Taperssection.com
Gear / Technical Help => Recording Gear => Topic started by: matjinks on January 24, 2012, 09:24:16 PM
-
Hi Tapers, I am a newbie with a couple of questions. I have a Tascam DR100MKii in the mail, that I would like to use with a prospective Sound Devices Mix Pre D. I want to use the Tascam as a Bitbucket, my question is, will it lock with the SD through its AES XLR? I have a Canare BCJ-XJ-TRB IMPEDANCE TRANSFORMER, and I am planning to solder in a 18db attenuator to bring down the voltage to .5v for the SPDIF input to be happy :) will this work?
will they be happy and communicate nicely, does anyone have real experience with these two units playing nice though digital?
My plans are to travel with a Canon 5D MKii the Tascam and the SD Mix Pre D with a Senn MKH416 (which I already own), shooting a documentary.
I think the system will work out great as I can use the Tascam for handheld interviews then mount it onto the side of the tripod with the Mix Pre and 5D mounted on top to shoot the video.
Many Thanks,
Mathew.
-
I have tested the Tascam DR100mkii with an SD USBPre 2 through the SPDIF coax out, and they play nice. As to your set-up using AES XLR out, perhaps someone else has some experience with this.
-
If you check out the spec sheet for the DR100MKII closely, you'll see that the digital input is spec'ed to the SPDIF standard only. That said, please check out the review I wrote on the DR100MKII here...
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=152321.0
Quite a ways into the review, I wrote a section that is entitled 'DIGITAL INPUT TEST'. In that section I wrote the following...
I did do a test of the unit through the AES/EBU output of the mini-me and the unit locked in at the 24/44.1 setting. However, the manual says that this unit outputs SPDIF, so apparently this isn't going to be a unit for people that need to interface with AES/EBU connectors.
What the review didn't say (I think I'll update this sentence of the review a little bit after posting this message) is that the DR100MKII would NOT lock on the AES/EBU signal of the mini-me at 24/48, 16/44.1 or 16/48. The photo that I took with the error message was taken when I was trying to get AES to lock at one of those three settings. (I'm not savvy about this stuff so I have no clue why the unit would lock on one setting and not the others.)
Conclusion: Based on my experience with the mini-me and the spec sheet for the Tascam, I wouldn't count on the Tascam accepting an AES/EBU signal.
-
try something like this:
http://www.mercenary.com/reauaexspr1.html
-
Sweet! Nice and thanks!
-
Awesome, Thanks! I wonder if that cable is an attenuator too or just an ohm converter? either way I am changing my mind about the SD USB PRE D and think I will go for the USB Pre 2 instead, its a cheaper option and will talk nicely with the Tascam, you can USB power it as a DAW and USB power it in the field, it is not as tidy as the Mix Pre D....but hey if SD made the mix pre D with USB powering and optional SPDIF I would be there...strange choice putting AES on a field mixer marketed towards budget DSLR image makers when seems like all smaller field recorders are SPDIF input only!
Thanks for the input!
-
I don't think you'll regret choosing the SD USBPre2. It has a lot of options and sounds great.
-
I did have one question about the SD USB Pre though, how does it handle tape return to monitor from the Tascam, can you send a return from the Tascam headphone out to the line in of the SD and monitor it whilst still recording through the XLR inputs? Just wondering how you would monitor in the field?
-
I did have one question about the SD USB Pre though, how does it handle tape return to monitor from the Tascam, can you send a return from the Tascam headphone out to the line in of the SD and monitor it whilst still recording through the XLR inputs? Just wondering how you would monitor in the field?
I use the headphone jack on the USBPre 2.
-
Not too hijack the subject, but I too have a Mixpre-D and i'm looking for a bitbucket too. That is, just to check....., if you connect a mixpre-d digital to a recorder unit, the levels from the recorder do not need to be set. They are the same, right? (in other words, i don't have to check that, just keep eyes on the mixpre).
Are DR100MKii, PMD661 and Microtrack 2496 the only 'smaller' units on the market (doing 24/96)?
-
Not too hijack the subject, but I too have a Mixpre-D and i'm looking for a bitbucket too. That is, just to check....., if you connect a mixpre-d digital to a recorder unit, the levels from the recorder do not need to be set. They are the same, right? (in other words, i don't have to check that, just keep eyes on the mixpre).
Are DR100MKii, PMD661 and Microtrack 2496 the only 'smaller' units on the market (doing 24/96)?
The Mix Pre-D is AES output only. The decks you are listing are SPDIF input which is not the same as AES. Besides the SD 7xx series I know the Tasccam HD-P2 & DR-680 accepts AES input. There might be more but off the top of my head they are the only two I know of. You can get AES > SPDIF converters too.
-
Not too hijack the subject, but I too have a Mixpre-D and i'm looking for a bitbucket too. That is, just to check....., if you connect a mixpre-d digital to a recorder unit, the levels from the recorder do not need to be set. They are the same, right? (in other words, i don't have to check that, just keep eyes on the mixpre).
Are DR100MKii, PMD661 and Microtrack 2496 the only 'smaller' units on the market (doing 24/96)?
The Mix Pre-D is AES output only. The decks you are listing are SPDIF input which is not the same as AES. Besides the SD 7xx series I know the Tasccam HD-P2 & DR-680 accepts AES input. There might be more but off the top of my head they are the only two I know of. You can get AES > SPDIF converters too.
Yes, i noticed you need a converter inbetween but they are integrated in special cables (saw a picture somewhere here), so that does not really have to be a problem (in keeping things small/compact). Does it? I was hoping for something the size of a M10. Nothing fancy, just plain simple record.
