Topic: Split Omnis

[blu666z]

Going to be buying some omni caps for my ATs soon.  I have NO experience with omni and want some ideas/pointers.  How much of a spread is needed?  Want to try and run split omnis @ the Gorge for the Dead/ABB.  2' enough?  The further the better?

-Kevin

[Brian]

theoretically not much more than a 6' split is necessary.  after that a noticeable cone filter becomes present in the recording. all theoretical though, but some people like the sound it produces. i've heard many a good recordings with omnis spaced more than 6 feet.

2' would be fine.  the wider you space the bigger the soundstage.  

paging m0k3 for J-Disc!

Brian

[Tim]

I would start with 3' in less than optimum circumstances. I wouldn't go much wider than 10' or so... maybe 6-8' outdoors at a place like the Gorge.

It's not "the wider the better", you can definitely go too wide. Look at the PA and see how wide it goes and the further back from the PA the wider you can go.

just rules of thumb...

[Brian]

tim always posts at the same time i do

the other thing that you have to take into consideration is all the phase issues with split omnis. it would be hard to draw it out using ascii but there are several phase issues that can occur resulting in that cone filter i mentioned above.

Brian

[blu666z]

How are the tapers at Dead shows?  Cool enough to let me throw a small mic on their stand?  Orientation on omnis make no difference right?

-Kevin

[Tim]

Omni's are directional at high frequencies so technically you should point the mics at the PA...

Honestly, the few times I've ever had problems with other tapers at shows are at Dead related events. As a group, and I know I shouldn't generalize, they can be real assholes. That said I doubt you'll have an issue clamping such small mics.

[Brian]

i felt the same vibe at the dead show in st. louis last year. i made a post about in another thread a couple of weeks ago.

one person wanted to run split omnis and the only person in hte section who would let them clamp was joe shambro.  i would have but i got there late and was shoved off to the corner (which happened to be DFC those fockers.....my tape smokes ). anyway after it got dark they kept flashing their damn flashlights around and pointing them into the faces of tapers who were trying to make it through the section to either get to their gear or leave to get a drink or take a piss.   wanted to smack those douches so bad!

[plucks]

watch out at the gorge w/omnis though.
for phish, the ts is off center.  if you are able to go to each side of foh or center FOB, you should be fine, but otherwise omni's may be tricky due to the heavy weight of the one PA stack on one side.  
If the sound source isnt centered very well with omnis, it could be tricky.  3' spread should work well.  

[Chuck]

I've split omnis as little as 27" and had good results. As pointed out, omni's are directional at higher frequencies. If you do go with a small spread, angle the microphones to the outside of the PA stacks. This will help make the image wider. Good luck.

[blu666z]

Thanks for all the info.  Maybe I'll just build me a bar so I don't have to hassle anybody.

-Kevin

[olyrc]

How are the tapers at Dead shows?  Cool enough to let me throw a small mic on their stand?  Orientation on omnis make no difference right?

-Kevin

What, my stand isn't good enough for you?

[blu666z]

Nothing wrong with your stand, but to get them any distance apart I would have to have one on another stand.  Think I'm just gonna build a bar myself though with some alligator clips on the ends or something then clamp that to your stand....are we actually in the section?

-Kevin

[Brian Skalinder]

Two words:  Jecklin disc.

[blu666z]

Two more:  Too lazy.

-Kevin

[Brian Skalinder]

Alright, Mr. Lazy-pants, two more, then:  nerf ball.