Topic: Which has better sounding ADC, R-09HR or M-10???

[F.O.Bean]

SSIA, I need to buy one of them to run super lo-pro w/ my MBHO>Lil' Box>R9HR/M10 and was wondering which is preferred. I really like how the R09/R09HR have a HOLD button, that means ALOT to me. I will prob get a Tinybox as well and run MBHO>TinyBox>R9HR/M10 as well.......

[Todd R]

Just marking since I'm curious about this as well, esp re feedback from someone who has used both.

The m10 does have a hold button though from what I remember.  It just is that the m10 hold doesn't stop changes in the level wheel.  The level control is protected a bit so it is hard to change accidentally during open taping instances.  More of an issue I think for stealth use when people might be shoving the m10 in and out of pockets.

[rastasean]

I think it is very close. One mark against the 09hr is that when you adjust the gain, it makes a very quiet clicking or popping noise. Its hardly noticeable and you just have to remember to set levels and cut that off when you track it out.
With that said, I like the 09hrs display because its 'always' lit up which would make it nice in stealth situations since you don't need to press a button to turn the screen on.

We already know the mics make the largest difference in the chain so enjoy whichever record you end up getting.

[Chris K]

Having used both I prefer the M10. I just think it sounds better to me going line in as well as using the onboard mics.

The battery life on the M10 is stellar, and I prefer the line in jack on the top of the M10 to the R09HR's input on the side near the level buttons (the original R09 had the input on top also). The M10 does have a hold switch. The level wheel on my unit is pretty stiff and a small piece of gaff tape can help secure the wheel so as to prevent accidental turning and level adjustment. Also the M10 has a setting for the backlight to remain on full time which I just discovered about a month ago.     . 

In the end you can't go wrong with either the R09HR or the M10.

[F.O.Bean]

Thanks guys. I might go w/ an R09 for cheap........

[OOK]

I think it is very close. One mark against the 09hr is that when you adjust the gain, it makes a very quiet clicking or popping noise. Its hardly noticeable and you just have to remember to set levels and cut that off when you track it out.
With that said, I like the 09hrs display because its 'always' lit up which would make it nice in stealth situations since you don't need to press a button to turn the screen on.

We already know the mics make the largest difference in the chain so enjoy whichever record you end up getting.

isn't that when you are using the internal mics?  I have never heard it going line or mic in?

OOK

[F.O.Bean]

Ummm, what kind of runtimes does one get w/ the R09/R09HR I will be using Energizer 2300mah AA's I can get an R09 for really cheap and would like to get AT LEAST 5-6 hrs per set of 2xAA's And does the R09 have a HOLD button like the R09HR

[rastasean]

OOK

Line in does it, too.

[Gutbucket]

Ummm, what kind of runtimes does one get w/ the R09/R09HR I will be using Energizer 2300mah AA's I can get an R09 for really cheap and would like to get AT LEAST 5-6 hrs per set of 2xAA's And does the R09 have a HOLD button like the R09HR

The original R-09 gets 5-6 hrs and has a full-hold switch.
If you get one search for the thread on how to access the hidden menus where you can turn off the red recording light among other things.

I still use mine regularly.

My favorite 'hold' switch system of all the small handhelds I've used is on the Tascam DR2d- Hold locks all functions on the recorder itself, but the small IR remote still functions, allowing: record, pause, stop, and level adjustment by simply pointing the remote at the top of the recorder and monitoring the small LED recording light.  Perfect combination.  ADC, preamps and internal mics are all superior to the original R-09 and it goes for just $200 new.  However, I don't recomend it over the others mentioned here for simple 2 channel stereo recording use because of the short battery run-time.  Otherwise it's great and offers a form of 4 channel recording as well, which is it's real strong point.

[F.O.Bean]

Ummm, what kind of runtimes does one get w/ the R09/R09HR I will be using Energizer 2300mah AA's I can get an R09 for really cheap and would like to get AT LEAST 5-6 hrs per set of 2xAA's And does the R09 have a HOLD button like the R09HR

The original R-09 gets 5-6 hrs and has a full-hold switch.
If you get one search for the thread on how to access the hidden menus where you can turn off the red recording light among other things.

I still use mine regularly.

My favorite 'hold' switch system of all the small handhelds I've used is on the Tascam DR2d- Hold locks all functions on the recorder itself, but the small IR remote still functions, allowing: record, pause, stop, and level adjustment by simply pointing the remote at the top of the recorder and monitoring the small LED recording light.  Perfect combination.  ADC, preamps and internal mics are all superior to the original R-09 and it goes for just $200 new.  However, I don't recomend it over the others mentioned here for simple 2 channel stereo recording use because of the short battery run-time.  Otherwise it's great and offers a form of 4 channel recording as well, which is it's real strong point.

