Topic: Tascam DR-70D 4-channel audio recorder for DSLR cameras

[Cheesecadet]

Should I use line attenuators going XLR line out of Shure fp24 into the dr70? Had fp24 at 9 o'clock and channels 3/4 dials barely on and my levels were peaking around -14dB but had big clipping spikes peppered throughout the recording. I also had the limiter on tascam engaged.

Was the pre overloading the tascam unit? If I turned up pre any further the tascam would have been peaking like crazy.

[Life In Rewind]

Should I use line attenuators going XLR line out of Shure fp24 into the dr70? Had fp24 at 9 o'clock and channels 3/4 dials barely on and my levels were peaking around -14dB but had big clipping spikes peppered throughout the recording. I also had the limiter on tascam engaged.

Was the pre overloading the tascam unit? If I turned up pre any further the tascam would have been peaking like crazy.

Sounds like XLR outs - Probably need to try the tape out...

[Cheesecadet]

Should I use line attenuators going XLR line out of Shure fp24 into the dr70? Had fp24 at 9 o'clock and channels 3/4 dials barely on and my levels were peaking around -14dB but had big clipping spikes peppered throughout the recording. I also had the limiter on tascam engaged.

Was the pre overloading the tascam unit? If I turned up pre any further the tascam would have been peaking like crazy.

Sounds like XLR outs - Probably need to try the tape out...

Yeah the tape out works fine but I am wanting to use the XLR line out if possible too since I have the interconnects to do so. I think I would just need line attenuators but am not sure which is why I posted my above scenario. My hope is to feed two different devices from the fp24 (one on tape out to my M10 and the XLR line out to DR70).  Does it sound like attenuators would solve the problem I had?  Anyone with experience in this area?

[Life In Rewind]

Should I use line attenuators going XLR line out of Shure fp24 into the dr70? Had fp24 at 9 o'clock and channels 3/4 dials barely on and my levels were peaking around -14dB but had big clipping spikes peppered throughout the recording. I also had the limiter on tascam engaged.

Was the pre overloading the tascam unit? If I turned up pre any further the tascam would have been peaking like crazy.

Sounds like XLR outs - Probably need to try the tape out...

Yeah the tape out works fine but I am wanting to use the XLR line out if possible too since I have the interconnects to do so. I think I would just need line attenuators but am not sure which is why I posted my above scenario. My hope is to feed two different devices from the fp24 (one on tape out to my M10 and the XLR line out to DR70).  Does it sound like attenuators would solve the problem I had?  Anyone with experience in this area?

The TASCAM XLR ins should be on "Low" input settings (under "Basic" menu)

And set the input to "Line" under ("Input" menu)

You'd think the TASCAM could take a pro-level input?

Lots of threads about the hot outs on that pre - so perhaps attenuators are the answer.

[Cheesecadet]

Yep, Had Low And Line Settings on Tascam unit.  I will try line attenuators for LoS in a couple weeks and see if that is the culprit. 

[F.O.Bean]

Attenuators should do the trick! I'm kinda screwed with using attenuators since all of my cables are KCY Binder plugs. I do have some new PFAs, so I wonder if attenuating a PFA is possible? Sorry that's off topic! But yeah, attenuators should fix your issue IMO!

[jcb]

I just did a test : AT2050 / MixPre-D (not an FP24 but close enough) / Tascam DR-70D
MixPre-D was line out on the XLR, the DR-70D was line in on the XLR. Tascam's gain on "low" and input gain on "line".
First used the 1000 Hz tone from the MixPre-D to calibrate the DR-70D level : knob at 11 o'clock (slightly less) on the Tascam gives -20dBfs on the recorder.
Then tried with the mic : at 0 on the MixPre-D I still am at -20dBfs on the Tascam. The knob on the MixPre-D is at 11 o'clock.
It seems to work as it should and the levels are reasonable.

[Cheesecadet]

Here is my issue from the fp24 > XLR Out > DR70D channels 3/4 Line In/Low Gain

[Life In Rewind]

It's odd how much higher the peaks/spikes are compared to the non-peaked portions.
You'd think it would be more uniformly peaked if you were running as hot as you say.(or as it looked)
Doesn't look like a case of simple brick walling/overload.

[Cheesecadet]

I just did a test : AT2050 / MixPre-D (not an FP24 but close enough) / Tascam DR-70D
MixPre-D was line out on the XLR, the DR-70D was line in on the XLR. Tascam's gain on "low" and input gain on "line".
First used the 1000 Hz tone from the MixPre-D to calibrate the DR-70D level : knob at 11 o'clock (slightly less) on the Tascam gives -20dBfs on the recorder.
Then tried with the mic : at 0 on the MixPre-D I still am at -20dBfs on the Tascam. The knob on the MixPre-D is at 11 o'clock.
It seems to work as it should and the levels are reasonable.

So I just did the 1000 hz tone from FP24 into DR70D and I was also at the same -20dBfs.

When I plugged in peluso cemc6 mics (no mic pads engaged), kept DR70D channel 3/4 dials at 11 o'clock (as above), and FP24 gain at 11 o'clock as well...my levels registering on DR70D were at -36dBfs.

Sound right?!?!?

