Topic: Would you fix a recording by patching from a different show?

[Hypnocracy]

I'm a warts an all kind of taper....to a point...equipment issues have stopped me from releasing a show...there was this one time in the Rain at Buckeye Lake...Involved the crowd almost taking away my poncho...

I like the Warts and all with the Patched Bonus Tracks. Best of both worlds

[yousef]

That said, given that I used Hendrix as my example above, I'll add some context by saying that I, of course, realize that the original Hendrix Woodstock CD was released as a bastardized version that had the tracks jumbled up and some tracks were missing.  But it was a beautiful thing when the family (aka Experience Hendrix) finally released the show  almost completely intact, though I note the new version was still missing a couple of songs and that the opening track on that version which included some Hendrix banter was patched in from another source in order to make the enitre recording a complete and intact record of that historic event.

Didn't they mix down the musicians other than the core trio too, though? If this is true, it's a pretty crappy move.

I've only listened to the most recent mix on the DVD via TV speakers so I can't say from memory if this is true but I've certainly seen a lot of people comment on it online...

[stevetoney]

That said, given that I used Hendrix as my example above, I'll add some context by saying that I, of course, realize that the original Hendrix Woodstock CD was released as a bastardized version that had the tracks jumbled up and some tracks were missing.  But it was a beautiful thing when the family (aka Experience Hendrix) finally released the show  almost completely intact, though I note the new version was still missing a couple of songs and that the opening track on that version which included some Hendrix banter was patched in from another source in order to make the enitre recording a complete and intact record of that historic event.

Didn't they mix down the musicians other than the core trio too, though? If this is true, it's a pretty crappy move.

I've only listened to the most recent mix on the DVD via TV speakers so I can't say from memory if this is true but I've certainly seen a lot of people comment on it online...

Something like that.  When the subject of bastardized recordings comes up, the Hendrix Woodstock is what I immediately think of since it's been bastardized every way possible.  Since obviously the highlight of that performance was Jimi, I tended to not be as cynical about the latest release as the purists, but yeah Experience Hendrix isn't innocent when it comes to messing around with Jimi's art.

[rjp]

Miles' mid to late period albums (rightly or wrongly) were almost all montages.  Many live albums are edited (and most are "fixed"/"overdubbed"/"patched").  Almost no studio projects are "live" or anywhere near it. 

There's documentation (what a lot of us like to do) and production (what artists nearly all view as essential to a release).  They are very different realms.  Professional concerns (and goals) vary...

Frank Zappa certainly did some overdubbing on live tracks; The Purple Lagoon/Approximate on the Zappa in New York album has a fair bit of it, mentioned in the liner notes.

I like the idea of patched bonus tracks, but do whatever you feel is best.

[anode]

My vote goes to the patched bonus track idea. With the "original" track with warts or fade in/out depending on how offending the warts are.

Some time ago I went to see some friends play on a trip back to my home town. Still had a shirt rigged for lo-pro from a concert I'd taped couple of days before, so I impromptu put that on. Old friends from back in the days kept coming up to me greeting me on the top of their lungs directly into the mics.... The song that was worst affected was the best version of a song they played twice, so I cut and spliced. Admittedly this was nowhere near a professional recording (or even skilled amateur  ) and the whole thing was thick with ambience of the properly liquored audience.  The 20 second fade out in the middle of the song rendered it a track I would not enjoy listening to. Too much of a disruption. I do enjoy listening to the spliced version though.

[twoodruff]

To make a long story short as possible,I have a Tedeschi Trucks show where I was the only taper. Local folks always ask me about the recording but I never released it. Some folks on my isle kept walking past and grabbing the mic stand to steady themselves. When I asked them not to to this, they started arguing with me and it is captured perfectly as I was running head high. This happened more than once. FTR, the shortest distance for them to exit was the opposite direction of me. Anyway, Tedeschi Trucks played here again a few months ago and the major disruption happened during a song that they played again this year. I probably couldn't fix them all but def the major 30 sec one. I ran the exact same gear from the exact same location so should I patch the offending parts and release the show or just say forget it? Of course I'd note the patch.

I assume this is Frank. Anyways, do you really care? I would not patch simply because it is too much work.

[fsulloway]

yeah Trey, it's Frank. You're right, I don't care anymore. I've got too much other stuff to do. 

[page]

Anyways, do you really care? I would not patch simply because it is too much work.

As I get older, I adopt this attitude more and more. If I can fake it easily enough and it's something I have to turn in, sure, but otherwise I'll skip it and say "oh, that song didn't happen that night, you were just trashed."

At the core is the illusion vs document debate. I look at it more as an "effort/ROI" question.

[Gutbucket]

At the core is the illusion vs document debate. I look at it more as an "effort/ROI" question.

That right there is a straight up unearthing of a more essential truth! I may have to update [edit] I've temporarily updated my TS signature to display that quote. 

[cashandkerouac]

In the end, do whatever makes you feel most comfortable.

I agree with this even if I wouldn't do the same thing as you might.  It is your recording.

+1

[Chimney Top]

Another possibility would be to search youtube for a video of the track and patch with the audio, but I would fade in/fade out if it's really that bad.

[willndmb]

Late for the party but I wouldn't patch a different show and I would release it
Put in the note something about how some people are jerks and the stand isn't a handrail

[fmaderjr]

But then an optimal listening experience is more important to me than a strictly accurate documentation of an event. 

Why do so few people besides myself seem to feel this way? Of course if I were uploading the recording for sharing I don't suppose I'd do it.

Whenever I've had to do this, however, there's usually been a slightly noticeable change in ambiance during the patch. If there is an almost identical section in the same song at the same show, I prefer to edit that in if possible.

[page]

But then an optimal listening experience is more important to me than a strictly accurate documentation of an event. 

Why do so few people besides myself seem to feel this way?

Some people are uncomfortable with either creating illusions or partaking in the consumption of them. I was for years, and to a degree I still am (for example, I've gotten better at creating them), but it's a process to come to terms with. Whether it's a philosophical fear of the unknown or just a reaction to inability to accomplish a task or accept it, I don't know. millage will vary, just my 2 cents.

[guitard]

While I have plenty of live albums that are patched together and the liner notes say...recorded on tour between X and Y dates, I can't think of a single album I have that says recorded on X date, except for track Y which was from a different night.

I can't think of too many right off the top of my head, but it seems like I've heard that a lot of the live albums that came out back in the day were patched together from various sources - and that was never revealed at the time.

Kiss' 1975 "Alive" comes to mind.  Thin Lizzy's 1978 "Alive and Dangerous" is another.  I'm sure there are lots of others.