Topic: AT853's > Deneke PS-2 > MT24/96...HELP! how do I keep from brickwalling?

[symoka01]

Please help! I just picked up AT853's and a Deneke PS2 with 1/8" jack going into my MT24/96.  I'm taping a loud show on Tuesday but while testing my new rig today at home, I could not keep the test from brickwalling...even though my MT was on the lowest possible input setting.  Can anyone tell me how the hell I can get these mics to keep from brickwalling loud sources? I used to use CSC's (core sound stealthy cards) and had no probs at all with brickwalling. 

I'm pretty new to phantom power mics.  Do I want to keep the phantom power setting on my MT off? What can I do? I'm at a loss as to what I should do.

Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks!

[nameloc01]

strange i have the same mics and power supply. and, even though i've only used them 3xs so far, the results lead me to believe that this combo is very hard to brickwall ( in fact, there were occasions where i EXPECTED them too and they did not what so ever.). did you test them with your stereo or something, if so,man thats like minimal SPLs and something is way wrong. i have never used an MT so i cant help with that.hang in there, i'm sure someone will intervene that may know what the hell is going on.

so the MT is capable of providing PP? i would think that should be off, since you're running the PS-2.

[Zaphod]

Are you running mic-in or line-in on the MT?

[symoka01]

Are you running mic-in or line-in on the MT?

Yea, I don't know what is wrong.  I've been running them mic-in using the 1'8" jack.  Even with my MT input settings at the lowest possible setting, it brickwalls when i put it up to my decent speakers at a pretty loud level...nowhere near a loud rock show though.  So I have my AT853's feeding into the Deneke PS-2, with a new duracell 9v battery, feeding into my MT via the 1'8" jack.  Any suggestions?

[Zaphod]

Try running line-in into the MT, I bet that will solve your problem.

[symoka01]

Try running line-in into the MT, I bet that will solve your problem.

I only have the 1/8" jack Deneke PS-2.  Can I run that line in? is there an easy way to convert the Deneke ps-2 to line in if its not possible with the 1/8" jack?

[Zaphod]

Try running line-in into the MT, I bet that will solve your problem.

I only have the 1/8" jack Deneke PS-2.  Can I run that line in? is there an easy way to convert the Deneke ps-2 to line in if its not possible with the 1/8" jack?

Nope you'll need an XLR to 1/4" male adapter to run line in....

Question is why are you running a PS2 when the MT provides phantom power via line-in?

[nameloc01]

the denecke has a 1/8 male line out.. what does the MT have?.. a 1/4 in or a 1/8 in.
yeah, whatever you need to do to run the denecke into the line in jack is what probably needs to be done.my mic ins on my hi-mds do the same thing,i always run line in.

i am a little confused as to what you are saying.where would the XLR adaptor come in?(other than between the mics and denecke, unless you dont have a ps-2 model and you need 2 male mini XLRs to single 1/8 male for the output)
 you should have this:
  mics(mini xlrs)>nady cbm 40s ( i assume)>denecke ps-2 (1/8 male line out)> line in MT.

[Zaphod]

the denecke has a 1/8 male line out.. what does the MT have?.. a 1/4 in or a 1/8 in.
yeah, whatever you need to do to run the denecke into the line in jack is what probably needs to be done.

Unless its been modded the PS2 has XLR outs I'm fairly certain.

[nameloc01]

the denecke has a 1/8 male line out.. what does the MT have?.. a 1/4 in or a 1/8 in.
yeah, whatever you need to do to run the denecke into the line in jack is what probably needs to be done.

Unless its been modded the PS2 has XLR outs I'm fairly certain.

they do come like that.SP sells the PS-2, which had the XLRs (out) modded to a 1/8 male.if you dont have this mod, they sell a cable that is double mini XLR to a 1/8 male.
i have the modded ps-2. its a lot easier not having to deal with that extra cable.

[bluntforcetrauma]

running the denecke with the 1/8 " might be a problem" i dont know.  I run the Denecke with XLR's with DPA 4002 mics.  The 1/8" does not have the 3 pin like the XLR to handle the input.  this is probably totally useless to you.

Do you need the Ps2 to run the AT 853's?

[nameloc01]

Do you need the Ps2 to run the AT 853's?

the 853 need phantom power to run correctly, otherwise they are very easily overpowered ( with a standard BB)

[symoka01]

Yes, I have the Deneke ps-2 w/ the 1/8" jack mod.  therefore I am not certain if I am even capable of running line in. I was told that getting the ps-2 for my AT853's would be all I need to record via my Microtrack. I can record but like I said, it still brickwalls quite easily.  I was hoping to tape on tuesday using it but I wouldn't be able to get a part by then I dont think.  Any suggestions on what can be done based on what I currently have?

[nameloc01]

Yes, I have the Deneke ps-2 w/ the 1/8" jack mod.  therefore I am not certain if I am even capable of running line in. I was told that getting the ps-2 for my AT853's would be all I need to record via my Microtrack. I can record but like I said, it still brickwalls quite easily.  I was hoping to tape on tuesday using it but I wouldn't be able to get a part by then I dont think.  Any suggestions on what can be done based on what I currently have?

you need to run that 1/8 line that is coming out of the denecke, into the LINE IN JACK on the MT, not the MIC IN  on the MT. it does have a LINE IN jack right?

[Church-Audio]

Do you need the Ps2 to run the AT 853's?

the 853 need phantom power to run correctly, otherwise they are very easily overpowered ( with a standard BB)

That's not totally true.. With my 4.7k mod you dont even need a battery box. You just need a good recorder with a good built in preamp for really loud shows... And for quieter ones a good external 2 wire preamp and the 853 mics will perform as well or better then with phantom power.

