:38 AM »
ok have you ever used the beyer mc740n or 840s? Just wanting to either try a new LD or go back to the u89s.

Trey

MC740 stage lip, split omni:
http://www.bigpurpledog.com/audio/players1.flac
http://www.bigpurpledog.com/audio/players2.flac


...and BTW, for those of you that have said that MG LD mic is sexy looking, it could be because it looks to have as many functional uses as a sexual aid device as it does a microphone!!!   ;D ;D

We have a system that increasingly taxes work and subsidizes nonwork.  ~Milton Friedman

Offline TNJazz

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #12 on: August 04, 2008, 10:04:29 AM »
BTW, just say the word and the 740's will be on their way to Jackson.
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Offline sygdwm

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #13 on: August 04, 2008, 10:40:13 AM »
BTW, just say the word and the 740's will be on their way to Jackson.

word. :P you know they are really for me anyway.
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(P.S.: On a threaded discussion board like this one, there's no need to repeat someone's post when you reply to them; everyone can see all the messages in the thread.)

Offline TNJazz

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #14 on: August 04, 2008, 10:45:53 AM »
BTW, just say the word and the 740's will be on their way to Jackson.

word. :P you know they are really for me anyway.


PM me the pertinent details and they will be on the way this week.
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Offline twoodruff

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #15 on: August 04, 2008, 10:49:16 AM »
thanks dirk
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stevetoney

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #16 on: August 04, 2008, 11:37:31 AM »

Offline TNJazz

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #17 on: August 04, 2008, 12:11:21 PM »
no problem.  I've been experimenting with other mics for overheads lately, so I can spare them for a while.

Just tell me where to send them.
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Offline twoodruff

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #18 on: August 04, 2008, 12:39:13 PM »
have you sent them yet? We may want to wait until there is something to record, or is there something I don't know about, drew?

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Offline sygdwm

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #19 on: August 04, 2008, 12:54:36 PM »
there is nothing to record at the moment, but i will find something. pm sent dirk.
mics: (4)akg c460b(a60,mk46,ck1x,ck1,ck2,ck3,ck61,ck63)
pres: oade m148/edirol wmod ua5
recorders: marantz stock671/oade acm671/fostex busman vintage fr2le

(P.S.: On a threaded discussion board like this one, there's no need to repeat someone's post when you reply to them; everyone can see all the messages in the thread.)

Offline muj

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #20 on: August 04, 2008, 05:36:33 PM »
Just wanting to either try a new LD or go back to the u89s.

if you're open to suggestions, how about a pair of Microtech Gefell um900.
http://www.microtechgefell.de/eng/home.htm > Studio Condensers
or
http://www.microtechgefell.de/eng/prod/konden/um900/um900_0.htm



large diaphram tube mic, 48V phantom power, omni, wide cardioid, cardioid, hyper cardioid and figure 8
kick ass all around :)

been there done that, mics are way too heavy and i'm not sure of the tube is microphonic out in the taper's field

Offline muj

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #21 on: August 04, 2008, 05:43:59 PM »
the russian stuff is a good suggestion, also check these out ldc sound in sdc package

Offline TNJazz

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #22 on: August 04, 2008, 05:59:57 PM »
the russian stuff is a good suggestion, also check these out ldc sound in sdc package

Quit posting that shit unless you're going to send them to me.   

;D
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Offline muj

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #23 on: August 04, 2008, 06:01:59 PM »
the russian stuff is a good suggestion, also check these out ldc sound in sdc package

Quit posting that shit unless you're going to send them to me.   

;D


If I send stuff to you, I'll end up mic less ;D

Offline TNJazz

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Re: Neumann u89i vs tlm 170
« Reply #24 on: August 04, 2008, 06:14:06 PM »
the russian stuff is a good suggestion, also check these out ldc sound in sdc package

Quit posting that shit unless you're going to send them to me.   

;D


If I send stuff to you, I'll end up mic less ;D

I'll trade you for em, then.  Maybe a couple of Russians and an SM57...?

 >:D
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