Topic: Which Portable Recording machine ?

[furkin]

Do you know anybody traveling to or from the US?  If so, have them hand carry it back to you.

No mate - I wish I did .

Havn't got a lot of time to wait either. I really want to get out before Autumn (Fall) kicks in.

[RichT]

I had my PCM-M10 shipped from the states to the UK. Even with vat, shippping and duty it's much cheaper. It would need to be sent back to the US if it went wrong under warranty though

[rastasean]

Occasionally there are Europeans who sell their equipment in the yard sale, so you may want to post an ISO or review the yard sale posts to see if anything is available for you. The LS-11 model I have read is pretty good but I've never used it. Is is available at your country?

[furkin]

RichT:
That's another thing with importing a single item - warranty returns. Not sure if the initial saving would be worth it.

Rastasean:
I'm not a fan of buying used electronic gear, especially when I'm not sure what it is etc.
Yep – the LS-11 is available here in the UK.  The write-ups that I’ve read seem to make it a great item.  I was rather hoping that you guys had picked it against the M10 as it’s cheaper, & seems – to my very limited mind – to be slightly better.
It looks better too, but I won’t be buying on ‘looks’ ! 

Whatever I buy will be a learning curve. I’ll be learning as much from it as anything else.

ALTERNATIVES:
Do any of these machines come close to the LS-11 & M-10 ?
Zoom H2 -         £150
Tascam DR-05   £100
Tascam DR-07   £140
Roland R-05      £170.

MIC’s: 
I’ll leave the external mic debate until I decide on which machine.

B

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PS:
Anything sound wrong with this unknown kit ? Am embarrassed to tell you the price yet !

Handheld SD recorder with stereo and four-capsule omni pickup patterns
Record 44.1/48kHz, 64�320kbps MP3 and 16/24-bit WAV
Four on-board mics with high, low, and auto gain for overload-free recordings
Bass compensation, Chorus, Pitch Shift, Delay, Reverb, MP3 Voice enhance, Vocal cut and Tuning
Inputs for connecting 1/8-inch (3.5mm) mic and line-level audio
Stereo 1/8-inch (3.5mm) headphone output and built-in monitoring speaker
Includes SD card; works with virtually all SD cards up to 16GB
USB jack for mass storage connection to Mac and PC
AC/DC operation on 2 AA batteries (included)
Threaded mounting point for table-top and stand-mounted applications
Record more than 10 hours using fresh alkaline batteries

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[John Willett]

Thanks guys,

I'm in the U.K. 
The PCM M10 is £280 here - that's a whopping 445 US $ !

I reckon if I could get one for $229 - or £140 - I'd grab it.

We also have a problem importing stuff.  Importing anything over £18 ($29.30) we have to pay our lousy government VAT of 20% of price, for doing bugger all, plus our postal service more money for being kind enough to collect the VAT from us !
This isn't just for Business or New stuff, but also personal & private things.

Before any Brits chime in with "why it's a good idea" please don't - heard it all before & still don't agree - leave me with my opinion.

cheers

Do you know anybody travelling to or from the US?  If so, have them hand carry it back to you.

But don't forget that if you need it fixed under guarantee you will have to ship it back to the USA.

[swordfish]

Thanks guys,

I'm in the U.K. 
The PCM M10 is £280 here - that's a whopping 445 US $ !

I reckon if I could get one for $229 - or £140 - I'd grab it.

We also have a problem importing stuff.  Importing anything over £18 ($29.30) we have to pay our lousy government VAT of 20% of price, for doing bugger all, plus our postal service more money for being kind enough to collect the VAT from us !
This isn't just for Business or New stuff, but also personal & private things.

Before any Brits chime in with "why it's a good idea" please don't - heard it all before & still don't agree - leave me with my opinion.

cheers

Do you know anybody travelling to or from the US?  If so, have them hand carry it back to you.

But don't forget that if you need it fixed under guarantee you will have to ship it back to the USA.

That's what happened to my M10 ....its with B&H or Sony or with the extended warrenty company for 3 month now....the warrenty will be expired when it returns to Germany...

[rastasean]

Honestly you should have NO fears buying used equipment from just about anyone on this board. Often times the gear is better taken care of than ourselves. I have bought a good majority of my taping stuff used from people on this board and its in great condition. I can understand the desire to buy new but don't think we beat our equipment up and abuse it.

