Topic: Decent 24Bit or HQ 16Bit A/D??

[mfh2014]

So now that I have my FW410 working (pretty much) and I can run 24Bit I've been thinking about the A/D process more....I usually have access to an AD1000...but I would like to get the most out of the FW410 and run at 24bit....what are your thoughts about just running analog in to the 410 @ 24bit as opposed to running at 16bit throught the AD1000 and using the 410 digital ins....well...I guess this is a tough question to answer becuase most have not heard the FW410...but in general, what are impressions about HQ16bit A/D conversion vs cheaper 24bit A/D??

In any case, if I can get my shit together I will run this comp tomorrow night and Benevento/Russo....probably my buddys 21s > MP2 (tape out) > FW410 @ 24bit and then 21s > MP2 (XLR out) > AD1000 or mod-SBM  > FW410 coax in @ 16bit....

thanks for any input, and if the comp works, i'll try to BT it up...

matt

[BC]

I would say in general decent 24 bit would be better.
Even reasonably priced 24 bit boxes will give you >100 dB dynamic range (my USBPre is spec'd at 106 dB dynamic range @ 24 bit) as compared to the 96 dB maximum available at 16 bit resolution (6 dB per bit).

Sounds like a really interesting comparison!!  

Happy taping,
Ben

[mfh2014]

Thanks for the reply Ben...the FW410 is rated at 108dB dyn range...I'm very interested to stack it up against a HQ A/D...also to see how it compares to the 16bit source when dithered down in post...

[BC]

Thanks for the reply Ben...the FW410 is rated at 108dB dyn range...I'm very interested to stack it up against a HQ A/D...also to see how it compares to the 16bit source when dithered down in post...

I think a really interesting comparison would be the AD1000 tape vs 24 bit dithered using UV22(hr?). I am not sure which algorithm the AD1000 uses, UV22 or UV22hr, maybe would give an idea of how much of that highly regarded "apogee sound" is due to the dithering.

Just a suggestion, it would be best to calibrate the FW410 and AD1000 to your MP2 to get levels as closely matched as possible between the two sources (<1dB difference) before the show for an optimal comparison. Since you are recording 24 bit, this should be easy using the digital metering on your recording program. It has been shown that subtle level differences of just a dB can cause listeners to prefer one source over another, all other factors being equal. (I read this in an old issue of the Audio Critic, I am sure there are AES publications to back this up somewhere)

Happy taping!!
Ben

[mfh2014]

Good points Ben..I may not have a chance to calibrate the levels pre-show because some of the gear will not be available to be borrowed until showtime...but i will try my best tomorrow night on the fly...when I get a chance, I will try to be more scientific about matching levels, etc....

Another issue I just thought of...the XLR outs on the MP2 are hotter than the 1/8" tape out...so I'll be adding more gain on the FW410 than with the AD1000...i guess the way to overcome this is to split the MP2 outs (1/8 or XLR to the 410 and AD1000)...hmmm..well, not sure if this is going to happen for tomorrow..but in the future......

[BobW]

I'm much inclined to beleive that a HQ 16 bit A/D is the choice if destination is  CD and you can either slightly compress or otherwise control the top-end limit to avoid clipping.  Good dither adds noise.
Now, if you are listening in 24 bit, it's a different story.

BTW, what is the thresold of human perception of dynamic range ?

And what about the Taos Hum ? (that's a noise-floor joke, son, a noise floor joke, I say)  <doing best foghorn leghorn imitation>

What's the Taos Hum ? :
http://amasci.com/hum/hum1.html

[Lil Kim Jong-Il]

So did you ever try the comparison of the HQ 16bit and decent 24bit?

[mfh2014]

I haven't gotten around to it yet...hopefully in the next couple weeks...in any case, I must say that I've made some very nice tapes running my oktavas > fw410 @ 24/96...word