Topic: Upgrade from the zoom h2

[stuckie27]

Here is were I am personally.

I bought an H2 this last fall (for shock! over 300 dollars, got it in Norway). Anyways, I got an incredible recording of a concert right off the bat, but it was a quiet ~110-120 dB show. Then as time went on I did some more recordings and I was not getting the quality I wanted out of the thing. Every concert recording sounded like it was under water (lots of bass, no highs, easily distorting) Given I was using the internal mics and I had the recorder in my pocket by my belt usually, which in my assumption would lead to some natural low pass filtering because of all the body mass in a crowd. (does that sound right?).

Here is what I want:
I would like to be able to have the recorder in my pocket for those spur of the moment audio tidbits. That means internal mics (right?)
I would really like to be portable (DS-50 is too big)
I am thinking more after reading the post here that I might need two different rigs (one with external mics for concerts) and just the recorder to keep on my person all of the time.

What do you guys suggest?
What is this R-09 Church Mod?
Are the small snipe/clip on mics at all worth while?
Am I being too picky?

[sunjan]

I bought an H2 this last fall (for shock! over 300 dollars, got it in Norway). Anyways, I got an incredible recording of a concert right off the bat, but it was a quiet ~110-120 dB show. Then as time went on I did some more recordings and I was not getting the quality I wanted out of the thing. Every concert recording sounded like it was under water (lots of bass, no highs, easily distorting) Given I was using the internal mics and I had the recorder in my pocket by my belt usually, which in my assumption would lead to some natural low pass filtering because of all the body mass in a crowd. (does that sound right?).

Here is what I want:
I would like to be able to have the recorder in my pocket for those spur of the moment audio tidbits. That means internal mics (right?)
I would really like to be portable (DS-50 is too big)
I am thinking more after reading the post here that I might need two different rigs (one with external mics for concerts) and just the recorder to keep on my person all of the time.

What is this R-09 Church Mod?
Are the small snipe/clip on mics at all worth while?

Hej Stuckie, T+ for taping in Scandinavia!

If the H2 was inside your pocket, at waist-level, during the gigs, no wonder you get muffled sound!
Try stooping down next time you're at a gig. Put your head at waist level: what do you hear?! Obviously, the soundwaves from the PA are obstructed. For any recording, you would want a free path between the source and your mics.

For instant non-gig taping, you can whip your H2 out of your pocket at any time and just record your surroundings with the internals. If you want to use it (or any all-in-one unit) at a gig, you need to hold it where the mics can catch the best possible sound (ie out inte the open, not inside your pocket). Or better, you need to get external mics, body/hat-mounted.

If you've read the reviews, the H2 doesn't perform great with external mics. You can either replace it with another recorder, or just keep it for spontaneous everyday recording.
As a second rig, you shold then look for something stealthable that works better with externals. R09/R09HR + the Church Combo springs to my mind, but there are lots of options. Anything from the H120 ($170) up to the Korg MR-1 ($6-700)

If you replace the H2 for an R09/R09HR alltogether, you'd be using the internals for everyday taping, but still go for external mics for concerts, right?
In that case you might not need the R09 internals mod, but the choice is yours. It depends what ambient sounds your capturing, and what you use them for. Here is Church's thread:
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,98290.0.html

Regarding clips for external mics, it all depends which mics you get and how you intend to mount them. Take a look at the rig pics and get some inspiration...

[cybergaloot]

If you've read the reviews, the H2 doesn't perform great with external mics. You can either replace it with another recorder, or just keep it for spontaneous everyday recording.

The preamps for the external mic input aren't good but I have had success using a Church-Audio CA-9000 preamp (CA-9100 is better) and his CA-11 mics running into the line-in on the H2. Needless to say there are better rigs but you can get passable results that way.

If you can record openly you might invest in a stand and, if that is too bulky, you can rig a lighter, more easily portable stand out of a cheap photographic monopod.

I've also gotten some ok recordings by putting the H2 in my shirt pocket (put it into the black storage bag if you must be discreet) but you have to have a clear line of sight to the PA speakers. It will pickup rustling from the clothing if you move around though.

[stevetoney]

Agreed with the above.  One thing I'd add is that, while I'm no expert, if I go by intuition I'd say that your assumption on low pass filtering is basically flawed.  It seems to me that low freqency sound has more energy than high...which is why we hear the bass only from a long distance away from an amplified show.  So, I think the same holds true close in, that the high frequency sounds would not make it through body mass like low frequencies.

Other than that, I agree with the others although I would say that it is possible to get a decent sound with your stuff at waist level if you were standing directly in front of the PA and there was little or no obstruction between the mics and the speakers...make sure you wear hearing protection though!

[John Willett]

For this "carry everywhere" use, I went for the Olympus LS-10.