Topic: I really need this!

[Nick's Picks]

and wont be happy until I have it.

http://www.dv247.com/assets/products/33794_l.jpg

who needs cables?
skm140 kit?
LSD2 w/silver cables?
MiniMP?
671?
first born?

i'm thinking that this w/one of those korg DSD recorders could arguably be "as good as it gets" for stereo concert recording.

[kskreider]

droool...



SoundField Portable ST350 System Now Shipping


Innovative British microphone manufacturer SoundField have begun shipping their compact, portable microphone system, the ST350, which was announced last year. Like all SoundField microphone systems, the ST350 consists of a multi-pattern microphone and an associated decoder/processor unit with built-in mic preamplification. However, in the case of the ST350 system, the mic is a newly designed model about half the size and weight of the mic in the older ST250 system, and the new decoder/processor can be run from the mains or 9-18V DC power cells. Even when using batteries, the design of the new lightweight microphone allows it to operate with lengthy cable runs where required, permitting it to be used reliably at distances in excess of 100 metres from the processor. In short, the system provides an affordable, portable, single-mic solution for broadcasters who require a surround compatible output for HD broadcasting.

Just as with SoundField’s other microphone products, the ST350 system produces a four channel signal in the company’s proprietary B-Format. The ST350 processor has built-in decoding to convert the B-Format signal to a Stereo or Stereo M/S output, which can be routed to the dual rear-panel XLR connectors. Alternatively, the B-Format signal may be output via the rear-panel multi-pin Lemo connector. Other decoders in the SoundField range, such as the hardware SP451 or the Surround Zone software (now compatible with Pro Tools, Nuendo and SADiE DAW systems) can then be used to decode the signal to create a variety of surround-sound formats — and all from the one multi capsule ST350 mic.

Also built into the ST350 control unit are various B-Format processing options, unique to SoundField microphones, that allow users to continuously vary the apparent orientation and stereo pickup pattern of the microphone, but without touching the mic itself. An overall Gain control, stereo headphone jack, high-pass wind-noise reduction filter, and five-segment LED metering are also built in for recording convenience.

[rowjimmy]

[Nick Graham]

...all that, and it's got a HPF!

[Nick's Picks]

the big deal for me w/this is the addition of a "real" preamp. 
the st-250s box had no gain controll, and sent a hybrid signal.  It was too low for line level, yet so freakin' hot as a mic signal.
Plus, you had to engage the -20db pad for everything that included recording a PA.

[terrapinj]

whats that mamma-jamma cost?

hows that gain structure work? 1-6?

[Shawn]

whats that mamma-jamma cost?

hows that gain structure work? 1-6?

I think they go for ~5K

[WiFiJeff]

whats that mamma-jamma cost?

The list is $6700 but I see LasVegasProAudio quoting $5400.  A bargain  

Jeff

[RebelRebel]

Meh. Id rather use stereo pairs with my own preamps. Dont like or see the point in surround either, but I do hope you get one, Nick! I know you love that thing@

[Nick's Picks]

did you get my PM about finding a 250 from your european connections Teddy?

[RebelRebel]

did you get my PM about finding a 250 from your european connections Teddy?

man, noone uses those thangs here...surround micing isnt so big, more of an american thing. bigger/better/faster/more

ive got feelers out though. if there is one, Teddy'll find it. 

[Nick's Picks]

I can get "the last new one" for about 500 less than they were before the 350 came out.
but..been there, done that.  i want the new gun!

surround shmurround.
this thing is sick for two channel.

[BobW]

skm140 kit?

PM me.
Let's face it, you've been messing around enough, it's time for that Soundfield   

[poorlyconditioned]

did you get my PM about finding a 250 from your european connections Teddy?

man, noone uses those thangs here...surround micing isnt so big, more of an american thing. bigger/better/faster/more

ive got feelers out though. if there is one, Teddy'll find it. 

