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Gear / Technical Help => Playback Forum => Topic started by: Nick's Picks on January 06, 2006, 12:17:59 PM
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ssia brothers...
wow. what a difference. I wasn't preparred for it.
I picked up a Monster SHT3500MKII conditioner (like $168 online somewhere, new) and introduced it and some DIY AC cables for my Sony 3000es and Toshiba SD9200 DVD-A deck. I am completely shocked at the difference in audio quality. I thought my system was quiet before. I listened to a refference disc for a while, then put the Monster in and listened again. the music started up and caught me by surprise. it seemed to just materialize out of thin air.
you hear about "blackness" in the background ...low level noisefloor..etc. now I fully understand what that is *supposed* to be like.
Am I crazy to say that everything my system did before..is now 10x better? Imaging..bass responce...just about everything seems to be improved.
I have not tested out what it has done for my video performance yet (its also filtering my digital cable feed)...but at this point, i could care less. i'm so pleased w/this investment.
thought i'd pass it along. the stories you hear about clean AC power are but 1/2 told.
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pretty crazy isn't it?
the $200 I spent on my furutech is by far the best bang for the buck in my system. I can turn on any of my sources and turn the stereo all the way up and hear.....nothing.... total silence.
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"I picked up a Monster SHT3500MKII conditioner "
you can pick this up for $120 now after a $50 rebate through onecall.com Thats an incredible deal compared to its MSRP
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your supposed to tell me that *before* I lay down $160+
:)
+T any way
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"I picked up a Monster SHT3500MKII conditioner "
you can pick this up for $120 now after a $50 rebate through onecall.com Thats an incredible deal compared to its MSRP
Plus $26 shipping. You can get it for $130 shipped from Amazon after the rebate:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00004Y2ZF
(It will show up for $180 once you add it to your cart.) Sorry Nick!
Craig
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thanks guys.
anyone else want to show me how little I could have paid?
fwiw..its a good investment even at a buck sixty
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Have you noticed any decrease in dynamics after adding it to your system?
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not sure yet. i notice something though.
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ok...
let me also say that video is HUGELY improved. I just popped a DVD in for my lil Girl, and its like my TV got A LOT brighter and way more vivid.
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not sure yet. i notice something though.
Please keep us posted. I was just curious because when I used a Furman power conditioner and a Brickwall surge protector I noticed a decreased dynamics in my system so I ended up getting rid of both. If I could find a reasonably affordable conditioner with out the negative side-effects I'd jump right on it.
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I've read about people solving the dynamics problem by using a conditioner on the front end components and using direct power for the amp or a seperate dedicated high current conditioner for the amp.
I did get a great improvement when I started using the MR1200 balanced conditioner in my system. Exactly what Nick described above.
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I haven't confirm this, but since the "digital" amps are so much more efficient than typical SS or tubes, do they really require "high current" power source? Maybe they don't suffer from the current constriction of some of the conditioners like other amps might?
I'm following your lead, Nick. I picked up the sth3500mk2 for my 7000es.
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its got dedicated AC outlets for various componants, and ones specificaly for power amps..etc. But who knows...the only difference could just be whats printed for consumers to see and the guts are all the same inside.
:)
I can't say that i'm suffering any ill affects from putting this thing in my system. dynamics, if anything...seem at least the same, but it seems a little wider. higher highs, lower lows, quieter quiet moments..etc.
Craig..you'll be happy.
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I haven't confirm this, but since the "digital" amps are so much more efficient than typical SS or tubes, do they really require "high current" power source? Maybe they don't suffer from the current constriction of some of the conditioners like other amps might?
I'm following your lead, Nick. I picked up the sth3500mk2 for my 7000es.
I never considered that but it makes sense that the digital amp wouldn't suffer since it is more power efficient.
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Seriously...all this with a Monster Power unit??? Might have to look into it. Persoanlly I'm looking into the PS Audio P-300 and Exactpower EP-15 for power and surge protection for just front end components. Equitech and BPT for balanced power is an option as well.