I doubt you will find too many people who own/use both the ls11 and m10 since they appear to be very comparable machines. Often times people wouldn't have a need to buy hardware that's almost identical, so if it looks good to you, I would suggest getting it and start using it before autumn starts.

[it-goes-to-eleven]

You should seek out the Nature Recordists mailing list on yahoo.

There are ways to do what you want on a budget.

A Sony M10 with some inexpensive high gain mics based on the primo 172 or 173 capsules would be one option.  The primo's are very affordable and are decent.  That model is an omni and it has a lot of built-in gain.

You could go with a less expensive recorder, but they are typically more noisy and would require an external preamp.

[F.O.Bean]

For doing 2 channel work, I would ALWAYS go w/ a Sony M10

[Fried Chicken Boy]

ALTERNATIVES:
Do any of these machines come close to the LS-11 & M-10 ?
Zoom H2 -         £150
Tascam DR-05   £100
Tascam DR-07   £140
Roland R-05      £170.

Out of the alternatives you have listed, I would definitely consider the Roland R-05.  One of the newer contenders in the portable recorder market, it's made by the same company that makes the Edirol R-09HR and R-09 which have both been successfully and extensively field-tested by TS members and others.

pnoman, a member here, did some testing on the R-05 and favorably compared its specs to the Sony M-10 and Edirol R-09HR.  The thread about it is HERE.  Do a forum search and you'll find a bunch of other threads regarding the R-05.

It's also been mentioned by a few European members of this forum that the R-05 is the way to go in light of the M-10's pricetag.

[furkin]

O.K folks,
I've narrowed it down to either:
Roland R-05    - £160
Tascam DR-05 - £100.
for the time being.
I was about to go for Roland, but wondering if it's worth 50% more than the Tascam.

As you know, I don't know anything about the features & terminology, but need to know what makes Roland worth the extra,,,, if indeed anything ?


thanks again

[dogmusic]

O.K folks,
I've narrowed it down to either:
Roland R-05    - £160
Tascam DR-05 - £100.
for the time being.
I was about to go for Roland, but wondering if it's worth 50% more than the Tascam.

As you know, I don't know anything about the features & terminology, but need to know what makes Roland worth the extra,,,, if indeed anything ?


thanks again

I've used the DR05 and I think it's a pretty good unit. I think you'd be happy with it. Put the extra money into external mics and a battery box. You'll be surprised how good things will sound.

[Fried Chicken Boy]

If you were recording rock concerts or music, I'd say the Tascam DR-05 would be fine for you.  However, since you said you will mostly be recording outdoor and nature sources (ie: not as loud as concerts) you might want to take the preamps of the two recorders into consideration.  It's my understanding the preamp on the Roland is much quieter than that of the Tascam.  Quieter preamps will introduce less self-noise (hiss) to your recording, especially noticeable on quieter sources.  Specs for both are on Avisoft HERE.

[furkin]

Thanks guys,
My initial use for this item, is ambient outdoor / wildlife / nature recording, in stereo.
As I want a pretty good separation, I want to use external mic's - set apart.

For the moment, that needs to be my main objective.

I am imagining that lots of time will be quite quiet,,,, maybe the odd owl call, possibly bat sonar, insects etc, so I don't want to record loads of background machine noise/hiss etc.

I also need to take the interface into account – have read that some recorders have bad connections. Snow good buying anything that will only pick up arc’ing, clicking,,,, or nothing at all.

Of course,,,,, the recorder is only the beginning,,,,,,

[dlh]

I've read this thread. Just thought I'd add my .02.
File this away for future reference.
In the Naturerecordists group in Yahoo, the Rode Nt1 is very popular because of its low self-noise (5dB I think).
So two of those paired with an fr2LE would be a great setup.  I know that's out of your price range right now, but just something to keep in mind.
I have an fr2LE that I use with an AT BP4025 for nature stuff and it's pretty impressive, with a self-noise of 14dB. I bet the sound with the Rodes is amazing.

Here's some stuff on the 4025:
http://www.soundsurvey.org.uk/index.php/survey/blog_comments/1081/

Dave