I think this thing would really shine for studio recording.  Put it in the center of the room and then "tune" the sound/pattern/direction in post.  Isn't that what Cowboy Junkies did on Trinity Sessions?

It seems like overkill for concert recording though.

  Richard

[Nick's Picks]

yup, that is how the CJs did it.

overkill?  I think me and 1/2 of the gear bags on this list had a good laugh over that.
why is this any different then a pair of 4011s?  or a full schoeps rig w/several cap options.
same price range.


its only overkill if you are listening to your recordings over a mid fi / crap-fi stereo.
that would be me, circa 2003.
I was running ST-250>V3 and had about $7k in my field rig.
I listened to it over a 10 year old Sony STR911 receiver and a pair of low end B&W monitors (floor standing, dm6xx).  Sounded great...until I heard my first real high end system and what these soundfield recordings *could* sound like.  Thats when I sold it to invest into some real stereo gear (symphones>DNA1>MartinLogan SL3s).
well, that and I had the nerve to tape Phish w/it.  so it *had* to go.
 

Now that the playback side of my life is in better order, I could see myself in one of these big rigs again.
ST2/350 > Korg DSD recorder = perpetual boner

[Nick's Picks]

skm140 kit?

PM me.
Let's face it, you've been messing around enough, it's time for that Soundfield   

when I bought these, I said "no way am I selling a 3rd set of these puppies"

[muj]

there's a old school st-250 for sale in australia if you look around

[carlbeck]

Nick,

One word.......................................................................


SLUT

 

[L Ron Hoover]

ST2/350 > Korg DSD recorder = perpetual boner

Schwing!

[jimmyrow]

ST2/350 > Korg DSD recorder = perpetual boner

QFMFT!!!!!

[Colin Liston]

ST2/350 > Korg DSD recorder = perpetual boner

But if you had the Korg DSD, you wouldn't "need" the soundfield.  All you need is the LSD2    right?

[mmedley.]

Sorry, but this and a 744 is where its at. The 744 can handle the 4 channel B-format so that is a no brainer.

[tfs8271]

I want one.

[Nick's Picks]

the 744 will do it...awkwardly.

[poorlyconditioned]

Sorry, but this and a 744 is where its at. The 744 can handle the 4 channel B-format so that is a no brainer.

Any deck that can record four tracks should work, right?  Of course you have to do mixing in post, not realtime.

That is why I got the VX440 PCMCIA laptop card.  It has four mic inputs with *equal gain*.  Mixdown later.  I've got four AT853 caps and bodies (well, the metal part inside the bodies).  Just waiting to glue-tape them together .

  Richard

[Nick's Picks]

not quite.
the soundfields B format (the 4chan ouptut) is not simply 4 tracks.  It has to do w/the angle of the array, which i'm sure come into play w/the "matrixing" to stereo or surround signals. 
its the Z factor!  X-Y-Z

[RebelRebel]

the soundfield requires a special decoding application. The Zaxxcom deva has it built in, and others..but you are right..it isnt just 4 tracks. the new st350 has a decoder box with it..

not quite.
the soundfields B format (the 4chan ouptut) is not simply 4 tracks.  It has to do w/the angle of the array, which i'm sure come into play w/the "matrixing" to stereo or surround signals. 
its the Z factor!  X-Y-Z

[poorlyconditioned]

not quite.
the soundfields B format (the 4chan ouptut) is not simply 4 tracks.  It has to do w/the angle of the array, which i'm sure come into play w/the "matrixing" to stereo or surround signals. 
its the Z factor!  X-Y-Z

Yeah, I know it is decoded with a special "matrix".  All I'm saying is *hardware wise* you need four channels.  Record to four channels and use some software to decode to whatever (stereo) format you want.  I'm not sure if there are plug ins to do this or if I have to do this myself though.