Which recorder were you referring to when you said it has a short battery runtime  The R09 or R09HR or the M10

And I thought the R09HR had the hidden menu and not the original R09

Sorry for all the questions, but I never paid attention to these handheld recorders because I had a 722

So I should be able to get 5-6hrs w/ 2x2300mah AA's Thats plenty as I WILL NOT be using this setup outdoors, thats what my 722 is for

[F.O.Bean]

And what type of card does the R09 take MicroSD, SD, SDHC, etc............ And what is the biggest capacity card that works w/ the R09? 16GB or does a 32GB card work too

[F.O.Bean]

And is the R09 considered just as good as the R09HR, and just the sample rate is different, or should I save up and get an R09HR? I can get an R09 for really cheap and I'm guna pull the trigger on it soon I think, but I just wanted some answers to some questions I had to ask 1st

[OFOTD]

Bean save yourself all of this and just buy the Sony.   It outperforms the R09/HR in a vast majority of taping points.   There is a reason so many R09/HR's went up for sale in the YS and ebay once the M10 came out.

[F.O.Bean]

Bean save yourself all of this and just buy the Sony.   It outperforms the R09/HR in a vast majority of taping points.   There is a reason so many R09/HR's went up for sale in the YS and ebay once the M10 came out.

Chances are I will end up w/ both. but I can get an r09 cheap and i have the $$ for it in my pocket. It will hold me over til I can come up w/ the 230 an M10 costs Once I have both I'll sell the one I dont prefer

That sounds like the way I should go

[F.O.Bean]

and do both the m10 and the r09/r09hr all take the same kind of card? What kind of card does each one take

[su6oxone]

and do both the m10 and the r09/r09hr all take the same kind of card? What kind of card does each one take

The M10 uses micro SDHC (or Sony's M2 format) and the R-09HR uses SDHC.  The only thing I really like about the R-09HR over the M10 is that you can attach a neck strap to the top hole of the R-09HR and hang it around your neck.  It's the easiest way to stealth a small recorder IMO and the side line-in jack is useful for that kind of setup.  The M10 is better in most other ways though, and I do like it better overall. 

[F.O.Bean]

and do both the m10 and the r09/r09hr all take the same kind of card? What kind of card does each one take

The M10 uses micro SDHC (or Sony's M2 format) and the R-09HR uses SDHC.  The only thing I really like about the R-09HR over the M10 is that you can attach a neck strap to the top hole of the R-09HR and hang it around your neck.  It's the easiest way to stealth a small recorder IMO and the side line-in jack is useful for that kind of setup.  The M10 is better in most other ways though, and I do like it better overall. 

So the R09 AND the R09HR BOTH use SDHC Whats the max capacity card that the original R09 will use And I thought the R09 had the Line-In on the TOP of the recorder?

[su6oxone]

Yeah they both use SDHC cards, up to 32gb I think.  The R-09 has a top line-in jack and the HR has a side line-in jack.

[F.O.Bean]

Yeah they both use SDHC cards, up to 32gb I think.  The R-09 has a top line-in jack and the HR has a side line-in jack.

+T my man

I'm DEFINITELY buying one for really cheap, at least IMO I'll have my Lil' Box in about 3 weeks too I am getting a Dual Rt-Angle RCA>Stereo 1/8" to go from Lil' Box>R09, but that will prob be done around when the R09 is done! And I also have to buy an SDHC Card and a bunch of new Energizer batteries. Oh and also a 'SMART' AA charger like I used to have, that cycles the batteries until theyre at max capacity

[Teen Age Riot]

I've used a 16gb card in both my R-09 and R-09HR without any problems. Never tried a 32gb because they were still rather pricey at the time.

[F.O.Bean]

I've used a 16gb card in both my R-09 and R-09HR without any problems. Never tried a 32gb because they were still rather pricey at the time.

Thanks, since this is only my indoor setup its really a moot point because I'll most likely be recording 4-5hrs MAX per night. I have my 722 and 9 x 4500mah 7.2v RC Batteries for outdoor taping and festivals....

I could prob get away w/ just having an 8GB Card......Anyone want to trade an 8GB CF Card[mine] for an 8GB SDHC Card[yours] My 8GB CF Card has only been in my 722 and in its case, so I'd say its in good to excellent condition......

[sunjan]

And is the R09 considered just as good as the R09HR, and just the sample rate is different...

Bean, sample rates are the same, but you should search for some comparison graphs made by guysonic and digifish (IIRC) from when the R-09HR was released.
There was a noticable difference between R-09 and R-09HR. Better S/N ratio, less self noise on the HR model...

[aaronji]

^^^ The R09HR has 88.2 and 96 kHz sampling rates; I thought the original R09 only went up to 48 kHz?

[willndmb]

and do both the m10 and the r09/r09hr all take the same kind of card? What kind of card does each one take

The M10 uses micro SDHC (or Sony's M2 format) and the R-09HR uses SDHC.  The only thing I really like about the R-09HR over the M10 is that you can attach a neck strap to the top hole of the R-09HR and hang it around your neck.  It's the easiest way to stealth a small recorder IMO and the side line-in jack is useful for that kind of setup.  The M10 is better in most other ways though, and I do like it better overall. 

So the R09 AND the R09HR BOTH use SDHC Whats the max capacity card that the original R09 will use And I thought the R09 had the Line-In on the TOP of the recorder?

