Topic: Marantz 671 in the field...

[Nick's Picks]

sounds good to me...
but we'll see.  iv'e only used it twice

[F.O.Bean]

I just got my 671 today.
I bought it from the Oades and it has the e24 option, so that means it has the upgraded firmware.

SWEET, looks like i'll be ordering from the oades

[RDunn]

I just got my 671 today.
I bought it from the Oades and it has the e24 option, so that means it has the upgraded firmware.

I got mine about a month ago from the Oades and it also had the firmware upgrade.  When I placed the order, they were waiting on a new shipment and it's my understanding that any they've received since then had the upgrade. 

[F.O.Bean]

+T as well RJDunn

[Kyle]

This unit seems to be a great solution - I have one concern and maybe someone can help me out with this

I will probably use this unit mic-in in certain situations and I am sure with the ACM mod it will sound great
My concern is the specs. I do like to go by my ear, but for example, the line in dynamic range of the 671 is 94db, whereas my ad2k+ has a d.r. of 117db. That is a big differerence.  I would think that the increased d.r. would be important in 24bit recordings....
Spec wise it does not seem to be an improvement over a 16bit recorder.

Thoughts?

[Genghis Cougar Mellen Khan]

This unit seems to be a great solution - I have one concern and maybe someone can help me out with this

I will probably use this unit mic-in in certain situations and I am sure with the ACM mod it will sound great
My concern is the specs. I do like to go by my ear, but for example, the line in dynamic range of the 671 is 94db, whereas my ad2k+ has a d.r. of 117db. That is a big differerence.  I would think that the increased d.r. would be important in 24bit recordings....
Spec wise it does not seem to be an improvement over a 16bit recorder.

Thoughts?

Ask Doug? 

If it's a weak point, perhaps it's because it's the 670 worked over to be a 24 bit recorder.  I wonder how much different the 670/671 are from one-another, a matter of firmware possibly?  The 670's dynamic range is 86db.

This FAQ was helpful to me in answering many of my 16 > 24 bit questions:

The overriding concept here is called dynamic range, and is measured in dB. The dynamic range of a recording is the difference between its loudest point and its quietest point.

To elaborate further, each bit gives us the ability to represent about 6dB of dynamic range. A passage that is 6dB louder than another passage is said to be twice as loud as the other passage. In the 4-bit example, we theoretically have 24dB of dynamic range that can be used. But what if recording doesn’t take advantage of all that dynamic range? What if the recording never peaks beyond 6dB of its maximum possible limit? In this case, the recording would only take advantage of 3 of what we call the least significant (or left-most) bits, meaning 18dB of dynamic range. 16-bit recordings are capable of a theoretical maximum limit of 96dB of dynamic range. This means that a single wave could have up to 65536 discrete values that can be used to represent it. But if the same wave recorded at 16-bit peaks at 48dB below its maximum possible limit, then there would only be 256 discrete values that can be used to represent it, taking advantage of only 8 of the least significant bits. The 8 most significant bits would contain no information whatsoever, and would remain unused. In the case of 24-bit recording, you’d have a maximum of 16,777,216 values to choose from, and in the case of a wave peaking at 48dB below its maximum possible limit, the wave would still have 65536 possible discrete amplitude values that could be used to represent it.

Now, have you ever heard any of the early 8-bit computer recordings that floated around in the early days of home computers? Didn’t they sound just awful? I mean, you were impressed because you had a snippet of music that you could recognize playing from your computer, but you wouldn’t want to listen to it for more than a minute or two. I personally remember playing back an 8-bit digitized 5 second snippet of Van Halen’s rendition of the Kinks’ “You Really Got Me” over and over again on my Atari 800 until I couldn’t take it anymore. The thrill soon had me building an 8-bit digitizing device with a microphone input jack and a connector for the joystick port. Ah, those were the days… but I digress.

Perhaps many are more familiar with 8-bit audio from real-time internet sources like RealAudio. It’s good enough for speech recognition, but leaves all too much to be desired for music.