  Richard

[Nick's Picks]

its all proprietary Soundfield plugins for all the popular DAW setups and sowftware.
but yes, you need 4 normal channels to record them all.
of course, you'd want 4 channels w/the identical signal path, ie preamp.  Can't do that w/the 744, I believe?
R4 would be perfect, but its fidelity is not up to snuff, imo.  You'd want nothing short of the best after plunking down $5k for one of these.

[Wiggler]

I just talked to soundfiled USA today they said delivery is running about one month.
They told me the biggest sonic difference between this and the 250 is that the 350 has a much lower noise floor.
They said delivery has been running slow.
I've been kicking myself in the ass ever since I sold my 250 the fact that this is so much smaller pretty much has me sold.

[rowjimmy]

You guys all saw this, right: http://www.soundfield.com/news/news_s_devices.php

Sound Devices Offers SoundField Monitoring on 744T Portable Recorder


Sound Devices, LLC and SoundField announce the immediate availability of SoundField B-format surround decoding on Sound Devices' 744T four-track production audio recorder. 744T firmware revision 1.57 (and greater) now offers B-format-to-stereo decoding without additional hardware.

Ken Giles, Sales Director of SoundField said, "Our SoundField microphone users can now monitor and output stereo from a Sound Devices recorder while recording multi-channel B-format surround (W, X, Y, and Z) for later post-processing. The portable 744T is an excellent complement to our upcoming, portable ST350 Surround Microphone System. This combination greatly reduces the size and complexity of surround recording in the field."

"A single-point SoundField microphone opens the creative doors in field production. B-format monitoring has been a highly requested feature on the 744T and we are pleased to include it in our latest firmware," said Jon Tatooles, Managing Director of Sound Devices.

SoundField manufactures a range of microphones each capable of generating mono, stereo and full surround. In addition to the hardware SoundField has developed software for both surround and stereo applications which enables all microphone parameters to be adjusted or changed after the event in post production. The Surround Zone software is available on the Digidesign Pro Tools, Nuendo and SADiE platforms.

Sound Devices, LLC designs and manufactures portable audio products for field production. Sound Devices' family of audio mixers, preamps, computer interfaces, and recorders are used by audio professionals worldwide for a wide range of field production applications. They can be found on the web at www.sounddevices.com.

Pictured: The Sound Devices' 744T four-track production audio recorder.

[carlbeck]

Here we go again, I can see the slutiness on the horizon!

[Nick's Picks]

((((BOING))))

[carlbeck]

here it comes, look out................................

[mmedley.]

of course, you'd want 4 channels w/the identical signal path, ie preamp.  Can't do that w/the 744, I believe?

Yessir, you can. Line In x 4 (W, X, Y & Z). The Soundfield box is also a pre. I've been dying to hear a ST-350 > 744!!!

I've been reading about it for a year and its been my wet dream over and over.

[OOK]

((((BOING))))

F**ing LOL     

[F0CKER]

Wanted to bump this thread with some samples from the ST350->744T rig.  Each of these were recorded in B Format and decoded in post.  I'm really a bit floored with the options in post to tweak the sound on these recordings.  In at least one situation (The Rio Theater) I probably would've opted for cards/subs from my old schoeps rig.  After listening in post, hyper won out, card and sub leaving entirely too much room/bass/low end.  The vocals on the Troubadour show are a little distant due to the mix / setup location.  I wish the preamp had a bit more punch to it, but overall I do like this setup...to my ears the Troubadour show sounds the best of the lot.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
http://bt.etree.org/details.php?id=511841&uploaded=1

Tea Leaf Green
December 7, 2007
The Rio Theater
Santa Cruz, CA

Source: Soundfield ST-350(DFC/FOB/B Format)-> SD744T(24/48)-> Nuendo 4 (Decoded to Stereo - hypercardioid @90)-> CD Wave-> Wavelab (16/44)-> FLAC Frontend (Level 6)-> FLAC
Taper: Chris Imburgia

