Topic: Audio-Technica AT933s any good?

[setboy]

what do you all think about the Audio-Technica AT933s any good?

THANKS

Raphael

[Sean Gallemore]

great stealthing mics....when phantom powered

[John Kelly]

I love my 933s even without the phantom power.

[caymanreview]

i really liked my at933s when i had mine, i just had the battery box from SP and they were great, i also had cards hypers and omnis to play with

wish i still had them!

[save]

they are great mics w/ out phantom powering them.  great stealth/starter mics imo.

[Savage Messiah]

Best value for under 500 bucks. I'm just upgrading to the phantom power option now, and suggest you do the same later on. The regular 9V power supplies do nicely for the time being.  

[§†∑∫åµÞ≥¥]

Is there a link for the phantom powered option? Is it a Sound Pro's thing?

Thanks.

[John Kelly]

Well SoundPros modifies them to take battery power.  If you buy them anywhere else you'll probably get a pair that will take phantom power, but you should probably ask before you buy.

[Sean Gallemore]

Is there a link for the phantom powered option? Is it a Sound Pro's thing?

Thanks.

http://www.soundprofessionals.com/images/gold/full/SP-PHANTOM.jpg

I'm gonna attempt this mod, shortly, a few threads can be found in the stealth thread in the archive

[§†∑∫åµÞ≥¥]

Is there a link for the phantom powered option? Is it a Sound Pro's thing?

Thanks.

http://www.soundprofessionals.com/images/gold/full/SP-PHANTOM.jpg

I'm gonna attempt this mod, shortly, a few threads can be found in the stealth thread in the archive

Doesn't the standard battery box accomplish the same thing? What am I missing?

[AT853rxwh]

Is there a link for the phantom powered option? Is it a Sound Pro's thing?

Thanks.

http://www.soundprofessionals.com/images/gold/full/SP-PHANTOM.jpg

I'm gonna attempt this mod, shortly, a few threads can be found in the stealth thread in the archive

Doesn't the standard battery box accomplish the same thing? What am I missing?

Nope, the standard battery box gives a whopping 9v... By going mod'd you can go 48v phantom and it gives the mics a lot more range, less likely to brickwall...

[John Kelly]

Yeah, if you give the mics phantom power you increase their SPL (12dbs, right?) and their range.  If cost is a concern you may want to start with the battery box option and get them un-modded later.  I ran the 933s for a long time with the battery power and I don't regret it at all.

[AT853rxwh]

+T John, couldn't remember how much it increased by...

[§†∑∫åµÞ≥¥]

Yeah, if you give the mics phantom power you increase their SPL (12dbs, right?) and their range.  If cost is a concern you may want to start with the battery box option and get them un-modded later.  I ran the 933s for a long time with the battery power and I don't regret it at all.

Cool, thanks for the info. I've been running the SP933's for about 5 years now and have always loved the sound -- although I have had a few brickwalling issues when the music is loud (note: the Oade line mod for my Sony deck helped with this also). I didn't know there was a phantom power/933 mod option. Thanks again.  

[leegeddy]

Yeah, if you give the mics phantom power you increase their SPL (12dbs, right?) and their range.  If cost is a concern you may want to start with the battery box option and get them un-modded later.  I ran the 933s for a long time with the battery power and I don't regret it at all.

Cool, thanks for the info. I've been running the SP933's for about 5 years now and have always loved the sound -- although I have had a few brickwalling issues when the music is loud (note: the Oade line mod for my Sony deck helped with this also). I didn't know there was a phantom power/933 mod option. Thanks again.  

to anyone that wants the SP mod....

you buy the parts, i can do the mod with a 1 day turnaround.  i've done plenty to my friends' AT caps.

marc

[Sean Gallemore]

yep, I'll get the part number for the 933s if you want it

[John Kelly]

Yeah, if you give the mics phantom power you increase their SPL (12dbs, right?) and their range.  If cost is a concern you may want to start with the battery box option and get them un-modded later.  I ran the 933s for a long time with the battery power and I don't regret it at all.

Cool, thanks for the info. I've been running the SP933's for about 5 years now and have always loved the sound -- although I have had a few brickwalling issues when the music is loud (note: the Oade line mod for my Sony deck helped with this also). I didn't know there was a phantom power/933 mod option. Thanks again.  

to anyone that wants the SP mod....

you buy the parts, i can do the mod with a 1 day turnaround.  i've done plenty to my friends' AT caps.

marc

So you mean the "unmod" right?

