Topic: Help needed with taping strategy!

[Pieteker]

^ Which also gets the mics farther away from the most nearby talking mouths and clapping hands.  But headworn will work too.  I'd slide a bit further away so as to be right next to the vertical support post, which will serve to shield you somewhat from folks screaming their enjoyment at the stage from the other side of the post.  If headworn, consider rotating the rig so it faces directly toward the close PA while you are able to face center stage.  Wear earplugs!

 

[Gutbucket]

If headworn, consider rotating the rig so it faces directly toward the close PA while you are able to face center stage.

^That assumes making a typical Left/Right stereo stack tape, the way most tapers would go about doing it.  Which is the safe bet.


I hesitate to mention this, but will anyway in case you want to get somewhat oddball with it.  I also mention this for the others contributing to the tread who may want to try it sometime.

 Accidentally, via occasional instances of two of the four channels of my stealth recording setup not working properly, I've discovered I sometimes prefer making a Center/Rear channel recording over a traditional Left/Right one, particularly in a stack-taping situation.  That would be done by having one mic facing directly toward the near PA speaker and the other mic facing in the opposite direction, out into the room.  At this venue something like that would be achieved by wearing your head mounted rig the normal way without rotating it, as your right ear will be facing more or less directly toward the PA.

You'd then end up with one "drier" stack channel, and one somewhat "wetter" room/audience/ambience channel, although that "wet" channel will also tend to be dominated by content from the close PA whenever the band is playing.  Consider the resulting raw recording to have a Sum/Difference (Mid/Side) relationship rather than Left/Right.  You can run that through a typical Mid/Side to L/R decode step to get a standard L/R stereo output.  The dry PA stack channel serves as the Sum or Mid channel, so that content fills the center of the resulting stereo image.  The ambient channel serves as the Side or Difference channel and gets spread out to either side, and you gain the ability to vary the level of it to achieve the best stereo feel and depth.  Funky but it can work quite well, providing some welcome control over direct/reverberant balance, more stereo interest than a straight L/R stack tape typically does, and makes for a wide yet symmetrical portrayal of the room ambience and audience reaction in the resulting recording even though you are way over to one side in the room.

If anyone tries this, feel free to hit me up to discuss a few mixing details.

[aaronji]

Are you sure the PA isn't in stereo? Many of the venues in that size range here (in the Netherlands) do mix in stereo.

[goodcooker]

I've used that same spot in a couple of venues. I'm usually out in the open but going undercover isn't going to be much different. I'd take a few pieces of gaffer tape and wrap them around a lighter or a sharpie marker to carry in with you then use that to attach the mics down low on the rail, fence or whatever at the level of your feet. As others mentioned that will get them away a few feet from talkers and clappers, will line them up better with the PA speaker and will keep them from moving around. Wear an extra shirt and hang it on/tie it to the handrail then run your recorder inside the shirt pocket.

[guitard]

If headworn, consider rotating the rig so it faces directly toward the close PA while you are able to face center stage.

I do this all the time with my MK41s.  I can easily turn the Kangaroo 45° either way.  I told my wife about this and she said I must look stupid with my hat turned to the side like that.  I replied that it's a concert - and you gotta really look weird to stand out in that setting.

[adrianf74]

I do this all the time with my MK41s.  I can easily turn the Kangaroo 45° either way.  I told my wife about this and she said I must look stupid with my hat turned to the side like that.  I replied that it's a concert - and you gotta really look weird to stand out in that setting.

I want to know if you’re using a full-size Kangaroo or a Joey.

But I digress — completely agree with that last statement; nowadays, you’re probably more normal “looking” at that point.

[fanofjam]

I do this all the time with my MK41s.  I can easily turn the Kangaroo 45° either way.  I told my wife about this and she said I must look stupid with my hat turned to the side like that.  I replied that it's a concert - and you gotta really look weird to stand out in that setting.

I want to know if you’re using a full-size Kangaroo or a Joey.

But I digress — completely agree with that last statement; nowadays, you’re probably more normal “looking” at that point.

This might be a revelation to most people that read this, but most tapers (me included) look weird in everyday life.   

So I figure whatever I look like at a show...in the dark...amongst other weirdo's...no big deal.

[morst]

If headworn, consider rotating the rig so it faces directly toward the close PA while you are able to face center stage.

I do this all the time with my MK41s.  I can easily turn the Kangaroo 45° either way.  I told my wife about this and she said I must look stupid with my hat turned to the side like that.  I replied that it's a concert - and you gotta really look weird to stand out in that setting.

Want people to avoid talking to you?
Wear your hat funny!

[Pieteker]

I really enjoy this thread and the advice and experiences that you're sharing with me. I read in a text file that a good way to get a good recording is by going up to the balcony and placing the recorder (whether internal mics or externals) beneath the railing, aimed at the PA speaker. I plan to use my Tascam DR-2D, which has good cardioid mics, and my Roland R-05 with a pair of AT831s plugged into them. I'm confident this setup will yield some results.

[aaronji]

Even more oddball idea: Enlist a friend to help and each of you do a mono recording of one L/R stack   

I essentially did this last night at a John Scofield show. One mic clamped on each side of the balcony, pretty close to the stacks. The balcony was closed, except for the back, but the light guy, some guests, and the DJ were there and they warned me it might get boisterous. So I tried something new...

Came out pretty well, I think, but I haven't had the chance for a close listen yet.

[Pieteker]

Even more oddball idea: Enlist a friend to help and each of you do a mono recording of one L/R stack   

I essentially did this last night at a John Scofield show. One mic clamped on each side of the balcony, pretty close to the stacks. The balcony was closed, except for the back, but the light guy, some guests, and the DJ were there and they warned me it might get boisterous. So I tried something new...

Came out pretty well, I think, but I haven't had the chance for a close listen yet.

How did you clamp the mics?

[Gutbucket]

Nice follow up Aaron!  Did you use the 4015s?

[aaronji]

How did you clamp the mics?

I used two Manfrotto 035 SuperClamps (https://www.manfrotto.com/global/super-clamp-w-lt-stud-1-4-2900-035rl/). As there was nobody else up there, I just attached the mic clips directly to the studs. I lucked out, because I had my "erector set" (SuperClamp, 003 Nano base, 122B and 099B extension poles, 026 Umbrella adapter, plus a variety of spigots, rapid adapters, thread converters, etc.). I anticipated running either a "stand" built from this on the floor or clamping a stereo pair to the rail. The venue's lighting guy said that he could find another SuperClamp and extra long cables if I had another spigot. This worked out for the best, because they were indeed loud in the booth and also because I was with my 12-year old. He hates the floor at standing shows, which makes sense because he is a lot closer to average ass-height than I am...

Nice follow up Aaron!  Did you use the 4015s?

Indeed. I love those mics...

[HealthCov Chris]

Looks like a million places to clamp in that joint!  I bet you'll find a good spot.

[Pieteker]

Hi again,

As I am going to position myself on the balcony next to the PA speaker, I thought of mounting my AT853s to my shoes.
What do you think? Is this the worst setup ever, or could it perhaps do something good? I assume this will minimize any loud cheers and banter next to me.