[Gutbucket]

Original R-09 records to SDHCs of up to to 32gb
Has the input jacks on top (use a right angle mini jack cord)
Tops out at 48khz (higher is available via the hidden menus, but not confirmed to be glitch free or to actually capture frequencies above 22kHz)
Has digital optical out (a unique feature not on most other handhelds that most people don't care about)
Works just nicely with an external preamp > line-input (or into the mic-input).
Is somewhat lacking compared to the others using the mic input due to noisier gain.
Is lacking even more compared to the others using the internal mics (honestly they suck).

Use it with an external preamp and you're all good.

Things I like about the original R-09: it's menu and ease of use simplicity, it's smaller B&W screen, screen remains lit, push-button stepped gain, inputs on top, digital out (yes I use that), 32GB sdhc, standard AA power, acceptable run-time.

[F.O.Bean]

Original R-09 records to SDHCs of up to to 32gb
Has the input jacks on top (use a right angle mini jack cord)
Tops out at 48khz (higher is available via the hidden menus, but not confirmed to be glitch free or to actually capture frequencies above 22kHz)
Has digital optical out (a unique feature not on most other handhelds that most people don't care about)
Works just nicely with an external preamp > line-input (or into the mic-input).
Is somewhat lacking compared to the others using the mic input due to noisier gain.
Is lacking even more compared to the others using the internal mics (honestly they suck).

Use it with an external preamp and you're all good.

Things I like about the original R-09: it's menu and ease of use simplicity, it's smaller B&W screen, screen remains lit, push-button stepped gain, inputs on top, digital out (yes I use that), 32GB sdhc, standard AA power, acceptable run-time.

Thanks, yeah thats what I like about it and why I bought one instead of the M-10(also money was  a factor )

[F.O.Bean]

Can ANYONE on ts.com epoxy my Line-In jack on my newly acquired R09

[fmaderjr]

Is lacking even more compared to the others using the internal mics (honestly they suck).
Use it with an external preamp and you're all good.

R-09 internals are just awful, while the M10's are quite good (other than poor stereo image). I taped a couple songs with the R-09's internals once and could tell in seconds how poor they were.

However, I then sent it to Chris Church for the Micsketeer mod (about $130, I think, with the option to get both card & omni caps) and now have a recorder with incredible internals with a choice of caps. Sounds just like a recording with CA-11's > battery box > R-09 mic in (again except for stereo image issues, since you can't separate the mics). Great for loud stuff, but wouldn't be too good for real quiet stuff-you need an external pre with the R-09 for that.

I'm sure Bean will be real happy using littlebox > R-09. I'd be surprised if the difference between that & littlebox > R-09HR was audible in the vast majority of cases.

[F.O.Bean]

Thanks for the info

[jbell]

Chris Church will do it, but you have to deal with the expense of international shipping!  I would just get a right angle 1/8 plug and be careful.

Can ANYONE on ts.com epoxy my Line-In jack on my newly acquired R09

[Gutbucket]

Chris Church will do it, but you have to deal with the expense of international shipping!  I would just get a right angle 1/8 plug and be careful.

Can ANYONE on ts.com epoxy my Line-In jack on my newly acquired R09

Is it broken or as a preventative measure?

I epoxied my 1st R-09 as a preventative measure after Edirol repaired it.   That was 5 years ago, no problems since.
I bought a second R-09 after they had reportedly fixed the problem (4years back?) and that one is still going strong, never epoxied.

If your line-input is broken and you are using an external preamp you can switch to the mic-input jack at low sensitivity and run it around level 10 without much sonic difference as far as I can tell.  I did that for a few months before getting mine repaired.  In that case it may be an early unit prone to breakage and you may want to open it up and epoxy the mic-input before it breaks too.

A small right angle input cable helps reduce stress on the jack as you probably know, as does running the cable through the case or gaff-taping it to the recorder.

[F.O.Bean]

Chris Church will do it, but you have to deal with the expense of international shipping!  I would just get a right angle 1/8 plug and be careful.

Can ANYONE on ts.com epoxy my Line-In jack on my newly acquired R09

Is it broken or as a preventative measure?

I epoxied my 1st R-09 as a preventative measure after Edirol repaired it.   That was 5 years ago, no problems since.
I bought a second R-09 after they had reportedly fixed the problem (4years back?) and that one is still going strong, never epoxied.

If your line-input is broken and you are using an external preamp you can switch to the mic-input jack at low sensitivity and run it around level 10 without much sonic difference as far as I can tell.  I did that for a few months before getting mine repaired.  In that case it may be an early unit prone to breakage and you may want to open it up and epoxy the mic-input before it breaks too.

A small right angle input cable helps reduce stress on the jack as you probably know, as does running the cable through the case or gaff-taping it to the recorder.

Preventative measure The seller says its fine right now but I'm not sure if they fixed the one I'm buying or if its one of those early ones that had the issues

And yes, I'm getting a custom RCA>rt-angle 1/8" cable made so that should help.