01. Lil Hood
02. If It Wasn't For The Money
03. Red Ribbons
04. Hot Dog
05. Piss It Away
06. One Reason
07. The Devil's Pay
08. Let Us Go
09. Don't Curse The Night
10. The Garden (Part I)->
11. The Garden (Part II)->
12. The Garden (Part III)->
13. Jezebel->
14. Precious Stone->
15. Can You Guess It?
16. I've Got A Truck
17. Franz Hanzerbeak

FLAC Fingerprint
--------------------------------------
tlg2007-12-07t17.flac:d71e913eb0fbfb365826806ef366d896
tlg2007-12-07t01.flac:6ffaf22a08ea0413ccc75061c40cf8c5
tlg2007-12-07t02.flac:75ebf6651300a58a6ac984245becabf4
tlg2007-12-07t03.flac:c4122d5fc7a9619437f6c3f6c79b0e57
tlg2007-12-07t04.flac:18783644a3d31d5adc6fdc063a0cd0e2
tlg2007-12-07t05.flac:d0ea01abc4a9e9e552e9196adccff8c4
tlg2007-12-07t06.flac:b92632fb145c4ac2e37a1a087bb2a1fa
tlg2007-12-07t07.flac:4c56f6e4058fbddde5a9e3d185094571
tlg2007-12-07t08.flac:62f6ef58b3e655dbd0085f2faaf6f6fa
tlg2007-12-07t09.flac:7f9598eabda63c043111db40da7ec3b1
tlg2007-12-07t10.flac:fd04dce7377167e7b483521ba6ea47b6
tlg2007-12-07t11.flac:524b9e7dca391fb229459d66c93affd2
tlg2007-12-07t12.flac:6101a7c67174218543dcc166f8e2826c
tlg2007-12-07t13.flac:ea3f68e34901e07023bd866071e1f985
tlg2007-12-07t14.flac:f1179b616d5f4b138c47a98c760d0e4e
tlg2007-12-07t15.flac:a6107f639afca22230daad71bdcd5fb3
tlg2007-12-07t16.flac:84357c128a0c7c2ede35c4cd64032cc7

Sector Boundary Verification
--------------------------------------
length expanded size cdr WAVE problems filename
5:32.71 58731836 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t01.flac
5:18.51 56215196 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t02.flac
5:30.06 58226156 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t03.flac
11:35.17 122638028 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t04.flac
8:07.27 85970348 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t05.flac
5:54.47 62556188 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t06.flac
9:07.54 96617852 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t07.flac
6:48.21 72020636 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t08.flac
7:40.09 81165212 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t09.flac
1:45.08 18540860 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t10.flac
4:37.12 48891068 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t11.flac
5:22.02 56805548 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t12.flac
10:27.40 110696924 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t13.flac
8:04.41 85474076 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t14.flac
10:22.17 109760828 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t15.flac
5:04.17 53665628 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t16.flac
8:59.32 95154908 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-07t17.flac
120:17.22 1273131292 B (totals for 17 files, 0.4780 overall compression ratio)
_________________


http://bt.etree.org/details.php?id=511822&uploaded=1

Tea Leaf Green
December 8, 2007
The Troubadour
West Hollywood, CA

Source: Soundfield ST-350(DFC/B Format)-> SD744T(24/48)-> Nuendo 4 (Decoded to Stereo - midway between cardioid and hypercardioid @90)-> CD Wave-> Wavelab (16/44)-> FLAC Frontend (Level 6)-> FLAC
Taper: Chris Imburgia

Set One
01. Red Ribbons
02. One Reason
03. Devil's Pay
04. Let Us Go
05. Don't Curse at the Night
06. 5000 Acres
07. Faced With Love
08. Make a Connection
09. Jezebel
10. If It Wasn't for the Money

Set Two
01. Lil Hood
02. Piss It Away
03. Garden (Part II)->
04. Garden (Part I)->
05. Garden (Part III)
06. Hot Dog
07. I've Got a Truck
08. Franz Hanzerbeak
09. E: Don't Let It Down
10. E: Can You Guess It?

