Topic: Sound Devices 7xx series- why are they so expensive?

[H₂O]

I had a SD702 and thought it was a nice recorder but the preamps where not as good as the Grace pre amps nor my PSP-2 (although that is an entirely different design).

I sold mine because IMO it was not the All in one I was looking for and I would always want to run a Pre infront.

Zaxcom is supposedly going to support up to 96Khz and possibly 192 - it's just not shown so in the current specs.

[Teen Wolf Blitzer]

Made in America!!!  Portabrace, Grace, SD.  Love all 3.  Only thing I don't own American made is my mics but then there are really no American made mics anymore anyway.  Been running my 744 for 4 years now.  Not one problem ever.  And I've already rolled over the track numbers on it.  That's a lot of hours.  By contrast my R4 had issues from day 1.  Everytime I think about selling the 744 and getting the 680 I'm too scared to do it frankly.

[it-goes-to-eleven]

Just because the SD 7xx have been out for 6 years doesn't mean they are outdated.

Agreed.  I really don't see anything that needs changing on a 7xx.

Also, their product philosophy is to release software and hardware updates for anything that needs a fix.  Rather than the consumer approach - "we'll keep releasing new models, obsoleting the old, and get people to buy them!"

Their service and support are incredible.  And you can talk to the company president.

The 661?  The controls are on the side.  So you can't even run it in a bag or in a rack.

Regarding pre-amps... A lot of the hardcore gearslutz crowd spends a thousand or more per channel.

[hi and lo]

The only thing I think is 'outdated' about the 7xx series is the same feature I've never liked... the battery. I don't like how those batteries stick out like a tumor and six years later, my gut tells me it would be entirely possible to shrink the footprint of the internal electronics to support a different layout and possibly an internal powering solution.

Otherwise, they're still great recorders. The prices could stand to come down, but I don't think the feature sets are outdated in the slightest.

[Teen Wolf Blitzer]

^ They better not pull an Edirol and cut the price.  That right there really pissed me off.  Instantly lost half my investment in that machine.

[yug du nord]

Besides the pre's,craftsmanship and other things mentioned here.I love the fact it's made in America and the customer service is excellent.

If I ever go SD.............   this is the main reason............  straight from WI yo!!!

[FrozenSounds]

The only thing I think is 'outdated' about the 7xx series is the same feature I've never liked... the battery. I don't like how those batteries stick out like a tumor

I quite like the battery arrangement - other than needing something to poke the recessed release pin.
The standard 2Ah is flush, but sure the 4Ah and 6.5Ah packs stick out, but when the recorder is suspended in a case that's not a issue.
I also like that small and light external AC/12V chargers from CTA  are only $12 from Amazon.

[Lil Kim Jong-Il]

If I took a BMW to work and a bicycle the next, would anyone even know the difference if I didn't tell them?  I understand the professional use/reliability aspect of it, but if the pre is so good in an SD 7XX, why do most run a V2, V3, or other pre with it?

Because it's just TS that rags hard on the preamps. Go talk over at GS or some of the nature sites, sure, some don't like them (e.g. the nagrists), but it's a minority that complain. What sort of sound do you want is the grand question?

I was one of the one who didn't like the sound of the SD compared to the portico or V3. Mostly with the V3 I think it was because I am fond of the sound with KM143s. With the portico, I really like the silk option and so thats what I run mostly now. 

But I will say that I've changed my mind about the 722 preamps.  IIRC Gunnar was the one who recommended that they sound better when run at lower levels instead of hot. I do that now and I believe that there is an improvement in the sound.  I will run straight into the 722 anytime I need to be small and come away happy. As a stand alone box with good mics in front of it, the 722 is a fantastic box.

[it-goes-to-eleven]

The only thing I think is 'outdated' about the 7xx series is the same feature I've never liked... the battery. I don't like how those batteries stick out like a tumor and six years later, my gut tells me it would be entirely possible to shrink the footprint of the internal electronics to support a different layout and possibly an internal powering solution.

I think the commodity lithium battery setup is great.  What other lithium pack could they run that continues to be widely available many years after the product was introduced?

Sure, it'd be nice if the larger batteries did not stick out.  But those lithium batteries need to stay cool.  So putting them on the bottom, and hanging them out, helps maintain battery life and reliability.


In terms of prices needing to come down... I don't see where they have any competition, so why would they lower prices?   Also, the resale values are excellent.

[Teen Wolf Blitzer]

Here's a thought.  If more people supported American made products....the price would come down.  That's part of the issue with why our economy is in the shitter now.  Everyone wants it on the cheap.

[brewcrew87]

i guess it comes down to why buy a mercedes or audi when you could buy a toyota corolla...both do the exact same thing, get you where you need to go, but i guess there is something to be said for owning a nice car

[rastasean]

^ They better not pull an Edirol and cut the price.  That right there really pissed me off.  Instantly lost half my investment in that machine.

Well I don't think you should buy recorders for their investment value because in the end they will break and eventually be outdated but one thing you should invest in is gold. :-D

[rastasean]

i guess it comes down to why buy a mercedes or audi when you could buy a toyota corolla...both do the exact same thing, get you where you need to go, but i guess there is something to be said for owning a nice car

I wouldn't know about owning a nice car since I've only owned one but people and the professional industry likes the sD 7xx recorders for the multiple reasons listed throughout this post.

[acidjack]

If I took a BMW to work and a bicycle the next, would anyone even know the difference if I didn't tell them?  I understand the professional use/reliability aspect of it, but if the pre is so good in an SD 7XX, why do most run a V2, V3, or other pre with it?

I'm just skeptical.  Would like to hear comps of the same mics, same pre, different solid state deck and see if there is a difference and if that difference is worth $2,000+ to the taping hobbyist.

I think Page summarized this best... the answer to your question would basically be, running digi-in, there is no difference.  There is no difference between my USBpre2>digi-in>R-44 than a 722, sound-wise.   But if I had unlimited money, I'd run the 722 for the higher reliability and the other factors Page mentioned.  But I'm a hobbyist, my R-44 has never died on me (nothing has ever died on me other than for user error except the DR-680 and an old 660 running off batteries), and money is finite.  I can also switch out different pres to use with the -44 if I want different sound.  Of course, if I use an analog pre, the A>D on the -44 is undoubtedly worse than on the SD boxes.

The guys running SD boxes have an elite-level product that is easy to use and rugged and US-made and great at what it does; I don't begrudge anyone buying one.  Would I spend that $$$ on an SD box before I had, say, top-end mics?  no.

[Teen Wolf Blitzer]

That's not what I meant.    I'm sure you know that.  MY point was I payed $1500 for the machine and a year later it was $750.  A year!  I was lucky to get $500 for it when I sold it.

^ They better not pull an Edirol and cut the price.  That right there really pissed me off.  Instantly lost half my investment in that machine.

Well I don't think you should buy recorders for their investment value because in the end they will break and eventually be outdated but one thing you should invest in is gold. :-D