With the MOV technology for surge protection, I've not really heard great things about these units. Dedicated lines will make the biggest difference and I was able to do this for my room. Not in a big hurry to get power conditioning, but I'm glad its worked for you. Rather cheap system improvements are always nice! ;D
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thanks guys.
anyone else want to show me how little I could have paid?
fwiw..its a good investment even at a buck sixty
I just won one on e-bay for $63.50 ! ;D
(kidding)
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I highly recommend the PS Audio Ultimate Outlet. My DAC and Pre-Amp are plugged into the 15 A Standard and the rest of my system is in the Monster HTS 3500. A great combo. I have also heard great feedback on the PS Audio UPC-200 which is a pair of Ultimate Outlets in one box (4 outlets)
Clean AC power DOES make a substantial difference. Of course everything is system dependent.
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i wanted PS audio products...but out of my price range.
the UPC200 goes cheap sometimes on agon. sometimes.
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Please convince me.
What is your mains power like when you need a conditioning device to improve your audio a little?
I mean: each power supply for low voltage electronics is a filter of some sorts: transformer, rectifier, regulator, etc, etc (or how they implement these thinsg nowadays), so if power irregularites still manage to get past these something is wrong in the devices as well? (within reasonable borders of course)
Please explain why the power does not necessarily have to suck to hear the benefit of a power conditioner.
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got me. i dont claim to understand it. but i'm certain i can hear it.
:)
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It's correct that if a device's power supply is properly implemented, an external conditioner will probably not provide a significant improvement. But most devices do not have optimal power supply designs. Designers must work to meet retail pricing constraints and even when the price doesn't matter there may be more effective places to spend the money in the design.
It's not only the quality of the mains power at your panel that affects the sound in your system. Anything with motors (washer/dryer, AC, electric clock) that is plugged into your house wiring is going to induce noise onto the home AC wiring. Dimmers introduce noise. All that comes back through the panel to your playback components.
The conditioner I use is implemented using an isolation trasformer that outputs balanced power(out of phase +/- 60V). It made a striking difference in the quality of the sound. Just as Nick described, the first time I used it the music just seemed to rise out of blackness and there was a lot finer detail in the presentation. There was noise present that I never realized was there and it was masking low level information. Over a week or so I noticed that I was listening at a lower volume setting because I no longer needed to crank up the volume to bring the detail above the haze of background noise.
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I use a BPT 1.5 I think it is with absolutely stunning results. I would reccomend against the ps audio p300 fwiw, as the one I heard did very little to my ears. equitech and BPT for balanced power. They supposedly do not limit dynamics, so I went with one and couldn't be happier. I use a class d amp, and I heard no limits in transients or macro/micro dynamics when I installed the unit. It is REALLY heavy though and a pain to isolate.
Try isolation products under your PC for better results....trust me ^-^ ^-^
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Interesting and affordable...
http://cgi.ebay.com/Power-Plant-AC-Regenerator-for-Pre-Amplifier-PS-Audio_W0QQitemZ5774534117QQcategoryZ14980QQcmdZViewItem (http://cgi.ebay.com/Power-Plant-AC-Regenerator-for-Pre-Amplifier-PS-Audio_W0QQitemZ5774534117QQcategoryZ14980QQcmdZViewItem)
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I picked up a ps audio upc-20 and have enjoyed the subtle improvements. I've noticed more improvements in the video than audio, but honestly, I haven't had a chance to have a nice listening session (infant in the house creates a volume constraint). However, the video image is much more vivid with greater contrast. These should be required with all new video purchases
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do you plug the television and the audio into the power conditioner? Would image on cable television improve with this, in your opinion?
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I highly recommend the PS Audio Ultimate Outlet. My DAC and Pre-Amp are plugged into the 15 A Standard and the rest of my system is in the Monster HTS 3500. A great combo. I have also heard great feedback on the PS Audio UPC-200 which is a pair of Ultimate Outlets in one box (4 outlets)
Clean AC power DOES make a substantial difference. Of course everything is system dependent.