Now here’s the kicker in the16-bit realm. While the volume level of a recorded low-E note struck on an acoustic guitar might take advantage all 16 available bits (for instance, where the peak on the DAT deck reaches 0dB), the squeak of the fingers on the string, the scratch of the pick hitting the string, and the 5 or 10 audible harmonic overtones of that note may never reach a point beyond 48dB shy of the 96dB maximum. Yes, all of these additional by-products of that low-E string that make the guitar sound alive and compelling receive all of the fidelity of that scratchy, distorted, computerized sound of that 8-bit sample from long ago. And as the basic low-E note fades out, it too gets the same butcher treatment from the ever decreasing number of discrete amplitude values. Yikes!

Now record with a 24-bit word length, and put the CD quality back into those string squeaks, pick scratches, and overtones. With 24 bits, you can hear the clarity of the cymbals decaying as they keep ringing smoothly down to complete silence. The little low-level smack of the bass pedal head hitting the bass drum skin that sounded barely like a small click before (if audible at all) now sounds like a smack, complete with its own smoothly reverberating decay. Even the low-level acoustical reflection from the wall behind the band now contributes to the experience with added detail and a sense of ambience, not simply low-level distortion. Finally, because of this improvement, no more does the recordist have to risk overloading and clipping the recording in effort to achieve maximum fidelity. Levels can be set conservatively with the assurance that a high degree of fidelity is maintained.


http://www.24bitfaq.org/#Q0_1_1

[Kyle]

thanks for the info  +T

[Nick's Picks]

that is a low number for a 24bit recorder.
but...it sounds damn nice.  so who cares...says i.

[it-goes-to-eleven]

that is a low number for a 24bit recorder.
but...it sounds damn nice.  so who cares...says i.

Depends on the sources you record.. Have you recorded anything purely acoustic in a quiet room?  How is the noise floor when you crank the gain up to 55 or 65 dB?  I frequently record in the 55 dB range.

I do agree that specs mean nothing if the sound isn't good..

I wonder if the low dyn range spec is due to a high noise floor or something else. From Doug's site.. 670: The 86 dB spec doesn't have any qualifiers (dB, weighting).  The mic input S/N is 65dB pre MOD and 80 dB post MOD.  671: mic 65dB; line 92dB

V3: 111dB A-weighted
722: 114dB A-weighted

Of the gear I have, the minime and UA5 pre amps are far more noisy than the 722. I have read that the V3 is very quiet but I haven't had a chance to play with one.

[twoodruff]

i believe i already asked this but, if the ACM mod is done to the 671, would the digi-in still be ACTIVE seems like hes only doing shit to the analog side, so i doubt the digi-in from the v3 would be a problem

i would love the cheaper price of the MT, but this things seems so damn user friendly, and with the mod its a no-brianer and the pre-record of 5-10 seconds or whatever is PRICELSSS for those sets that you start 2 seconds too late

I placed my order today. It's on it's way.
I have high hopes

ditto

[sygdwm]

our 671 has arrived, but have no media. will report back later.

[TenoRichards]

grrrrr, mine has not. Of course, I'm going thru channels from Oade, internationally, and the wait is killin' me. If it comes tomorrow, it gives me 24 hours to play with before taping....

[F.O.Bean]

cant wait to buy one, maybe around xmas

[Chuck]

cant wait to buy one, maybe around xmas

I've messed around with mine enough to know that I like it. It seems very user friendly (read - can be operated under the influence if needed  ) I'm going to record a local band next weekend going mic in to the stock pre-amp.

I have all my AA NiMH batteries conditioned, so I'm going to see how long it will run with the battery pack. I may try to do one set mic in and one set line in from the SBD feed. The jack for the DC in, is the Radio Shack "M" type. It's probably the most used DC jack there is, so plugs are easy to find. I got a few cords with the appropriate plug at a local surplus electronics place. I plan to make a couple power cords. I've still got a 12v SLA, and I bought a couple 8x AA battery sleds to run at longer shows.

As Nick said, the grey screen with blue characters is very easy to see/read.

[sygdwm]

good info chuck. +t. i *think* we may go the AA route or wally li-on.