FLAC Fingerprint
------------------------------------------
tlg2007-12-08s2t10.flac:216d2aa4444f32a33740754c39a957ad
tlg2007-12-08s1t01.flac:57d57dadeaf5eedee5d48a772f8bfe70
tlg2007-12-08s1t02.flac:dfdd22367c77c8e7f80906862cb82d55
tlg2007-12-08s1t03.flac:b2689af3580745623fa6bc9e896587b8
tlg2007-12-08s1t04.flac:8d786d42cc91bce31ff453afef48fd4d
tlg2007-12-08s1t05.flac:864897b4eea703f56a809838dfb4fe8f
tlg2007-12-08s1t06.flac:f5fdcd642c38cadcbd4fd80833303d95
tlg2007-12-08s1t07.flac:3e201f1290a01237585b0610ed252a18
tlg2007-12-08s1t08.flac:f840dec807c94e04f128e423a9d496ad
tlg2007-12-08s1t09.flac:c901d4eb17dcda7ea63122eac61db1c8
tlg2007-12-08s1t10.flac:dd2118b89fe2107d06dc094bd7b0a471
tlg2007-12-08s2t01.flac:8c1dcedf1b8de5713a0ece8ffaaa6de1
tlg2007-12-08s2t02.flac:cafd0f75de0209fac1152c18dc724018
tlg2007-12-08s2t03.flac:3e2a91d94cbe0ce1fc8b51f31d21f2b3
tlg2007-12-08s2t04.flac:263dae317499a2cbef37fda4e0d0a58a
tlg2007-12-08s2t05.flac:0657a64077d926f7da30070ef9f0f6cb
tlg2007-12-08s2t06.flac:041d2ec20ce5cc5dbe891eea240a85af
tlg2007-12-08s2t07.flac:5f6aa18496a44c3132d4eacf59b76a9e
tlg2007-12-08s2t08.flac:c271eddfccc6ea1b99e01edcb071e670
tlg2007-12-08s2t09.flac:a30766cdaf38ce84ae0606354bcb08b0


Sector Boundary Verification
----------------------------------------------
length expanded size cdr WAVE problems filename
5:20.50 56565644 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s1t01.flac
5:56.01 62800796 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s1t02.flac
8:32.72 90486188 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s1t03.flac
6:25.43 68015180 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s1t04.flac
7:15.62 76879868 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s1t05.flac
8:14.13 87172220 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s1t06.flac
5:05.36 53886716 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s1t07.flac
5:29.01 58037996 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s1t08.flac
9:19.72 98776988 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s1t09.flac
5:44.34 60761612 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s1t10.flac
6:27.02 68271548 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s2t01.flac
10:01.15 106051724 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s2t02.flac
4:56.13 52245020 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s2t03.flac
1:45.33 18599660 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s2t04.flac
5:23.43 57078380 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s2t05.flac
13:41.33 144902060 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s2t06.flac
4:32.13 48011420 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s2t07.flac
13:51.27 146651948 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s2t08.flac
5:44.21 60731036 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s2t09.flac
8:36.06 91036556 --- -- ---xx tlg2007-12-08s2t10.flac
142:22.65 1506962560 B (totals for 20 files, 0.4979 overall compression ratio)
_________________


http://bt.etree.org/details.php?id=511897&uploaded=1

Squirrelmaster
December 1, 2007
The Fire
Philadelphia, PA

Source: Soundfield ST-350(ROC/FOB/B Format)-> SD744T(24/96)-> Nuendo 4 (Decoded to Stereo - hypercardioid @90/16/44)-> CD Wave-> FLAC Frontend (Level 6)-> FLAC
Taper: Chris Imburgia