I have a UPC-200 for my analog components. There are two dedicated lines in my system - one for analog, one for digital. The UPC-200 feeds two subwoofers and a 300x2 amp and I can't say that I've really noticed decrease in dynamics even though there is probably too much power being sucked from the line, but I haven't switched everything around to see what would make differences in the sound. I choose the UPC-200 because I needed more than two outlets, and it got a lot of good reviews. It was picked up pretty cheap of Audiogon. My digital section uses a monster MK5000 conditioner and that seems to do a great job as well.
Later,
pjdavep
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Ya made me bite again Nick. First the 3000, now this. (made an impulse buy yesterday afternoon)
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The cleanest i have ever heard my system was when i swiched off the grid connection to our house and ran off of our solar. It was shocking. I removed the Chang conditioner i had and it sounded even better. Listened to it for about 2 days on and off before boxing the system up and selling it. Sigh...
Coop
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That is a cool idea - why not just use solar for that room only?
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I use a BPT 1.5 I think it is with absolutely stunning results. I would reccomend against the ps audio p300 fwiw, as the one I heard did very little to my ears. equitech and BPT for balanced power. They supposedly do not limit dynamics, so I went with one and couldn't be happier. I use a class d amp, and I heard no limits in transients or macro/micro dynamics when I installed the unit. It is REALLY heavy though and a pain to isolate.
Try isolation products under your PC for better results....trust me ^-^ ^-^
Was the P-300 set up with Multiwave II? What wave were you using? Voltage and freq? Balanced power and AC regenerators = very different technologies. At some point in time I want to hook up my dedicated lines to an oscilloscope to see the waveform. Maybe I should do this before bying a voltage regulator/regenerator.
Personally I'm hoping to find a good deal on Exactpower units.
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Seriously...all this with a Monster Power unit??? Might have to look into it. Persoanlly I'm looking into the PS Audio P-300 and Exactpower EP-15 for power and surge protection for just front end components. Equitech and BPT for balanced power is an option as well.
With the MOV technology for surge protection, I've not really heard great things about these units. Dedicated lines will make the biggest difference and I was able to do this for my room. Not in a big hurry to get power conditioning, but I'm glad its worked for you. Rather cheap system improvements are always nice! ;D
I always heard the MOV units were fine until a surge hit. then it was a once and popped deal. there are sets out there with a different type of surge protecter that can withstand surge after surge. Furman maybe? I looked at a lot of these a while ago and have promptly forgotten which brands had the "resettable" surge protectors.
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Ya made me bite again Nick. First the 3000, now this. (made an impulse buy yesterday afternoon)
and have I ever steered you wrong?
:)
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Seriously...all this with a Monster Power unit??? Might have to look into it. Persoanlly I'm looking into the PS Audio P-300 and Exactpower EP-15 for power and surge protection for just front end components. Equitech and BPT for balanced power is an option as well.
With the MOV technology for surge protection, I've not really heard great things about these units. Dedicated lines will make the biggest difference and I was able to do this for my room. Not in a big hurry to get power conditioning, but I'm glad its worked for you. Rather cheap system improvements are always nice! ;D
I always heard the MOV units were fine until a surge hit. then it was a once and popped deal. there are sets out there with a different type of surge protecter that can withstand surge after surge. Furman maybe? I looked at a lot of these a while ago and have promptly forgotten which brands had the "resettable" surge protectors.
It is something like this. All littlle surges reduce the quality of the protection. Panamax and Monster are the big players that use this. Many folks these days are grabbing a brickwall or surge-ex unit to put in front of everything else.
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Has anyone on the board used an O-scope or Spectrum Analyzer on the AC input before and after a conditioner ?
How 'bout on the amplifier output with a conditioner in line and also with it out of circuit ?
I don't doubt the benefit, but I wonder just what it is that they are doing.
Is it ripple reduction or harmonic filtering or what ?
TIA.
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That is a cool idea - why not just use solar for that room only?
The whole house is solar. Would be cost prohibitive to do only one room, not to mention a challenge for the designer/electrician.
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Sorry, I thought you were testing out an implementation, not that the entire house was solar. Of course, that's the more plausible answer, so DUH to me.
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+T for the solar house!
