Topic: Stand - Shure S15A or Manfrotto BAC1004?

[jaycdunn]

Sorry for posting a new thread, but I need to make a decision today and figured I'd get more opinions this way. I'm clear on the different threading options now, so I can adapt either stand to whatever gear I'm using. Which stand do you like better? I've read that the Shure telescoping sections are a PITA to deal with, but that it's a solid stand. OTOH, most tapers seem to love their Manfrottos, but one guy said that his fell apart over time, piece by piece. He recommended an AEA stand. I didn't see it on the Sonic Sense website. Maybe I should just call Wes Dooley, but I doubt I can reach him on a Sunday.

[taperj]

I can't speak about the particular model you're looking at but I know I have been extremely happy with my Manfrotto 004B 13', it's pretty bombproof. The 20lb rating at max extension is no lie and all of the joinery and clamp downs on it are well built to be sturdy while still maintaining a relatively lightweight frame. This is just to at least say that the Manfrotto brand is solid, I haven't used the Shures but the joinery although sleek doesn't look very easily usable, an example is if you have a friend run up 10 mins before showtime and ask to clamp on, the manfrotto system makes it easy to be up and down quick with little effort.

Hope this helps(some)
J

[RobertNC]

I would only recommend the Shure*if* you fly a lot with gear.  It is much lighter and folds down smaller than any other comparable height stand.

Otherwise they are not worth the hassle.  If you mostly drive to shows, or if you usually fly somewhere you have friends and can mail the stand beforehand, an air cushioned stand with quick locks is a lot easier to use. 

[jaycdunn]

Cool thanks for the replies. I'm flying cross country for the Miami Phish shows next week. If the Shure is more flight worthy, I'll probably go with that. I don't know any tapers (yet), so the likelihood of anyone wanting to clamp onto my stand is pretty low. Plus the Shure has 5/8" thread, so I won't need any adapters for the Shure A27M mount.

Still, the locking system and air cushioning of the Manfrotto is better. I'll see if I can find the weight of each unit and compare them.

[edit] I found an 8', air cushioned, light stand that collapses to 26" and weighs only 2.4 lbs.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/96721-REG/Photogenic_922048_TALS8_Heavy_Duty_Air.html#specifications

Should be perfect to fly with, and B&H has a used one for only $35. Someone on here said they rarely put their mics over 8' anyway. So I'm just gonna buy this, along with a Manfrotto Rapid Adapter, thread adapter, and a Shure A27M mount. If the stand ends up sucking, hopefully someone will let me clamp on to theirs for the next 3 nights.  [end edit]

[jaycdunn]

It has been brought to my attention that 8' ain't gonna cut it. I'll have to get an extension pole for the stand to get my mics up higher. The stand has a 5/8" stud. I don't need another adapter to attach the extension do I? I would assume they come with a clamp or something.

Every person who had the Shure complained about it, and the taller Manfrottos seemed too long to fly with. So hopefully the 8' stand with a 54" extension will be stable enough.

[edit] Okay I see that I don't need another adapter. That's good at least. If I can get to Burbank before noon tomorrow, there's a place called Filmtools that appears to have a 54" Matthews telescoping baby stand extension in stock. [end edit]

[RobertNC]

See my email.  The Matthews extension does not have a thread on the tip, so if you expect a 5/8 threaded tip you will need either a rapid adapter or a Windtech clamp is also light weight and comes with a 5/8 inch threaded stud.

[jaycdunn]

My Rapid Adapter and thread adapter arrived from B&H today, so it looks like all I need is the Matthews extension. Driving to Burbank to get it in the morning hopefully. Thanks again for your help everyone!

So between the stand, extension and Shure A27M, my mics should be high enough to get a half decent recording. This is really just something to do for me, I need a vacation. As long as I have a good time and get some listenable recordings I'll be happy. I'll be in the taper section all 4 nights.

Great idea to gaffer tape the stand to the floor BTW!

[RobertNC]

Yeah that will work fine.  The Matthews extension has a wing nut on the bottom that will fit on the tip of your stand.  You may want to take the stand with you just in case though.  If the tip is unusually long it may not work exactly like you want, but assuming the photo of that stand on B&H is accurate it should fit down flush.