[jcb]

Looking at the graphs, spikes happen on both channels at the same time so :
 - mics are probably not the problem
 - any cable or device between mics and preamp are probably not the culprits
 - same thing for the XLR/XLR cables between the preamp and recorder
This leaves as potential culprits :
 - real sound signal but you would hear it (unless it is near range sub-bass or highs but it does not look like it and I understand you made different tests so this is probably not the cause)
 - interference with an other electronic device (if you tried in different locations this could probably be ruled out)
 - glitches in the FP24 (I'd check power first : power in and phantom)
 - glitches in the recorder (I'd check 1 and 2 XLR in)
To try and isolate the cause :
 - redo the test with the same equipment in a totally different place with no live cell phones anywhere near and power from internal batteries only (testing for environment problems)
 - same test with the external power supply if you used one.
 - a test line level in the recorder's XLR from another device than the FP24 (if this works, the culprit is very probably the FP24)
 - maybe a test with mics connected directly to the recorder (just to be sure the mics and mic cables are working properly)
 - a test with line level signal into the FP24 (if this is OK it leaves the possibility of phantom power plus mic preamps on the FP24)
 - a test with a dynamic mic if you have one (if this works, the problem is probably due to phantom power on the FP24)
It might help to gently move the XLR in or out connectors on the FP24 during part of the tests to check for bad contacts.

(Edited to include test of possible interference from an external power supply and clarification of the interpretation of last tests)

[Life In Rewind]

Just for reference - here's what out of control (too high) levels look like on the DR-70D.

At show start, my 3/4 were peaking wildly.

I had the knobs almost all the way off - in fact - you can see where I went a little too low and channel 4 went off completely for a second.

In this case - the pair on 3/4 were on high gain and mic/w/phantom. Had to pause and switch to low.

[Cheesecadet]

This leaves as potential culprits :
 - real sound signal but you would hear it (unless it is near range sub-bass or highs but it does not look like it and I understand you made different tests so this is probably not the cause)
 - interference with an other electronic device (if you tried in different locations this could probably be ruled out)
 - glitches in the FP24 (I'd check power first : power in and phantom)
 - glitches in the recorder (I'd check 1 and 2 XLR in)
To try and isolate the cause :
 - redo the test with the same equipment in a totally different place with no live cell phones anywhere near and power from internal batteries only (testing for environment problems)
 - same test with the external power supply if you used one.
 - a test line level in the recorder's XLR from another device than the FP24 (if this works, the culprit is very probably the FP24)
 - maybe a test with mics connected directly to the recorder (just to be sure the mics and mic cables are working properly)
 - a test with line level signal into the FP24 (if this is OK it leaves the possibility of phantom power plus mic preamps on the FP24)
 - a test with a dynamic mic if you have one (if this works, the problem is probably due to phantom power on the FP24)
It might help to gently move the XLR in or out connectors on the FP24 during part of the tests to check for bad contacts.

This leaves as potential culprits :
 - real sound signal but you would hear it - NOPE
 - interference with an other electronic device (if you tried in different locations this could probably be ruled out) - Doubt It Because I Have Never Had An Issue With This Before
 - glitches in the FP24 (I'd check power first : power in and phantom) - Doubt It - Never Had An Issue
 - glitches in the recorder (I'd check 1 and 2 XLR in) - I Will Check This
To try and isolate the cause :
 - redo the test with the same equipment in a totally different place with no live cell phones anywhere near and power from internal batteries only (testing for environment problems) - No One Was By Me And My Cell was off, so unlikely
 - same test with the external power supply if you used one. - I Will Try This however I did have a fresh fully charged set of envelops in the fp24
 - a test line level in the recorder's XLR from another device than the FP24 (if this works, the culprit is very probably the FP24) - I Will try this
 - maybe a test with mics connected directly to the recorder (just to be sure the mics and mic cables are working properly) - No Problem Here
 - a test with line level signal into the FP24 (if this is OK it leaves the possibility of phantom power plus mic preamps on the FP24)I will try this
 - a test with a dynamic mic if you have one (if this works, the problem is probably due to phantom power on the FP24) I will try this if I can find my mic
It might help to gently move the XLR in or out connectors on the FP24 during part of the tests to check for bad contacts. - No Problem Here

Thanks for your input and suggestions.  I have never ever had a problem with fp24 in the last several years so I am inclined to think it is not a problem with the pre or the power source since everything works properly and the tape out of the fp24 to a second deck worked perfectly. It was only the XLR line outs that presented a problem into the DR70D.  That is why I thought I may need attenuators possibly. I will try to get some more tests done but I may just have to run everything again at the LoS show next week and just triple check all my settings on the DR70D.  I dunno.  I tend to believe it may have been operator error somehow

[Life In Rewind]

The wav looks more like some malfunction - not any problem with your settings.

Like its recording fine and then bam bam bam...and then fine again.

What does it sound like?

[Life In Rewind]

Just for reference - here's what out of control (too high) levels look like on the DR-70D.

At show start, my 3/4 were peaking wildly.

I had the knobs almost all the way off - in fact - you can see where I went a little too low and channel 4 went off completely for a second.

In this case - the pair on 3/4 were on high gain and mic/w/phantom. Had to pause and switch to low.

I had that happen to me when I was going from a pre amp to the deck. I changed the setting on channel 1 2 to line and the last setting, I forget the category name but it has be set to ext. power. Hope that helps!

This was with the Altec 626s which I was running for the first time - I was also running the Audix 1280s - but I've run them several times with the DR-70D and know they need to be on low for loud rock.

But the Altecs (like all the Nak/TEAC/Primo mics) have a lower output - and I deluded myself at soundcheck that I might need the "high" setting...but as soon as the band started - WRONG!

I think that "ext power" is for 1/2 and turns on PiP?