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I've been using isolation transformers on my main play back system for years. An audiophile friend suggested it and after hearing the difference I was sold. It seemed quieter and had increased dynamics. The brand I've been using is ONEAC. Very reasonable price and good quality. It's a heavy box though, got to weigh a good 30 pounds. The only downside is that it makes a steady low buzz sound. Ideally it should be out of the playback room but I have mine tucked away and with med. to loud playback it's not a issue. Fun stuff.
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I've been using isolation transformers on my main play back system for years. An audiophile friend suggested it and after hearing the difference I was sold. It seemed quieter and had increased dynamics. The brand I've been using is ONEAC. Very reasonable price and good quality. It's a heavy box though, got to weigh a good 30 pounds. The only downside is that it makes a steady low buzz sound. Ideally it should be out of the playback room but I have mine tucked away and with med. to loud playback it's not a issue. Fun stuff.
took a look at their website - nice stuff...
which model do you have?
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I want to thank y'all for inspiring me to get back into audio after many years. I found this article on the web about power conditioning. It is a little old, but not entirely outdated.
http://www.boundforsound.com/tweak.htm
POINT 1. Transformer based isolation devices are basically useless as AC line conditioners.
POINT 2. Power amplifiers are generally immune to the workings of outboard line conditioners, but respond very favorably to power cords.
POINT 3. Outboard AC line conditioners generally come in two flavors - series and parallel.
POINT 4. Outboard AC line conditioners work best when loaded down with the proper amount of line draw.
POINT 5. If power line conditioning is to be effective, the cords must be oriented to proper polarity.
POINT 6. Power cords make a tremendous difference.
POINT 7. Line voltage.
POINT 8. Dedicated AC lines work.
POINT 9. AC line conditioning comes at all price points.
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Hey cmc64,
I've got a couple of the white ones. My big boy is a CS-1115. By looking at the pic's both my unit's must be quite old. All I know is that there's a huge transformer in the big one. Check e-bay for good prices but watch out for shipping charges as these can be VERY heavy. Now you guys have got me thinking about a setup for my home theater. Must resist.
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What about the power cords?
Between the point where the mains cabling enters my house and the outlet where the HiFi is connected there is several meters of rigid copper core cabling. So what negative impact would a decent cord of 6 feet long have?
Or, in other words, what changes when I have a somehow better power cord in place?
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Or, in other words, what changes when I have a somehow better power cord in place?
It depends.
I have a couple of the venhaus power cords. They made a huge improvement in the punch and depth of bass I got from my CAL Sigma II DAC. They had little impact on my Denon 2900. Nick loaned me a crump cord and I heard no effect on my 2900 but didn't try it on anything else. I also added a longer one between my MR1200 conditioner and the wall resulting in some additional percieved bass. I haven't really played with on the preamp.
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alright, dumb question, is there any risk/effect, to placing the power conditioner on the same shelf as the dvd transport, underneath it, so that the dvd player sits on top of it?
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i can't see why not
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i can't see why not
that is what I thought, just wanted a second opinion. Limited rack space :P
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Nick's Picks domino effect in action again. :P ;D
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If any of you clean AC power freaks are interested, I make some nice AC power cords. :) My Doghouse VH Power Cables are made based on the venerable Ven Haus power cable design with shielded 12 ga. silver-clad stock using Marinco hospital grade plugs and Schurter IECs. More info on my AC cables is in this thread (http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=49744.msg644680#msg644680).
Carry on. :spin:
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I made my own as well. very satisfied for the nominal investment.
what do you charge for yours Todd?
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If anyone is super adventurous, read the Felicia DIY balanced power conditioner thread at audiocircle.
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Nick's Picks domino effect in action again. :P ;D
at the price I got it for, what the hell...worst that can happen is better protection for my home theater :P
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Nick's Picks domino effect in action again. :P ;D
at the price I got it for, what the hell...worst that can happen is better protection for my home theater :P
That was the same thing I thought! +T to the thread.
Oh yeah, the lights and the AC voltage meter that looks like McIntosh makes it worth every penny. ;)
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alright got this installed today. When I was done installing it I decided it was worth it even if it doesnt improve a thing as it helps with alot of cable cleanup in my system...that and the surge protection are worth it.