[leegeddy]

Yeah, if you give the mics phantom power you increase their SPL (12dbs, right?) and their range.  If cost is a concern you may want to start with the battery box option and get them un-modded later.  I ran the 933s for a long time with the battery power and I don't regret it at all.

Cool, thanks for the info. I've been running the SP933's for about 5 years now and have always loved the sound -- although I have had a few brickwalling issues when the music is loud (note: the Oade line mod for my Sony deck helped with this also). I didn't know there was a phantom power/933 mod option. Thanks again.  

to anyone that wants the SP mod....

you buy the parts, i can do the mod with a 1 day turnaround.  i've done plenty to my friends' AT caps.

marc

So you mean the "unmod" right?

jk;

i guess you're right. "i'll undo what SP has done" or "i'll liberate them puppies".  

marc

[Zaphod]

Excuse me just trying to get this straight...

I get a set from SP, hack off the miniplug, and then put on XLRs, and then they can take the phantom 48v? No need for Samson adapters?

[Karl]

Yeah, I'm wondering the same thing about the need for the adapters.

Also, where's the best place(s) to buy the Samson adapters?

[leegeddy]

Yeah, I'm wondering the same thing about the need for the adapters.

Also, where's the best place(s) to buy the Samson adapters?

you need the adaptors.  you can not provide phantom w/o them.  i've never used the Samson brand, but i hear they work fine.  SP sells the Samson for $30/ea. roughly.  AT8533(x) are $60/ea. roughly.

AT's models are:  AT8533x and AT8533.  you could also use AT8531, but they are a combo of 1.5v battery power or phantom power and are larger than the 8533's, which are the -slightly- longer than male XLR connectors.

the difference b/w 8533 and 8533x are:

8533: mini xlr male input, no rolloff switch
8533x: screw terminal, rolloff (150hz, 6dB/octave) switch built in.

marc

[Karl]

Thanks Marc!  For educational purposes, why do they need the adapters?  What would happen if you powered them without it?

Because it looks like you would still be delivering 48V volts to the proper pins, and ground to the third pin.

Check this out also-- http://www.samsontech.com/products/productpage.cfm?prodID=118&brandID=2

Look at the PDF--I'm not sure what it means, but it looks as if you might be able to not use the adapter, but if you run long cable lengths then you would be introducing noise.

[leegeddy]

Thanks Marc!  For educational purposes, why do they need the adapters?  What would happen if you powered them without it?

Because it looks like you would still be delivering 48V volts to the proper pins, and ground to the third pin.

Check this out also-- http://www.samsontech.com/products/productpage.cfm?prodID=118&brandID=2

Look at the PDF--I'm not sure what it means, but it looks as if you might be able to not use the adapter, but if you run long cable lengths then you would be introducing noise.

the "phantom power adaptors" are like mic "bodies".  just as you can't apply direct 48v phantom to mk4 or ak40's without the cmcX or km100, respectively, you can't put 48v across pins 2 and 3 to a mic capsule alone.

without the circuitry in the bodies, phantom power doesn't apply.  believe you me, i've tried bypassing those adaptors for my stealth rig!!  my next project is taking the circuitry out of my at8533 and stuff them inside my mv100 for more stealth!!

marc

[AT853rxwh]

But, you can apply 9v to pin 2 and 3 right?  That is all that SP is doing isn't it?

[Sean Gallemore]

SP is sold out of the samson's right now

[leegeddy]

But, you can apply 9v to pin 2 and 3 right?  That is all that SP is doing isn't it?

no.

pin 3 is grounded in a non-phantom powering. at least that's how the SP mics are wired.

marc

[AT853rxwh]

ok, so where is the 9v going then?

I have some mics that are unmod'd that I would like to mod (just got a ad20mod to use em with)

so how would I mod em in this case?

[Karl]

Thanks Marc!

Yeah, Schwill, I'm looking to buy some adapters asap.  It looks like Samson sells stuff on their site (shopping cart at bottom) but where to actually buy stuff I don't know.  Maybe I'll call them in the morning.