1. Intro->
2. Old Shoes
3. Jersey
4. G Thang
5. New Riff [1]
6. Meat Market [1]
7. Looking at the World From the Bottom of a Well [1]
8. Glitter & Gold

Notes
-------------------------------
[1] First time played

FLAC Fingerprint
--------------------------------
sqm2007-12-01t08.flac:2da666377aaa034a0aaca071e9b75384
sqm2007-12-01t01.flac:562d9f298d278b427f93906847c4e888
sqm2007-12-01t02.flac:f92304a11cf8c0c88b6e2655dd32880c
sqm2007-12-01t03.flac:747263d3741639c0226b1de9a08304d1
sqm2007-12-01t04.flac:6552de435f0e8c4902d8c5b818b9a114
sqm2007-12-01t05.flac:6bf26d47edb1cbedc895e9d878fd2e09
sqm2007-12-01t06.flac:696be8683759babfe6cf7c125626b851
sqm2007-12-01t07.flac:00d94b055ed6ea96459eb1c16d40a9b1

Sector Boundary Verification
---------------------------------
length expanded size cdr WAVE problems filename
0:22.65 4033724 --- -- ---xx sqm2007-12-01t01.flac
15:13.52 161175548 --- -- ---xx sqm2007-12-01t02.flac
7:52.02 83265548 --- -- ---xx sqm2007-12-01t03.flac
15:10.63 160672220 --- -- ---xx sqm2007-12-01t04.flac
15:14.42 161328428 --- -- ---xx sqm2007-12-01t05.flac
4:54.48 51974540 --- -- ---xx sqm2007-12-01t06.flac
4:18.47 45621788 --- -- ---xx sqm2007-12-01t07.flac
10:07.49 107190092 --- -- ---xx sqm2007-12-01t08.flac
73:14.68 775261888 B (totals for 8 files, 0.4716 overall compression ratio)
_________________

[J.T.L]

+T!

[mmedley.]

Merry Fuckin' Christmas to you (and me).    Thanks Focker!

[wbrisette]

yup, that is how the CJs did it.

I loved this from Michael Timmins comments on the BBC recordings.

"The Saturday session represented here is one of our most memorable radio sessions. The four of us (me, Margo, Jeff Bird, and Jaro Czerwinec) arrived for the session only to find a single Calrec microphone set up for the recording. It was 1989 and the Trinity Session had just been released with much attention paid to the fact that it had been recorded in a single day with a single Calrec microphone. It seemed that the engineer in charge of this session had read the press release and had decided that he would do the same. What was lost in most articles about the Trinity Session was that it took six or seven very frustrating hours of fine tuning with that one microphone before we finally captured the sound".

So, doesn't seem like with the early Calrec/Soundfield mics it was an easy thing to get things right. From the one or two people I know with experience with the Soundfield mics, apparently it's still not that easy of a thing to do.

Wayne

[wbrisette]

the 744 will do it...awkwardly.

I've never seen the Deva firmware with the Soundfield option. I wonder how easy or difficult it is to use the Deva's Soundfield option.

Wayne

[wbrisette]

The Zaxxcom deva has it built in, and others..

Not exactly. It's an option. They licensed the code from the Soundfield team and so you have to pay for if you want it. Since most Deva recorders are used by film sound mixers, they don't include it as a default.

Wayne

[oleg]

i really need that one :-)
wms-5 from sanken - direct matrix

http://sellbuyexchange-film-videoaudiogear.googlegroups.com/web/fwspamfwwms5fivechannelsurroundmicrophone.zip?gda=nqG6zWAAAAC2Af0jwr3gSIsbfAS5RmpbxMWoDK_VZybXDkK_OR1mJiX1z7Al57seAGuB-M3smGkFQ9EZPLC1SOrDljHFnDDEojzHFbpw4vAqPEhuLx0viTbguNdKnChJslhMZhtpspo

[tfs8271]

Damn, it wasn't under the tree.

[oleg]

maybe next year