-
I am not up on the converters but I thought there was a link somewhere on TS about it....sticky section?. Buying one, building one I can't remember.
-
I am not up on the converters but I thought there was a link somewhere on TS about it....sticky section?. Buying one, building one I can't remember.
Here's the link to the archived thread.
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=7676.0
-
I too can't get my Tascam DR100 MkII to play nice with the SD Mix PreD. I am using the Mercenary audio AES/SPDIF cable with limited luck. I can only lock the 2 units at 44.1/16, nothing higher. I guess I will have to try a converter, but I hate the bulk...
-
When the USBPre2 came out it would not lock to Tascam recorders. It took a software patch from SD in order to allow the Tascam to read the SPDIF stream correctly. I don't know anything about the DR-100 BUT it makes me wonder......
-
try something like this:
http://www.mercenary.com/reauaexspr1.html (http://www.mercenary.com/reauaexspr1.html)
That probably will not work as the Tascam is expecting a SPDIF frame formated signal and the cable will simply change the wiring and may change the impedence (physical conversion not frame format conversion).
I have a Sony DTC-A8 that hates AES signals even when using a converter cable or format converter box like the Hosa - and up till now there has been nothing I have found that will convert the frame format (other than possibly a rack mounted Beringer unit - yuck).
The cheapest deck I know that should take a AES signal is the DR-680 as it has a menu option to handle AES formatted signals.
Sony D50 will have same issue as 100mkii
The tascam hd-p2 will probably work
Maybe Tascam will come out with a firmware fix (I doubt is possible with the SD MixPre-D as it has a very rigid setup and was designed for AES and not SPDIF - would probably require a special button sequence to enable SPDIF formatted signal).
-
Not too hijack the subject, but I too have a Mixpre-D and i'm looking for a bitbucket too. That is, just to check....., if you connect a mixpre-d digital to a recorder unit, the levels from the recorder do not need to be set. They are the same, right? (in other words, i don't have to check that, just keep eyes on the mixpre).
Are DR100MKii, PMD661 and Microtrack 2496 the only 'smaller' units on the market (doing 24/96)?
The Mix Pre-D is AES output only. The decks you are listing are SPDIF input which is not the same as AES. Besides the SD 7xx series I know the Tasccam HD-P2 & DR-680 accepts AES input. There might be more but off the top of my head they are the only two I know of. You can get AES > SPDIF converters too.
This is a quote from the MixPreD manual...
"Master Outputs/AES Output: Balanced AES3 Out on Right XLR connector, 110 ohm, 2 V p-p, AES3 and S/PDIF compatible with RCA adaptor."
I am interpolating that as it should be compatible with S/PDIF using an RCA adaptor as stated, however, I'm not aware of anyone that has run a MixPreD digitally with a PMD661 which is my concern, thus the redirect.
I contacted Marantz a while ago and they were unable to help, only offering what I knew already. Quoted here is what Marantz said, "Thanks for your email. All we can say is that the PMD661 will accept a standard SPDIF signal and is capable of recording in uncompressed mono/stereo formats of 16/24bit and at sampling rates of 44.1/48/96kHz. As long as the mixer you are referring to will provide this type of SPDIF digital signal then our machine should accept it. If you have additional questions, please feel free to give us a call.TECH SUPPORT D&M Professional 1100 Maplewood Drive Itasca, IL 60143 techsupport@d-mpro.com".
I just sent a query in to Sound Devices and am hoping they will be able to confirm or deny that the units will actually work together digitally without any limitations to hinder the desired functionality.
-
IF you look in the USBPre2 thread, Nic Stage from SD has posted. He is VERY helpful in getting any question I have ever asked answered. Including going to the engineers to find out the answer. He's da man!
-
IF you look in the USBPre2 thread, Nic Stage from SD has posted. He is VERY helpful in getting any question I have ever asked answered. Including going to the engineers to find out the answer. He's da man!
Great news, which is why I have high hopes that they'll be able to thoroughly address the concern. I'm fairly disappointed in Marantz's response, they didn't really help at all. I have actually read several instances where Sound Devices support has been exceptional in helping with every issue including compatibility of their products with other manufacturers. I was following that USBPre2 thread at the time as that product came before MixPre-D and remains a contender for me. I remember Nic joining Tapersection Forums and posting all in an effort to support that product. As a 661 owner I contacted Marantz first since I don't yet own the Sound Devices product.
-
I'm still waiting to hear back from Sound Devices regarding AES > S/PDIF compatibility of MixPre-D with PMD661.
In the meantime I conducted a test by borrowing an AES3 source. I successfully recorded from AES3 source > S/PDIF PMD661 at both 24/48 and 16/48. Unfortunately 24/48 was the highest available setting for the borrowed AES3 source. The PMD661 recorded files then loaded into my DAW without any problems or copy inhibit flags and I was able to process them and burn CD's of the files. This is encouraging.
For this test I used a simple AES to SPDIF cable that I made a while back using a quality 75 ohm coax video cable (Belden 1505A), converted the 110 ohm AES source into a 75 ohm load impedance by installing 237 ohms of resistance across pins 2 and 3 within the cables AES's XLR-F connector with the center conductor of coax to pin 2 and shield to pin 1. Terminated the other end of the coax with a 75 ohm RCA connector to match PMD661's S/PDIF input.
(http://i1041.photobucket.com/albums/b419/DigiGal_taper/Cables/0601d4fd.jpg)