Would any of my local stores (Guitar Center, or whatever) sell these?

mikesus--I can't remember which pin is what exactly, but in Phantom power, the hot 48V terminal would be the same as the 9V plus terminal.  Both grounds are the same.  But the reference 48V on the phantom mics is the same as battery power mic's ground.

48V+=9V
48Vref=ground
ground=ground

Make sense?

[Sean Gallemore]

http://www.taperssection.com/yabbse/index.php?board=3;action=display;threadid=15247

[leegeddy]

ok, so where is the 9v going then?

I have some mics that are unmod'd that I would like to mod (just got a ad20mod to use em with)

so how would I mod em in this case?

it's going to the + conductor. the return lead (-) is grounded and so is the shield.  it's unbalanced. not like a balanced microphone where you have equal voltages across pins 2 and 3 respect to ground. this is phantom power by definition.

it's not too difficult to re-balance SP AT mics. as long as you're ok with soldering tiny conductors to tiny mini-xlr pins, you're fine.  the difference in sound quality is quite noticeable too.

marc

[AT853rxwh]

Ok, I am a freak I actually want to SP mod them.  The mics that I have are ALREADY unmod'd (as they are factory AT mics)  So as not to let the smoke out, I was asking for pin / colors etc to pin...

They are supposed to have mini xlr's so all I should have to do is build up a dual female xlr to miniplug.  shields are obvious, gets sketchy for left, right and plug power...

Thanks for putting up with my stupidity  

[Sean Gallemore]

when I do the mod, will the mini-xlr's on the mics side will be balanced?

[leegeddy]

Ok, I am a freak I actually want to SP mod them.  The mics that I have are ALREADY unmod'd (as they are factory AT mics)  So as not to let the smoke out, I was asking for pin / colors etc to pin...

They are supposed to have mini xlr's so all I should have to do is build up a dual female xlr to miniplug.  shields are obvious, gets sketchy for left, right and plug power...

Thanks for putting up with my stupidity  

for some reason, i thought you had SP and wanted to perform the phantom power mod.

when I do the mod, will the mini-xlr's on the mics side will be balanced?

you will, indeed.

marc

[Sean Gallemore]

and on the mini-xlr > 1/8 adapter side? unbalanced I'm guessing

[AT853rxwh]

Ok, so what SP has done is taken the 3 conductors from each mic, tied the 48- and the shield together and use the 48+ for the 9v line...

Now it makes sense.  Was trying to figure out how they were hooking up 6 wires to a stereo mini plug...

The "unmod" so to speak is just connecting each wire individually (hence the 3pin or even 5 pin) xlrs used to "unmod"

[mattb]

I recently did the "unmod" to my 933s. I've only tested them so far and not used them in the field (don't get out much). I still need to build my dual mini xlr to miniplug adaptor for when I want to run them with the battery box.
I've had these mics and BB for about six years now and I think they're great with the SP mod. I'm looking forward to trying them on phantom to see how they sound that way. I was going to get new mics, but decided to just change these up for a lot less money and see how that works for me first.
It was kind of a pain to do, but not THAT bad. Just takes a steady hand. I had to bother leegeddy to be sure I was wiring them right (had last minute doubts). but it all came out fine.

Where are you guys getting your mini xlrs? I'm going to need another set here soon.

[Sean Gallemore]

I got mine from this page

http://www.trewaudio.com/catalog/subcat146.htm

[Sean Gallemore]

fuck, I hope the AT8533 don't have 5 pins on the mini side...

[Karl]

I called Samson--they said that they have three online dealers.

music123.com
samash.com
zzounds.com

I found the Samson phantom power adapters on music123.com for $30, but I couldn't find the adapters on any of the other sites.  Couldn't actually get ahold of a sales rep at soundprofessionals to find out if they really don't have any in stock or when they'd get them (they need to hire more people).

I think I'm going to go ahead and order mine from music123.

[Sean Gallemore]

good to know SOMEONE has em

[Sean Gallemore]

I got mine from this page

http://www.trewaudio.com/catalog/subcat146.htm

fuck these cock suckers, they sent me 5pin instead of 3 pin minis

assholes

[AT853rxwh]

Just got email that my mics are coming... Plus the dude that got the first lot doesn't want the mics that have the wall xformers... sending me a pair of at853's for REAL cheap...  

Might be able to pay for my AD20 after all this...


Sorry to hear bout the 5 pin...

