Topic: How much impact does a cd/dvd player have on sound quality?

[Evil Taper]

I playback all of my cds/dvds with a Sony dvd player and I'm curious if buying an audiophile grade cd player will actually add anything to my listening experience.  So from anyone with actual in home experience on the subject (and not just convincing yourself it sounds better because you spent a shitload of cash on it) how much differeance does the player actually make?

[George]

It made an apparent difference for me when I went from a Samsung cd/dvd player to a Music Hall cd25 with upgraded op-amps (opa627).  The difference was there, but not day and night.  The first thing I noticed was that the bass response was "there" compared to the samsung which sounded bright and tinny.  I'm sure if I went back and tried the same samsung I would be appalled that I ever used it as a source since my ears have acclimated themselves to the cd-25.  FWIW: I bought my cd-25 used on audiogon.

[cshepherd]

The $600 msrp mark is where we've found CD players to start making a noticeable difference (about what a stock Music Hall CD 25 costs).  The Exposure 2010 S player we carry is $1250.  It may seem a little expensive to some, but it sounds as good with a 16 bit audience tape as my Cambridge DVD player (~$500) does with the 24 bit source.  It makes music come alive.  My dvd player makes music sound like mud with no midrange by comparison. A good player is where it all starts, IMO.

Chris

[twatts (pants are so over-rated...)]

A medium upgrade some folks do is the Denon players of the Pioneer Elite players.  They offer very good features, and some use Burr-Brown DACs, for a reasonable price. 

But honestly, I'm not sure how much of diff you will hear.  I'm looking into getting a used Denon or Elite off of Audiogon, but they've been hard to find in my area...

Terry

[nickgregory]

I have a pioneer elite DV-45A..I was using a samsung HD-841 (rebranded Toshiba 4960) and from a sound perspective, the music appears to be smoother than the samsung was...not an in your face difference, but there...now keep in mind I use it only as a digital transport as I run digi out to my 3000ES, so I can only attribute what I hear to (1) something I wanted to hear (cant be that) or (2) better transport on the pioneer...from a video perspective though, the picture was miles better...deeper brighter colors...very happy with it...

[Brian Skalinder]

I think it's important to distinguish between functions when asking the original question.  I find it very easy to hear differences in different DACs, whether internal to the player or external.  I've not yet heard a difference in transports (i.e. running different transports to the same external DAC), but I've not done any specific comps on transports (and now that my playback is PC-based, I probably won't).

If you're happy with your transport, I'd suggest trying out an external DAC.  I think it'll give you the best bang for the buck.  Then, down the road, you may toy around independently with different transports.

Edit to add:  I don't know what other gear you have for playback, but IME the better the pre / amp / speakers, the easier it is to hear the DAC differences.  So I think first step is to improve the pre / amp / speakers, and then when you're happy with those go for the DAC and/or transport.

[Tim]

I think it's important to distinguish between functions when asking the original question.  I find it very easy to hear differences in different DACs, whether internal to the player or external.  I've not yet heard a difference in transports (i.e. running different transports to the same external DAC), but I've not done any specific comps on transports (and now that my playback is PC-based, I probably won't).

If you're happy with your transport, I'd suggest trying out an external DAC.  I think it'll give you the best bang for the buck.  Then, down the road, you may toy around independently with different transports.

Edit to add:  I don't know what other gear you have for playback, but IME the better the pre / amp / speakers, the easier it is to hear the DAC differences.  So I think first step is to improve the pre / amp / speakers, and then when you're happy with those go for the DAC and/or transport.

this is good advice all the way around and pretty much in line with my experiences.

[twatts (pants are so over-rated...)]

Bring up another related question.

If I use the SPDIF out of my crap DVD player, should it deliver the same info as a nice player using its SPDIF out???

In my mind, I have to say yes, and that the DAC convertor is where difference in sound are heard.  I think better construction and materials can improve reading of the disc, but not "sound".

Please someone tell me I'm wrong???

Terry

[pfife]

Bring up another related question.

If I use the SPDIF out of my crap DVD player, should it deliver the same info as a nice player using its SPDIF out???

In my mind, I have to say yes, and that the DAC convertor is where difference in sound are heard.  I think better construction and materials can improve reading of the disc, but not "sound".

Please someone tell me I'm wrong???

Terry

Terry, I'm quite sure what you are saying is correct.  Basically, if you are sending digi out, you are using it merely as a transport, which makes what Brian said above pertinent to your question/situation.

Either if you're running analog out or digi out, its the DAC that's going to make the biggest difference.  Brown Burr is nice.  Evil, if you are running analog out of that sony, I bet you'd hear a difference if you upgraded the cd player (Look into Denon 2900/2910 maybe?).  If you're running digital out, I think the difference will probably be much smaller.

[nickgregory]

I am of the camp that I feel that the quality of the transport makes a difference...vibration from a crappy structure/transport mechanism or maybe resulting from the stand it is sitting on, conceptually will have an effect.

[Tim]

I am of the camp that I feel that the quality of the transport makes a difference...vibration from a crappy structure/transport mechanism or maybe resulting from the stand it is sitting on, conceptually will have an effect.

I think most people here would agree with this - it's probably more a question of at what price do you hit the point of diminishing returns (what isn't in audio!). That's pretty subjective.

If you're running digi out to a dac the type of player makes less of a difference, but a cheap transport will have an audible effect. The question then is, can you tell the difference? And if you can, do you care enough to invest X$ to improve it.

[nickgregory]

I am of the camp that I feel that the quality of the transport makes a difference...vibration from a crappy structure/transport mechanism or maybe resulting from the stand it is sitting on, conceptually will have an effect.

I think most people here would agree with this - it's probably more a question of at what price do you hit the point of diminishing returns (what isn't in audio!). That's pretty subjective.

If you're running digi out to a dac the type of player makes less of a difference, but a cheap transport will have an audible effect. The question then is, can you tell the difference? And if you can, do you care enough to invest X$ to improve it.

agree with all of that...funny how some of us have different tolerance points for $s vs. audible impact.  With it being subjective, I always find it amusing that no matter who you talk to, seems everyone has a different opinion

[Tim]

absolutely

[RebelRebel]

I think the single most important area of upgrade is getting your space acoustically treated. It made a huge difference to me..so much of a difference in fact, that recordings I loved prior to the treatment , sounded like ass, and the same with the monitors I was using.  wouldnt it make sense to get the room squared away before spending more bucks on playback gear?? Would the differences in transports be immediately noticeable in a bad room?(they are subtle, no?)

Curious.

[twatts (pants are so over-rated...)]

Teddy has a point, that the benefits of improving your transport may be minimal compared to benefits received from other upgrades.

But for most people, it is a lot easier to UG their playback than to fix their listening room.  Especially those with wives that don't go for that type of thing.  I'm pretty sure my girlfriend won't allow me to hang foam all over our living room...

Terry