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Author Topic: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)  (Read 119290 times)

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Offline Elvis Hitler

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Re: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)
« Reply #105 on: July 25, 2010, 07:35:37 AM »
Just tried out my new M10 on a local bar band last night and it sounds really good, even with my sub-par mics.  I tried two different mics -- an Aiwa CM-T7 stereo condenser, very similar to the Sony model pictured below, and my Sony ECM-907C shotgun that I use on my camcorder.   The condenser mic sounded better overall and seemed to produce the best sound when I positioned it straight up and down instead of pointing out horizontally.   The sound was best & had the most punch when the deck was peaking at about -6 dB.



Can't wait until I have enough cash to pick up a pair of CA-11's, I'm sure it will be a big improvement.

Offline fmaderjr

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Re: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)
« Reply #106 on: July 25, 2010, 09:55:14 AM »
Can't wait until I have enough cash to pick up a pair of CA-11's, I'm sure it will be a big improvement.

It sure will. My old recordings with a Sony ECM-907 still sound pretty good, but the bass is very thin and it was a pain in the ass to have to hold it while recording. CA-11's will be a big step up (more bass and better stereo separation) and are more convenient to use since you don't have to hold them.
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Offline spyder9

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Re: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)
« Reply #107 on: July 27, 2010, 01:41:38 PM »
Just joined Team M10.  Gave it a test run over the weekend.  Ran it head to head against the R09HR.  Will upload samples to the M10 vs R09HR thread this week.

Very impressed with the ADC.  Extremely clean.  Reminds me of the V3.  Transparent.  High frequencies much more recessed than the D50.  The main reason I dumped the D50 after 2 shows.  Little light in the low frequency department, however. 

Offline sparkey

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Re: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)
« Reply #108 on: July 27, 2010, 04:01:11 PM »
Little light in the low frequency department, however.

Dunno what kind of wire you're running into the box, but I lost my low end when using a cheapo rca to mini...ran digital into my receiver and, shaplam, I got full frequencies again.
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Offline spyder9

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Re: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)
« Reply #109 on: July 27, 2010, 07:17:37 PM »
Little light in the low frequency department, however.

Dunno what kind of wire you're running into the box, but I lost my low end when using a cheapo rca to mini...ran digital into my receiver and, shaplam, I got full frequencies again.

Littlebox with a Jensen transformer for output.  In comparison to the HR, its little light in the pants.  But the M10's bass sounds more accurate, not as bloated as the HR's.  Critical listening.   ;) 

Offline ts

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Re: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)
« Reply #110 on: July 28, 2010, 08:34:28 AM »
Little light in the low frequency department, however.

Dunno what kind of wire you're running into the box, but I lost my low end when using a cheapo rca to mini...ran digital into my receiver and, shaplam, I got full frequencies again.

 ??? sparkey, not sure i understand what you're saying. i use both a "cheapo" xlr to stereo mini and a "milspec" xlr to stereo mini from the mics to pre/batt box or directly to the M10 and have not noticed any difference in sound quality.

what about battery life? the manual says 23 hours at 24/48 with monitoring. has anyone verified this? anyone using lithium aa's?
« Last Edit: July 28, 2010, 09:29:57 AM by ts »

Offline rastasean

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Re: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)
« Reply #111 on: July 28, 2010, 09:40:00 AM »
Little light in the low frequency department, however.

Dunno what kind of wire you're running into the box, but I lost my low end when using a cheapo rca to mini...ran digital into my receiver and, shaplam, I got full frequencies again.

 ??? sparkey, not sure i understand what you're saying. i use both a "cheapo" xlr to stereo mini and a "milspec" xlr to stereo mini from the mics to pre/batt box or directly to the M10 and have not noticed any difference in sound quality.

what about battery life? the manual says 23 hours at 24/48 with monitoring. has anyone verified this? anyone using lithium aa's?

the battery life is VERY good. 23 continues hours would take up 22 gigs at 24/48 so anyone have a 36gig card they want to test this out on? I have had the original batteries since I bought the recorder back in may/june.
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Offline jiawa

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Re: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)
« Reply #112 on: August 01, 2010, 11:52:58 AM »
Hello everyone! I am new here. I ordered mine last Thursday from B&H and got it on Friday. I like it a lot. Believe or not, I found this site yesterday and went throught part 1-3 quickly.