[Sean Gallemore]

it's alright, just kind of annoying


why did you say this, mike?
"The "unmod" so to speak is just connecting each wire individually (hence the 3pin or even 5 pin) xlrs used to "unmod""

why did you say 3 or 5pin, is there a 5pin connection somewhere?

[AT853rxwh]

Yeah someone mod'd em to use a 5 pin.  

See the pic in this post...


http://www.taperssection.com/yabbse/index.php?board=3;action=display;threadid=17026;start=15


The 3pin will let you go straight to the 8533's using the 5pin will require a y cable...

Keeps it kinda tidy tho...

[Zaphod]

I think a 5 pin is the way to go less connectors and such.

Luckily I live near a Audio shop that builds custom cables, so I'm sure I can get them to mod some AT853's when I get them.

[leegeddy]

I think a 5 pin is the way to go less connectors and such.

on the surface it may seem, but if you count the number of connectors you need in both cases, they are equal (4).

marc

[Zaphod]

In the pics Dano420 modded his AT853 and only used 3 mini XLR 5pins.

1 on the mic cables, 1 on the Y cable to the  phantom adapters, and 1 on the Y cable to the stereo miniplug.

Where are you counting 4?

[leegeddy]

In the pics Dano420 modded his AT853 and only used 3 mini XLR 5pins.

1 on the mic cables, 1 on the Y cable to the  phantom adapters, and 1 on the Y cable to the stereo miniplug.

Where are you counting 4?

i believe has the AT8533x, then 3 it is.

however, if anyone uses either AT8533 or the Samson one, you'll need: 2 for the adaptor input side, then 1-5 pin male and 1-5 pin female.  

marc

[Zaphod]

Yeah that makes sense now! I went back through the pics and was just going to post the same thing.

It's only less connectors if your using the AT8533x adapters.

[Sean Gallemore]

Good to know! + guys

[leegeddy]

Sound Professional SP-CMC8 Cardioid

-undo the heat shrink on the stero mini and remove silicone and cut the wires.

[leegeddy]

Step 2:

-insert the mini xlr components as shown.
-pre-tin the 2 yellow conductors, the 2 red conductors and the shield

[leegeddy]

Step 3:

-solder the connections.  

NOTE:  on a separate note, when i shortened my AT853 cable from 25' to 6', i noted the pin assignments respect to the conductor colors.

Yellow > Pin 2 (+)
Red > Pin 3 (-)
Shield > Pin 1

in Picture 1, you can notice that SP uses Red as (+). don't know why?

[leegeddy]

Step 4:

-assemble the mini xlr connector by crimping the 4 holders to the cable.

[leegeddy]

Final Step:

-the finished modification. ready for phantom power module and phantom power from your preamp.

[Sean Gallemore]

good stuff! thanx marc

[AT853rxwh]

Yup good deal!  

So the SP mod is this?

          / \
          |   |   Audio signal
          \ /
       +===+
       |        |   Bias voltage for microphone
       | ===|
       |        |
       |        |   Ground
       |        |
      + ===+
       |        |
 

Yellow to tip
red to Bias
Shield to ground?


So, how would you wire the dual mini xlr's to stereo mini?  Tie both shields together, pin 2 to tip, and pin 3 to ring, pin 1 to ground?

[leegeddy]

Yup good deal!  

So the SP mod is this?

          / \
          |   |   Audio signal
          \ /
       +===+
       |        |   Bias voltage for microphone
       | ===|
       |        |
       |        |   Ground
       |        |
      + ===+
       |        |
 

Yellow to tip
red to Bias
Shield to ground?


So, how would you wire the dual mini xlr's to stereo mini?  Tie both shields together, pin 2 to tip, and pin 3 to ring, pin 1 to ground?

the SP cmc-8 mic that i just modded originally had mini-jack wired like this:

red from Right mic > ring
red from Left mic > tip
both yellow > ground sleeve
both shield > ground sleeve

they followed industry standard convention of "Red = Right = Ring".  however, they used the red conductors for the (+), while AT uses yellow.  i don't know why SP would use the red conductor vs. AT's wiring scheme.  personally, i follow AT's wiring.

marc

[leegeddy]

That is blowing my mind this early.  How can they wire it all up to the same connectors and get l/r channels

Methinks I need some coffee...

stereo mini is an unbalanced connection for each mic.  the + from left and right gives you the stereo signal. ground is common.

marc

[AT853rxwh]

Yeah, got that!  (missed the red to tip, red to ring the first time I read it!)


