Topic: Saving a file more than one time. Is it bad for sound quality?

[Dede2002]

Hi,

I don't use only one software to perform post production stuff. I decided to use the best feature of each software. Yes, it may sound strange, but that suits me just fine. Doing so, I have to save the same file lots of times ( each time I finished a step, like tracking, EQ or fade).
Question: saving the same file many times has any impact on sound quality? 

Thanks!

[Brian Skalinder]

It depends on the configuration and workflow of each application you use.*  Ideally, you should perform all edits with 32bfp precision and the file should remain at 32bfp until you're finished editing.  Only after you're completely finished with edits should you dither down to your target bit depth (24- or 16-bit).

* For example, depending on how its configured and the workflow you employ:  Audacity may or may not perform edits with 32bfp precision (it may also edit with 24- or 16-bit precision), and when saving (exporting) a file it may or may not dither to 24- or 16-bit.

[Dede2002]

It depends on the configuration and workflow of each application you use.*  Ideally, you should perform all edits with 32bfp precision and the file should remain at 32bfp until you're finished editing.  Only after you're completely finished with edits should you dither down to your target bit depth (24- or 16-bit).

* For example, depending on how its configured and the workflow you employ:  Audacity may or may not perform edits with 32bfp precision (it may also edit with 24- or 16-bit precision), and when saving (exporting) a file it may or may not dither to 24- or 16-bit.

Thats' what I usually do:
First I save the original Wave file to Aiff 24 bit/48.000 (using Audacity) to my desktop. Then I use Sound Studio (always in 24bit/48.000) to EQ, delete some parts, normalize etc when this is necessary. Then I move back to Audacity to resample and dither to 16/41.000. Last step is tracking and fade, with another software, of course. So we have lots of times that I have to save the same file. Sounds crazy, but I got used to that.

[Brian Skalinder]

Yes, it does sound crazy. 

I'm not sure I understand the first step:

save the original Wave file to Aiff 24 bit/48.000 (using Audacity) to my desktop

Are you recording directly to Audacity?  If so, then it makes sense to me.  But if you're recording to a recorder of some type (not your computer w/ Audacity), then I don't get it.  I assume the former (recording directly with Audacity), so just make sure you have Audacity configured to record and save (export) in the same format as the ADC in your recording chain.  And don't perform any edits without first confirming Audacity's configured properly for your goals.

As for the rest, I'd just make sure you know how Sound Studio and your tracking / fading application work.  For example, does SS perform all edits at 24-bit, or does it edit with 32bfp precision and then automatically dither back down to the file's initial bit-depth (24-bit) as part of each operation?  And if it's capable of 32bfp edits, and maintaining the file in 32bfp format until you're done editing, it may make sense to do so - the greater precision may yield better results over multiple edits.

[Dede2002]

Yes, it does sound crazy. 

I'm not sure I understand the first step:

save the original Wave file to Aiff 24 bit/48.000 (using Audacity) to my desktop

Are you recording directly to Audacity?  If so, then it makes sense to me.  But if you're recording to a recorder of some type (not your computer w/ Audacity), then I don't get it.  I assume the former (recording directly with Audacity), so just make sure you have Audacity configured to record and save (export) in the same format as the ADC in your recording chain.  And don't perform any edits without first confirming Audacity's configured properly for your goals.

As for the rest, I'd just make sure you know how Sound Studio and your tracking / fading application work.  For example, does SS perform all edits at 24-bit, or does it edit with 32bfp precision and then automatically dither back down to the file's initial bit-depth (24-bit) as part of each operation?  And if it's capable of 32bfp edits, and maintaining the file in 32bfp format until you're done editing, it may make sense to do so - the greater precision may yield better results over multiple edits.

