Topic: Analog front end options for Micro track

[mp3weenie]

Hello Tapers (I have not posted since the DAT head days so I am a newbie I guess),

I am using Core Sounds HEB (DPA4061) with it's battery box straight into the Microtrack mic inputs. I am not happy with the analog front end of the MT and I am looking at solutions to improve my rig. I was thinking about an A/D to put in front of the MT but I would like to use 96KHz capability of the MT. Also I was looking at the Korg MR-1 1-bit recording for a replacement of the MT. I want to keep my rig as simple as possible so I though the MR-1 would be a good option. If it lives up to the hype the analog front end should be good since there is nothing to it and you can convert post production to various PCM formats up to 24/192.

What are your thoughts on these and other options?

Thanks in advance. J

[Nick Graham]

As a bit bucket you can't beat the Microtrack, however the analog front end leaves more than a little to be desired.

To keep your rig small, have 24 bit capability, and a decent A>D stage, your only real options are the Korg MR1 and the Edirol R09.

[taper420]

Keep in mind if you use the MT at 24/96 you are only going to get about an hour before you have to do a save which will result in a recording gap. 2 gig limit is a bitch.

[Nick's Picks]

the MR1, while smoking the MT ...is still not stellar in the analog department.

IMO, church audio preamp.  > line in to either deck.
scrap 96kHz.  it is useless any way

[taper420]

Yeah... I don't have any complaints (as far as sound quality) going from the 9100 preamp into the MT (TRS input).

And yes... 96 is useless IMO unless you're doing scientific work that requires you to record frequencies that we can't hear (such as ghost hunting, or bird call analysis)... but if you are, keep in mind you'll need a mic that goes that high as well.

[mp3weenie]

Nick, even with a preamp I am still using the analog front end of the MT??? I was thinking I would have to put an A/D up front to improve the analog front end of the MT? Also since there is nothing to the analog front end of a 1-bit recorder, wouldn't it be a vast improvement? Do you some analysis data? Just curious... Thanks.

Taper420, I know the MT has the 1 hour time limit at 96kHz which I agree can be a show stopper. I guess the MR-1 does not have that problem. Actually I was hoping to make use of 24 bit / 96kHz DVD-A. But either way I believe the MT front end has been shown not have the range to utilize more than 16 bits. I guess I can use the line-in in my setup which was shown to be less noisy than the mic in but still pretty noisy. Thanks.

[guysonic]

Using the MT's TRS LINE level inputs with external preamp is NOT a bad way to go for having a compact rig for shows.  Review at http://www.sonicstudios.com/mt2496rv.htm#pa24xp shows MT recorded noise performance with external preamp at various gain settings.

[Nick's Picks]

right..
its all about "how much" of the analog front end you use, and using the gain of an outboard preamp (better s/n ) allows you to run the noisy end (recorder) at its minimal gain settings where they are quiet(er).

[mp3weenie]

Oh OK I got ya, thanks for the link. I think I can run my BB into the TRS lines for real loud shows without the need for an external preamp, that should help a bit... I think I will give that a try for my next show (it should be a real loud one). Thanks. J

[mp3weenie]

Any recommendations for dual TRS adapter (right angled perfered). Thanks. J

[Nick's Picks]

there are cable manufacturers on the board....

ed@ kindcables
matt@ hi-ho silvers....

[mp3weenie]

Thanks for the input Nick I will check those out! J

[mp3weenie]

FYI,

I decided to go with the ST-9100 preamp and ditch my battery box. Should I still use a 10dB pad on the front end when I am taping loud concerts?

DPA-4061->???10dbPad???->ST-9100(3 wire)->Microtrack (TRS IN)

Thanks, for the input, J

[Nick's Picks]

nope.
there is no way in hell you can overload the DPAs.  If anything the pad might go between the 9100 and the MT (if needed).
I think you'd be fine though.

[guysonic]

FYI,

I decided to go with the ST-9100 preamp and ditch my battery box. Should I still use a 10dB pad on the front end when I am taping loud concerts?

DPA-4061->???10dbPad???->ST-9100(3 wire)->Microtrack (TRS IN)

Thanks, for the input, J

Assume MT side gain switch is set in "L" LINE mode without +27 dB boost. 

ONLY Chris or another owner of same mic/pre/MT rig with experience recording similar loud venue can tell you for sure if that model DPA mic needs 10 dB pad between mic and ST9100 preamp. 

Because DPA mic output tends to be hotter than most, using 10 dB pad should not be an entirely wrong thing to do, so if in doubt, use the pad and see if preamp gain is in ~ upper medium range and MT deck has enough adjustment range for pad + preamp settings. 

If preamp is at top of gain and MT deck is at full up max REC level setting, AND VU peak levels are lower than -12 dB, then for sure it's better for at least this type of venue to ditch the 10 dB pad at first opportunity.

[mp3weenie]

Yes Chris thought I should be OK but I will take the pad along just in case :>, Like you said if you can get the right levels, the pad will not hurt for loud shows but I will try to do without. Thanks for the tips. J