Now I am trying to figure how they are getting the +9v to the left mic...  Or is there a +9v on both tip and ring for stereo?  I would suspect it has to be that way, or only one mic would get biased.

[Karl]

leegeddy, you rock!  That stuff is cool.  I will be doing the "unmod" in a couple weeks, I will definitely use your notes.

I assume you are a Rush fan?  I will be taping their Phoenix concert in July, be happy to share a copy.

[Savage Messiah]

SP is sold out of the samson's right now

LOL... I sent my mics in on the 6th to have the mod done. It's 5/14 now and still no word on my mics. Ya know I never considered SP being out of the parts to do the mod, and I guess they can't say "we're sold out of the mod". I guess all I can do is wait.

[AT853rxwh]

Leegeddy +T!!  Got a couple of sets working!  And a set phantom'd  Now I need to get some 5 pin mini xlr's

[leegeddy]

Leegeddy +T!!  Got a couple of sets working!  And a set phantom'd  Now I need to get some 5 pin mini xlr's

cool! hope they work out nicely for ya.

marc

[George]

SP is sold out of the samson's right now

LOL... I sent my mics in on the 6th to have the mod done. It's 5/14 now and still no word on my mics. Ya know I never considered SP being out of the parts to do the mod, and I guess they can't say "we're sold out of the mod". I guess all I can do is wait.

Did you contact them?  When i sent some stuff in for modding i was on top of them and they sent out pretty quickly, very good customer service even though they fouled up a few things (sent back my modded at853's with cards instead of the hypers i had on and they forgot the clips i had on them too).  They took care of it, but still, i'd stay on top of them...send them an email.

[AT853rxwh]

I got mine from this page

http://www.trewaudio.com/catalog/subcat146.htm

fuck these cock suckers, they sent me 5pin instead of 3 pin minis

assholes

If you don't need em I could use a few of em... Lemme know...

[Sean Gallemore]

Leegeddy +T!!  Got a couple of sets working!  And a set phantom'd  Now I need to get some 5 pin mini xlr's

lemme know if you can't find them.  I know wome bastards that can't but help give these things away :-P

[AT853rxwh]

Well if they are GIVING them away  

[Sean Gallemore]

Well if they are GIVING them away  

just playing, they sent me 5pins instead of 3s

Luckily I got the replacements in time to mod for the show on friday

[AT853rxwh]

Well if they are GIVING them away  

just playing, they sent me 5pins instead of 3s

Luckily I got the replacements in time to mod for the show on friday

What 5 pins did they send ya?  I would need 3, either 2 male and 1 female, or 1 male and 2 female.  Lemme know I will Paypal ya for em...

[Sean Gallemore]

Well if they are GIVING them away  

just playing, they sent me 5pins instead of 3s

Luckily I got the replacements in time to mod for the show on friday

SENT ME TWO OF EACH, BUT i ALREADY SENT THEM BACK (sorry for the caps)

i got them from trewaudio.com
What 5 pins did they send ya?  I would need 3, either 2 male and 1 female, or 1 male and 2 female.  Lemme know I will Paypal ya for em...

[AT853rxwh]

Hopefully they can fill em for 5 (watch them send me 3's  )

+T for the link!

[neutrino]

Am I right in assuming the AT933 and the AT853 you guys are discussing are the same microphone? Has anyone compared the AT cardiod mics to the Core Sound cardiods?

[John Kelly]

Am I right in assuming the AT933 and the AT853 you guys are discussing are the same microphone?

No

Has anyone compared the AT cardiod mics to the Core Sound cardiods?

Although I know of no direct comparisons, the AT mics are of much higher quality than the core sound mics.  The only core sound mics that are any good are the HEBs, which are really just DPA 4060s.

[Sean Gallemore]

Am I right in assuming the AT933 and the AT853 you guys are discussing are the same microphone? Has anyone compared the AT cardiod mics to the Core Sound cardiods?

different animal, although SP sells the adapter so that the 933s will take the 853 caps

From what I have heard, I think the AT cards are much cleaner than the Core Sound cards, not that the CSCs are bad