Also, just to clarify for anyone else who reads this thread,  8-10 feet is often plenty of height for many theaters and smaller venues, but in a big sports dome with a suspended PA and relatively far back where tapers sections usually are, I suggest you try to get up higher into at least the 12'-14' range.

[jaycdunn]

Cool, Matthews referred me to a dealer in Burbank that will have the extension for me this afternoon. That other place didn't have it. Glad I called Matthews.

[rastasean]

Why not something far less expensive:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/253066-REG/Impact_LS_13HB_Heavy_Duty_Light_Stand_.html

[jaycdunn]

Why not something far less expensive:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/253066-REG/Impact_LS_13HB_Heavy_Duty_Light_Stand_.html

Because that stand is 3.5' long when collapsed. Kinda unwieldy in a crowded airplane cabin. The one I got is only 26" long. So that + an extension is better for airtravel.

[RobertNC]

Because that stand is 3.5' long when collapsed. Kinda unwieldy in a crowded airplane cabin. The one I got is only 26" long. So that + an extension is better for airtravel.

A word of caution here.  That stand is 2.5 pounds, 26 inches collapsed.  That is pretty light.  To me definitely not a viable weapon.  Hey they let me fly with my 18" "laptop" that weights 12 pounds.  Now if I wanted to do some damage and did not care about the machine, I could knock someone cold with that thing easily.  For that matter a 722 is built like a tank and fits nicely in your hand - you could brain the entire flight crew, albeit one at a time with one of those bad boys.

But TSA does not exactly make sense, and although they are in principle a single organization, I have had radically different experiences at different airports.

It certainly is done - when I was flying up to the Philly Dead shows in May another guy on one of my flights had a stand probably similar in size that he brought on.

You may in fact be able to carry it on. But I would not just assume it is a given.

The thing about a 26 inch stand is it is a lot more fly worthy because you can put it in any number of more or less regular pieces of luggage if it does have to be checked.  I'm sure you guys have seen these bags that have the pull out handle and rollers like a typical suitcase but are long and narrow - basically a duffle bag with the wheelies.  That is usually what I fly with, and a 26'' stand will easily fit in one of those, as opposed to the big bulky stand I have which will not fit in much of anything other than a ski bag.

[jaycdunn]

I'll make sure there's room in my checked bag for the stand and extension if they won't let me bring them on the plane.

The extension fits on the stand nicely and gets the mics way up there. It takes forever to stop wobbling, but should do the trick.

[Lil Kim Jong-Il]

I'm kind of late to this but I'll throw in opinion.  I wouldn't get the S15A. The shaft locks can be a pain in the ass when they bind.  Because of the way they turn you have a better chance of reorienting your mics when adjusting height mid show.  When collapsed it's shorter than a normal lighting stand but bigger around so bulkier.  I finally sold mine when a friend told me that he snapped off the threaded top of his mounting a vertical bar and tlm170s.  I've found that I rarely ever wanted to run at 13-15 feet anyway so I have a 12ft lighting stand that I run about 8-10ft.  When I tape in situations where I would want to be that high, I run hypers.

For flying I found a a pair of heavy canvas light stand bags on ebay for about $15.  I line that with a blanket I use in the field and it holds my lighting stand, fob stand, umbrella, poster tube and assorted clamps and chargers when I check gear for flying.  It's been a great solution for me. 

[DSatz]

I've had an S15A for a number of years and agree thoroughly with Lil' Kim Jong-Il--the wrong materials were chosen for the supposedly precision parts of this stand's mechanism, and sometimes they just don't cooperate with your wish to tighten or loosen them at a given moment.

Plus for a lot of the situations that I record in, I'd rather have more weight on the bottom and a less wide stance among the tripod legs. So I'm following this discussion closely in hopes of finding a better alternative for when I only need, say, 8-10 feet elevation for the mikes.

--best regards

[jaycdunn]

For anyone who hasn't read through the whole thread, I am not buying a Shure S15A... ever. Like I said, every single person who has one seems to hate it.

I bought an 8' light stand and a 54" Matthews telescoping extension. This rig gets up 12', but having such a lightweight base, it's a little shaky. It works though. For situations where you need something highly portable to get up only 8'-10', I think it's ideal.

On another note, trying to mount a pair of AKG 414's on a Shure A27M mount in any kind of a stereo configuration is proving near impossible. The 414 shockmounts are teh suck for this! I'm gonna try the cheapo pair of modded SPA MC1s next. If that's not working, I'll have to somehow acquire a pair of SDC mics.