Music - I am probably imagining this a bit, but I think I am getting a bigger soundstage...or maybe it is clearer imaging, as the one thing I know for certain is that the bass response is much better and there is a detail in the mid-upper range I was not getting before. Slight difference...in that I dont think it is night and day, but it has alot more seperation of the instruments than I had before. The analogy of the music jumping out at you is dead on as well.
Video - Dont notice much difference on SD programming. HD however has a change...seems to have a much better color definition...colors are definitely more vivid than they were before. DVD...minor video change, I am seeing some of the same effect as I see on HD, just a smaller scale.
Overall, well worth my $130 price after rebate...pretty happy I got it...for reference I was using a monster surge protection strip before...
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me too moke
(http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/audiomagic3/hero.jpg)
just a blue light ;)
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NG:, your not imagining it. you describe exactly what I was thinking w/my system.
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Generally, when installing a PC, you should be hearing a much blacker background, improved imaging and soundstaging, and probably more detauil, especially anything about about 1000, probably tighter bass too.
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This thing really did wonders for my analog cable TV signal. That definately helps with the GAF. Also, the soundstage does seem wider. Cleaning up the power cable clutter was the main thing for me though.
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now add some AC cables...and your in business.
i'm going to be building a bunch of 1m and .5m cords. i'll take pictures and post them FS when i'm done. they'll be cheap.
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I would suggest to try not stacking gear. Stacked electronics can allow for EMI to enter into the system. EMI can have a negative impact on the system's noise floor. Stacking may not affect playback quality, but I don't think I would assume anything in that situation. Isolation feet like Vibrapods would be helpful if you have to stack the units. Digital converters appreciate isolation.
On an unrelated note, I got some NOS GE black plate preamp tubes in my Aronov 960i integrated amp this week and they're starting to break in. It's like seeing an old friend again.
Happy Friday the 13th,
Chris
Eugene Hi-Fi
Eugene, Ore.
alright, dumb question, is there any risk/effect, to placing the power conditioner on the same shelf as the dvd transport, underneath it, so that the dvd player sits on top of it?
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thanks. I ended up keeping the components on seperate shelves just in case
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i've noticed that when i turn on my receiver (old pioneer unit), i hear alot of noise without even playing any cd or dat. at first i thought this was the speaker wire, but could all that noise be coming from the power used by other things in the house?
FWIW i'm referring to the system installed in my basement. i;ve got alot of electrical components hooked up down there, all feeding into the same circuit breaker. and the specific outlet where my receiver is plugged in has a computer and tv hooked up, all running through a cheapo powerstrip.
so is this monster unit going to help me eliminate my noise issues?
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i've noticed that when i turn on my receiver (old pioneer unit), i hear alot of noise without even playing any cd or dat. at first i thought this was the speaker wire, but could all that noise be coming from the power used by other things in the house?
FWIW i'm referring to the system installed in my basement. i;ve got alot of electrical components hooked up down there, all feeding into the same circuit breaker. and the specific outlet where my receiver is plugged in has a computer and tv hooked up, all running through a cheapo powerstrip.
so is this monster unit going to help me eliminate my noise issues?
I had a light static noise in my system that I had major problems trying to find. You had to put your ear to the tweeter to hear it, but it was there, bothered me, and I just couldn't get rid of it! Once I got a plasma screen it went away...the problem was the Sony Wega tube TV either backfeeding noise into the audio components, or causing interference.
I'd suggest unplugging everything from the receiver except for your speakers and seeing if there is noise. Then add in a component at a time and see which one is the culprit.
Later,
pjdavep
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thanks for the suggestion dave. i will give it a try tonight. +T
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cheater plugs helped me reduce said hiss/noise, but it did not eliminate it. I believe the Sony tube is the culprit in my system as well. Barely noticeable but severely annoying
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I decided to pick 1 of these up and it was delivered today its waiting for me to get out of work.
Anything special I should know about setting this up tips etc ?
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make sure you're sitting before you're blown away by the new sound. Don't want anyone falling over or anything.
LMAO
;D
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:)
what, me? a fluffer???
never!
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Nick (or anyone else) have you had a chance to do a little more listening and make any more observations?