I have a few quick questions here. Please forgive me if they were asked (I am sure they were :) ) before.

- Can someone give me a quick guide on the setting of the mic level (Hi vs Low), and the recording level (auto vs manual). Which setting should I use? I am going to use this mainly to record violin solo (coupld fo feet for just violin or maybe 3-4 feet with the piano) and chamber music such as a string quartet ( maybe 3-4 feet away from each player) all using just internal mics.

- Should I always try to record in the highest quality of WAV? Or the mp3 should be OK? What's the best way to convert from WAV to mp3?

- I think 4GB is enough for me to record anything. But I'd also like to use this as a mp3 player. The funcions of changing speed, key and the A-B repeating are realy handy. Should I get a microSDHC or M2 card ( I am thinking about 16GB so I can load a lots of music onto it)? Any suggestion on the brand/model?

Many thanks!


Offline rastasean

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Re: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)
« Reply #113 on: August 01, 2010, 04:24:59 PM »
I have recorded a lot of spoken word and conservations so my answer to your first question applies to that.
I have my on high sensitivity and manual gain. for music, I think manual gain and low sensitivity would work fine. Do you have a pre-amp? What mics are you using-internal/built in?

recording at 24/48 is what the majority of people do. The recorder can do 24/96 but unless you can hear the difference, go with 24/48 and you'll still be able to hold a lot on your built in 4 gigs.

4 gigs at 24/48 will last about 4 hours handy calculator
Personally I wouldn't use the m10 as an mp3 player but you certainly are able to.  I got a micro SD sandisk 16 gig card for $10-20 more than I should have paid so don't be foolish and pay that much. ;)

check out this card:

SanDisk 16 GB Class 2 microSDHC Flash Memory Card




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Offline rastasean

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Re: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)
« Reply #114 on: August 01, 2010, 04:25:59 PM »
Just joined Team M10.  Gave it a test run over the weekend.  Ran it head to head against the R09HR.  Will upload samples to the M10 vs R09HR thread this week.

Very impressed with the ADC.  Extremely clean.  Reminds me of the V3.  Transparent.  High frequencies much more recessed than the D50.  The main reason I dumped the D50 after 2 shows.  Little light in the low frequency department, however.

Did you know there are effects to increase the bass...in playback. its in the effects menu, bass1 or bass2 or off.
Advice is a form of nostalgia, dispensing it is a way of fishing the past from the disposal, wiping it off, painting over the ugly parts and recycling it for more than it’s worth.

Offline mloewen

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Re: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)
« Reply #115 on: August 01, 2010, 05:29:08 PM »
Hello everyone! I am new here. I ordered mine last Thursday from B&H and got it on Friday. I like it a lot. Believe or not, I found this site yesterday and went throught part 1-3 quickly.

I have a few quick questions here. Please forgive me if they were asked (I am sure they were :) ) before.

- Can someone give me a quick guide on the setting of the mic level (Hi vs Low), and the recording level (auto vs manual). Which setting should I use? I am going to use this mainly to record violin solo (coupld fo feet for just violin or maybe 3-4 feet with the piano) and chamber music such as a string quartet ( maybe 3-4 feet away from each player) all using just internal mics.

- Should I always try to record in the highest quality of WAV? Or the mp3 should be OK? What's the best way to convert from WAV to mp3?

- I think 4GB is enough for me to record anything. But I'd also like to use this as a mp3 player. The funcions of changing speed, key and the A-B repeating are realy handy. Should I get a microSDHC or M2 card ( I am thinking about 16GB so I can load a lots of music onto it)? Any suggestion on the brand/model?

Many thanks!
I agree with recording at 24/48 . You will need to convert it to 16/44.1 if you want to burn it to cd .  Once you are familiar with everything you may want to use a program to make changes to the wave. A good program would be Audacity. You can find advise on this site about it. It is fairly user friendly. You can also use it to convert to mp3. You could also use Cd Wave Editor to split your recording into tracks and convert it to mp3. If you look around the forum you can get lots of useful knowledge. use the search before you ask a lot of questions that are well covered already then ask questions when you get confused about stuff.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2010, 05:41:16 PM by mloewen »

Offline earmonger

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Re: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)
« Reply #116 on: August 01, 2010, 08:50:33 PM »
- Can someone give me a quick guide on the setting of the mic level (Hi vs Low), and the recording level (auto vs manual). Which setting should I use? I am going to use this mainly to record violin solo (couple of feet for just violin or maybe 3-4 feet with the piano) and chamber music such as a string quartet ( maybe 3-4 feet away from each player) all using just internal mics.