Now I really hate myself for selling those 460s. Anyone going to Phish Miami got a pair of loaner SDCs for me? Otherwise I might just have to bring the stereo Royer instead. Probably not an ideal mic for these shows either, but my options are limited. If only I had tons of cash... I'd have bought a pair of those Nevatons last week.

[Lil Kim Jong-Il]

On another note, trying to mount a pair of AKG 414's on a Shure A27M mount in any kind of a stereo configuration is proving near impossible. The 414 shockmounts are teh suck for this! I'm gonna try the cheapo pair of modded SPA MC1s next. If that's not working, I'll have to somehow acquire a pair of SDC mics.

The 414s will mount very easily if you use a pair of windtech clamps, one for each mic, and attach directly to the shaft of your stand.  Its a very flexible configuration.  I did this with 414s using the standard H85 and also the H100 mounts.  I do the same with TLM170s.  Always works well.  Very stable and allows for a variety of alignments from near coincident to NOS.

Search the rig pics forum where there are a lot of examples of this set-up with the windtechs.  If you can't find it, let me know and I'll take some pictures to post. 

I would never recommend mounting LDs on an extension bar atop a fully extended light stand. You should extend your lighting stand only 2/3-3/4 of the max height using the overlap at each junction to add rigidity and use more overlap the higher you get.  Otherwise you're just asking to lose your mics some day.  I know people do it all the time but there isn't much reason to run that high when you have the option of running the 414s in hyper mode.

[jaycdunn]

It's probably too late for me to acquire a pair of Windtech clamps for this gig.

Okay, I see that to do X-Y with LDC mics they need to be placed top and bottom like in a Blumlein configuration. This mount won't do that. I found a thread in the Rig Pics section that is helpful, but I'd need to buy clamps and a section of threaded pipe at the hardware store. it may be easier for me to just borrow a pair of SDC for now.

[Brian Skalinder]

If that's not working, I'll have to somehow acquire a pair of SDC mics.

Changing or buying different mics due to mounting challenges seems a bit rash.  What LKJI said:

The 414s will mount very easily if you use a pair of windtech clamps, one for each mic, and attach directly to the shaft of your stand.  Its a very flexible configuration.

A few pics.  Best setup I found with my 414s when running coincident (XY, MS, Blumlein).  Very stable since the mics aren't positioned well outside the stand's vertical center line like with some of the mount bars available.

[splumer]

I've had an S15a for years, and it's a stand, but I'd rather have something else. My wife was taping with it once and it came down on her finger when she was breaking down and took a piece of skin off. Plus I always seem to have trouble getting it to lock down when I pack it up. Other than that, it's lightweight and fairly compact. I have used it at 12' at Tower City in Cleveland and outdoors.

[jaycdunn]

Changing or buying different mics due to mounting challenges seems a bit rash.

An Evil, Milky Rash?

[OOK]

I've had an S15a for years, and it's a stand, but I'd rather have something else. My wife was taping with it once and it came down on her finger when she was breaking down and took a piece of skin off. Plus I always seem to have trouble getting it to lock down when I pack it up. Other than that, it's lightweight and fairly compact. I have used it at 12' at Tower City in Cleveland and outdoors.

Get an air cushioned stand it won't come down and do this.....they come down slowly....

Peace OOK

[Lil Kim Jong-Il]

it came down on her finger when she was breaking down and took a piece of skin off.

oh yeah, I forgot about that little feature.  That's one of the few pieces of gear I don't miss.

[steve4134]

This is my stand and i know a few others on here have it also. Colapses pretty flat and goes 12-13 feet.

http://www.adorama.com/BG1004BAC.html

Steve

[junkyardt]

can someone who owns the 1004BAC tell me what type of connector it terminates in at the top? i can't tell from online listings for it. thanks.

[Lil Kim Jong-Il]

can someone who owns the 1004BAC tell me what type of connector it terminates in at the top? i can't tell from online listings for it. thanks.

in this picture it shows the regular mounting stud with 5/8 threaded mount and a 1/4" adapter.

edit: preview is too close to post when beer is invovled

[steve4134]

Ill put up a high res pic when i get home........


Steve