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i've done lots of listening.
it made my system sound better, I can say with confidence. earth shatteringly better?
no. I have to admit that my excitement got the better of me. just that I could actualy notice an improvement got me all reved up.
I *think* the improvements are
- quiet "blackness" in the background
- better bass responce
- better imaging (tighter..which I didn't think possible as that is where my system really excells)
the major improvement, night and day..is in video playback. Most especialy DVD.
I need to make an AC cable for my deck and see if that adds to the improvements.
for sure, I have MUCH better surge protection, more outlets, and somce cool lights in my otherwise dark system.
not dissapointed w/the price at all.
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agree with everything Nick said. Definitely not a night and day improvement, but noticeable to me. Imagning and bass response is what I hear the most improvement in.
On video though, it is noticeable. I run my dvd, tv and sat receiver, as well as all the coax connections through it, and honestly, the DVD playback is marginally better...more contrast in colors...more vivid, but the HD channells on directv blow me away. What looked good before looks significantly better now...I also think, contrary to my earlier report, that is has improved my SD channels, though marginally. A couple of them (the analog ones for the most part) do not appear as grainy as they did to me before.
But bottom line, the surge protection and outlets alone make this unit a good buy. Really helped clean up alot of my cable clutter
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I would say that Bass response is what I have been noticing. they seem to have a lot more "punch" to them. I will have to do some more listening but I do hear a fairly significant difference.
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Question:
What sort of power cable comes with the Monster? Is it fixed or interchangeable? Do y'all think a high quality power cord leading from the wall to the line conditioner would make any difference?
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fixed.
Question:
What sort of power cable comes with the Monster? Is it fixed or interchangeable? Do y'all think a high quality power cord leading from the wall to the line conditioner would make any difference?
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I can't see it making much difference unless you had a clean outlet to begin with.
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Here's a link to get this thing for $110 after rebate. $100 if you're a new customer.
http://www.slickdeals.net/#p7084 (http://www.slickdeals.net/#p7084)
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is $100 a good price..?
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I just got mine last week from amazon for $175 which is $125 after the monster rebate. So $100 is a great price.
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after reading this thread I picked up the Monster 3500mkii...yeah, I'm impressed. Bigger soundstage, low end much more defined. Thanks for the recommendation. $110 with rebate....well worth it.
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This is what is in PS Audio's latest newsletter regarding PC's:
Why amp manufacturers say "don't"!
I've been asked to writer a little piece explaining why some amplifier
manufacturers still insist on putting warnings in their owner's manuals
about connecting their equipment to a power conditioner. New owners are
warned to plug directly into the wall because these designers "built
their equipment to sound best when powered without any interference from
an inline power conditioner". Or so the line goes.
Over the last 30 something years of designing amplifiers myself, I too
have been guilty of writing the same thing for PS Audio amplifiers. So
I can relate to their thinking processes and understand why they would
warn folks.
First, let's get something clear: no amp manufacturer or designer wants
anything more than to make sure you are happy with your amp purchase.
Let's face it; it's in their best interest for you to love their
product. So, to many designers it's just a safe bet to have as few variables
as possible and so it's a bit of CYA. Better safe than having to answer
a bunch of questions when things don't go right.
But why did I write those warning words before PS Audio invented the
world's first power regenerator? Simple: up to that point most power
conditioners made things worse. Unfortunately, not a lot has changed in the
meantime so today's amp manufacturers figure it's a safe bet to tell
their customers "just plug directly into the wall".
I remember, in fact, the very first power conditioners I listened to
(way back when) and my reaction was always the same: yuck. Bleached,
restricted sound. Gimme the wall socket back and quick!
But progress was at hand: to my delight, Bruce Brisson's MIT company
came out with the first power conditioner box that worked. It was called
the Z Stabilizer and it was a parallel device (nothing in series) that
didn't do a whole lot, but what it did - it did well and this box was
the piece that got me thinking about the possibilities of AC power "done
right" in the first place. Thanks Bruce!
So, with most power conditioners adding something sonically destructive
in series with the AC line, it's no wonder that some amp manufacturers
still insist on folks going with a direct plug in scenario. In fact,
think about this: even if the power conditioner you use doesn't actually
do anything good or bad (I'm not pointing fingers here, but they exist)
you have just added another power cable and its connectors to the amp
chain. Can't be better.