Use manual level.  Auto is for something unmusical like speech, where it's not important to preserve dynamics. Do put the Limiter on, just in case you do briefly overload, but it's better if you never need it.

Use low sensitivity just to give you more headroom if things get loud. High is most useful for speech.

You're going to need to do some tests on what the best level is, which will depend on how close the unit (since you're using internal mics) is to your music, how resonant your room is and, well, how loud you play. Classical music has a wide dynamic range, so set your levels to work at fortissimo. Even with the unit at a little distance, you should be able to see green lights go on when you are getting a nice full signal and red lights when you overload.  But you didn't even really need the green light--just under the green-light level will give you a good recording.

Start testing at about 6, which is unity gain--playback is the same level as what goes in.

You also need to test where you place the unit for recording.  Placement makes a huge difference. You don't want it right next to one particular instrument (unless you're trying to hear your violin part within the quartet), and if it's too far away in a resonant room you're going to get a blurry sounding recording. This is why there are recording engineers (who often blend close-miking for clarity and more distant miking for warmth). As your own engineer, you can learn a lot from a little bit of testing. Try just speaking the labels when you test--"5 feet from quartet," "10 feet from quartet," "at center of quartet"--or make sure you're taking good notes so you can make sense of your test samples.

What are you doing with your recordings? If they are just rough rehearsal tapes for further practice, you could even record mp3 at 320 kbps, and that 4GB will give you a whole lot of recording time.  If you are planning to do something further and more professional with the recordings, or you want as much detail as possible, then yes, move on up to .wav. There are lots of programs to convert .wav to .mp3. Media Coder at http://www.mediacoderhq.com/ is free and handy.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2010, 08:56:15 PM by earmonger »

Offline jiawa

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Re: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)
« Reply #117 on: August 02, 2010, 10:36:48 AM »
I have recorded a lot of spoken word and conservations so my answer to your first question applies to that.
I have my on high sensitivity and manual gain. for music, I think manual gain and low sensitivity would work fine. Do you have a pre-amp? What mics are you using-internal/built in?

recording at 24/48 is what the majority of people do. The recorder can do 24/96 but unless you can hear the difference, go with 24/48 and you'll still be able to hold a lot on your built in 4 gigs.

4 gigs at 24/48 will last about 4 hours handy calculator
Personally I wouldn't use the m10 as an mp3 player but you certainly are able to.  I got a micro SD sandisk 16 gig card for $10-20 more than I should have paid so don't be foolish and pay that much. ;)

check out this card:

SanDisk 16 GB Class 2 microSDHC Flash Memory Card

Thanks! I am using the built-in mics for now and will play with the manual + low setting.
I have set it to 24/48.
Will think more if I am going to use it as a mp3 player or not.


Offline audBall

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Re: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)
« Reply #118 on: August 02, 2010, 10:53:14 AM »
Has anyone here run V2 (rca out) > M10?

Also, are right-angle mini's generally preferred?  Would going straight-in 1/8" be too 'bulky' (using that term loosely)?
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Offline jiawa

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Re: Sony PCM-M10 (Part 3)
« Reply #119 on: August 02, 2010, 11:06:51 AM »
- Can someone give me a quick guide on the setting of the mic level (Hi vs Low), and the recording level (auto vs manual). Which setting should I use? I am going to use this mainly to record violin solo (couple of feet for just violin or maybe 3-4 feet with the piano) and chamber music such as a string quartet ( maybe 3-4 feet away from each player) all using just internal mics.
Use manual level.  Auto is for something unmusical like speech, where it's not important to preserve dynamics. Do put the Limiter on, just in case you do briefly overload, but it's better if you never need it.

Thank you so much for such a detail and clear instruction!
I actually did some tests before I saw your reply. Your answer really lighted me up so I know what to do next.

Here is what I am thinking:

- Use 24/48, or mp3 at 320 kbps;
- Use manual level;
- Use low sensitivity;
- Turn on the Limiter. How about the LCF?
- Test the recording level by changing the dial starting at 6;
- Test the distance and the placement of the unit.

Most of the recordings will be for just rough rehearsal as you mentioned. I may also use some for Youtube video and may do some serious recording at some point.

Thanks again!

 

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