Brian,

Thanks a lot for your patience. No, I use an Edirol R-09>MM BB>MM-HLSC-1. Let me try to explain the whole mess.
My tracking software does not work with WAVE, that's why my first step is open the file with Audacity and export the file as Aiff ( 24/48.000). I'm not sure about the 32 bit thing with SS. I'm sure the whole process  (after exporting the 24bit file in the first step) is all done in the 24 bit field. I do go back to Audacity to perform resample and dither to 16/41.000. After that I split the big file and aply fade.Yes,this is crazy. But does it damage the original sound quality?

[Brian Skalinder]

Thanks a lot for your patience. No, I use an Edirol R-09>MM BB>MM-HLSC-1. Let me try to explain the whole mess.
My tracking software does not work with WAVE, that's why my first step is open the file with Audacity and export the file as Aiff ( 24/48.000).

Ah, okay...I get it.

I'm not sure about the 32 bit thing with SS. I'm sure the whole process  (after exporting the 24bit file in the first step) is all done in the 24 bit field. I do go back to Audacity to perform resample and dither to 16/41.000. After that I split the big file and aply fade.Yes,this is crazy. But does it damage the original sound quality?

Whether or not the process damages the original sound quality depends on whether the file's bounced needlessly between different bit-depths.  SS probably performs its operations with 24-bit precision, in which case your process should be fine.  But I don't know for certain, since I'm not familiar with SS.

[Dede2002]

Brian,

Well, I hope so. It's just that I'm still looking for a software that I can use to perform everything I need.
Thanks. If you happend to come across any other info, please let me know.

[Dede2002]

Thanks a lot for your patience. No, I use an Edirol R-09>MM BB>MM-HLSC-1. Let me try to explain the whole mess.
My tracking software does not work with WAVE, that's why my first step is open the file with Audacity and export the file as Aiff ( 24/48.000).

Ah, okay...I get it.

I'm not sure about the 32 bit thing with SS. I'm sure the whole process  (after exporting the 24bit file in the first step) is all done in the 24 bit field. I do go back to Audacity to perform resample and dither to 16/41.000. After that I split the big file and aply fade.Yes,this is crazy. But does it damage the original sound quality?

Whether or not the process damages the original sound quality depends on whether the file's bounced needlessly between different bit-depths.  SS probably performs its operations with 24-bit precision, in which case your process should be fine.  But I don't know for certain, since I'm not familiar with SS.

T+

[hummat]

Sound Studio, from FeltTip?  That'll handle a .wav.

[Dede2002]

Sound Studio, from FeltTip?  That'll handle a .wav.

Yes, you're right. It's just that I use another (yes, another) software to perform tracking. As I said, it may sound crazy, but I choose to use the feature I feel more confortable with, even having to use lots of diferent softwares.
The  problem with Sound Studio (at least the one I have in my Mac) is the fact the it has the tendency to freeze right in the middle of processing. Sometimes you are almost done editing and it crashes, so you have to start the whole thing all over again. That's the main reason I keep saving the same file. From time to time, to avoid loosing everything, I save the file again.
Thanks for your post.

[bgalizio]

Which Sound Studio version are you using?

[nic]

what app are you using for tracking?
Sound Studio has always been the easiest/most straight forward for me, though I have never experienced any freezing or other issues with SS. ( I dont like tracking in Audacity)

[Dede2002]

Which Sound Studio version are you using?

The last one. Something like 3 or 3 point something.

[Dede2002]

what app are you using for tracking?
Sound Studio has always been the easiest/most straight forward for me, though I have never experienced any freezing or other issues with SS. ( I dont like tracking in Audacity)

I use CD Spin Doctor for tracking. No need to click here and there, markers etc. You select a small track in a big file with you mouse and save it to your desktop. Simple as that. An you can move the cursor during playback.
The freezing issue happens to me all the time with SS.
Thanks a lot for your reply!

[bgalizio]

I had a freezing issue with one update for SS, but reverting back helped out. It would freeze while resampling. Try downloading the newest 3.5 update and see if that helps. It works fine on my system.