Several power conditioner manufacturers have "solved" this problem of
destructive series elements in the AC path by going the route of the old
Z Stabilizer: parallel. In a parallel processor like the Shunyata,
Richard Grey and Audience products (as examples) there's little to no
restriction to the power path and so damage is minimal. That's the good
news: unfortunately, there's not much real conditioning that can take place
with a parallel device. Just the nature of power physics.
But not all series devices are bad. If you're going to use a series
device so you can achieve a greater level of cleaning, like our UPC-200 or
UO products, it is critical that they do not restrict the power with
over-filtering (as so many do). One by one we've had great success
demonstrating how these properly designed products don't degrade the sound,
but rather improve it. It just takes time for word to get around. Over
filtering produces the bleached and anemic sound I wrote about above.
A regenerator, like the Power Plant, is a horse of a different color
however. Here, the opposite of restriction is happening because compared
to the wall socket, a Power Plant is less restrictive! That's right,
the raw wall socket is more restricted than a Power Plant's output - so
plugging directly into the wall outlet is never as good as a Power Plant
because we supply stored energy that regulates and lowers impedance to
the connected equipment. This stored energy is NOT available through
the wall socket. So amp manufacturers are actually hurting their case
when they lump all conditioners together into one bag of 'no, no's'. Not
all products fall into the same category of performance.
In any case, I thought it might be instructive to know why amp
manufacturers continue to suggest folks plug straight in. They're being safe.
Let's face it, there's plenty of bad power conditioning equipment out
there still and yes, it's worse to use a bad conditioner than going
straight into the wall. Beware.
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Bump.
I live in Cambridge, MA - old buildings, old wiring. Even on my cheap computer speakers I could hear an audbible hum. We live on the 3rd floor of 3, so this summer my roommates and I were running A/C an awful lot and blowing fuses way too much. I started getting worried about my computer and playback equipment - I put way too much money into that stuff to destroy it with all these spikes. Plus, I've started recording in 24bit recently and I don't want to hear the microwave hum through my speakers while I enjoy last night's work in full detail! ;)
Enter the APC H10.
http://www.apc.com/resource/include/techspec_index.cfm?base_sku=H10BLK (http://www.apc.com/resource/include/techspec_index.cfm?base_sku=H10BLK)
Throw on the Sennheiser cans ... and ... yup! ... Nick said it all.
the music started up and caught me by surprise. it seemed to just materialize out of thin air. you hear about "blackness" in the background ...low level noisefloor..etc. now I fully understand what that is *supposed* to be like.
Worth every penny!
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+T for toys. I wanna get into one of these, but no space and no money.
:-\
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nice.
i'm fuckin'A articuliceous ain't I?
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hey, ford p - what is the price of that unit..?
tim (if you are reading) - how does this thing compare to that furutech thing we bought a while ago (i still use mine)...?
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Balanced Power is where it is at. Check the equitech, BPT, or DIY and you will be amazed.
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hey, ford p - what is the price of that unit..?
I got mine from YesMicro. It was the cheapest vendor according to Froogle.
http://froogle.google.com/froogle?q=h10blk&hl=en&btnG=Search&lmode=online&scoring=p
About $260 shipped. More than most people paid for theirs, but I use APC's equipment a lot at work and I really trust their name.
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hey, ford p - what is the price of that unit..?
tim (if you are reading) - how does this thing compare to that furutech thing we bought a while ago (i still use mine)...?
I'm still using the furutech, I live in a 90 year old loft now and I still get complete blackness :)
I'd like to hear some of these other products though, especially anything with surge protection
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I run a Panamax M5510Pro AC power regenerator. Granted I sell stereo equipment for a living so I don't pay retail for my gear but it makes a hell of a difference... esp on tube gear where fluctuations in ac can mess up bias and reduce tube life. As for the Amp question, most quailty AC conditioners have a high current outlet or two that bypass any regen and much of the filtering to avoid current limiting issues. Steer clear of any models that don't have this feature.