Chris

[nameloc01]

Do you need the Ps2 to run the AT 853's?

the 853 need phantom power to run correctly, otherwise they are very easily overpowered ( with a standard BB)

That's not totally true.. With my 4.7k mod you dont even need a battery box. You just need a good recorder with a good built in preamp for really loud shows... And for quieter ones a good external 2 wire preamp and the 853 mics will perform as well or better then with phantom power.

Chris

i was waiting for that.

i am really curious how they perform using the AT power modules.supposedly it is an even better setup than the mod,the ps-2 and the 3 wire.

[symoka01]

Yes, I have the Deneke ps-2 w/ the 1/8" jack mod.  therefore I am not certain if I am even capable of running line in. I was told that getting the ps-2 for my AT853's would be all I need to record via my Microtrack. I can record but like I said, it still brickwalls quite easily.  I was hoping to tape on tuesday using it but I wouldn't be able to get a part by then I dont think.  Any suggestions on what can be done based on what I currently have?

you need to run that 1/8 line that is coming out of the denecke, into the LINE IN JACK on the MT, not the MIC IN  on the MT. it does have a LINE IN jack right?

I don't believe there is a 1/8" line in for the MT.  Can anyone confirm if I can run the 1/8" into anywhere on my MT other than the mic in? I would like to keep my rig as small as possible b/c I will be stealthing on Tuesday.  I'm somewhat frustrated that the 1/8" is being overpowered.  If I had been told this, I would have just saved all the money and hassle to get an un-modded deneke ps-2.  Now I might have to spend extra money and have an additional cord to record shows.  Whats the point of getting the 1/8" jack on the ps-2 if shows will always overpower it using an MT?

Can anyone confirm that buying an 1/8" to 1/4" converter would indeed solve my brickwalling problem? I'd like to be able to solve this problem simply with my current 1/8" jack if possible.

[cmoorevt]

The line in on the MT is via the 2x1/4" inputs.  You'll need a stereo mini>>>2 x 1/4" Y cable.

[nameloc01]

The line in on the MT is via the 2x1/4" inputs.  You'll need a stereo mini>>>2 x 1/4" Y cable.

and there it is.the adaptor will run you a few bucks.good luck.

[symoka01]

Thanks for everyone who helped on this I appreciate it...this place rules! I will get the converter tomorrow when radioshack opens up.  I'm taping tool on Tuesday for those who want to hear.

[Church-Audio]

Do you need the Ps2 to run the AT 853's?

the 853 need phantom power to run correctly, otherwise they are very easily overpowered ( with a standard BB)

That's not totally true.. With my 4.7k mod you dont even need a battery box. You just need a good recorder with a good built in preamp for really loud shows... And for quieter ones a good external 2 wire preamp and the 853 mics will perform as well or better then with phantom power.

Chris

i was waiting for that.

i am really curious how they perform using the AT power modules.supposedly it is an even better setup than the mod,the ps-2 and the 3 wire.

The phantom modules are three wire.. They power the mics the same exact way as three wire except that you also have an impedance converter built in.. In some cases you have a high pass filter that reduces the low end performance of the 853 microphone... But when there is no built in high pass filter, and you couple it with a good mic preamp the performance with the "right" adapters is good.

Chris

[nameloc01]

Thanks for everyone who helped on this I appreciate it...this place rules! I will get the converter tomorrow when radioshack opens up.  I'm taping tool on Tuesday for those who want to hear.

i definitely want to hear it. i am taping them on sun. and tues. of next week.

[kbergend]

The 1/8" jack to 2x1/4" phone plugs should indeed solve your probem, and you'll also have a much cleaner sounding recording via the line-in jacks.  Make sure you set the input to 1/4" TRS in the Microtrack menu, and move the input switch to "L".  Also make sure the phantom power switch on the MT is turned off.

Good luck!

[Nick's Picks]

If you would like your PS2 re-modded so that it will natively work w/your MT (by removing the 3.5mm stereo plug and replacing it with balanced 1/4 TRS inputs), ping me.  i'll do it for you cheap.

but...at that point, you no longer need the PS2 as the MT will power them w/its phantom.  dont need the redundant step, and the ps2 "out of the loop" makes for an even smaller deck.

[symoka01]

If you would like your PS2 re-modded so that it will natively work w/your MT (by removing the 3.5mm stereo plug and replacing it with balanced 1/4 TRS inputs), ping me.  i'll do it for you cheap.

but...at that point, you no longer need the PS2 as the MT will power them w/its phantom.  dont need the redundant step, and the ps2 "out of the loop" makes for an even smaller deck.

Thanks for the Mod offer.  I went to radioshack and makeshifted 1/4" jacks using too many parts Recording last night went well but I was worried the 1/8" was going to disconnect with the female piece feeding into the 1/4" jacks.

The reason I bought the ps-2 is that I cannot plug my AT853's directly into my MT.  Is there a way to plug my AT853's into my MT directly without an extra piece?

If it is possible to do, do you know how much battery life (recording time) would be lost running phantom power through my MT?

Thanks.

[Nick's Picks]

yes...you can cut those cables and put 1/4ers on there.  two individual balanced ones.  > MT (phantom) viola!

[symoka01]

yes...you can cut those cables and put 1/4ers on there.  two individual balanced ones.  > MT (phantom) viola!

Are there any sound quality pros or cons if I were to cut the cable and put 1/4's on there? I would think that everyone with an MT would avoid the 3 prong connectors on mics then and simply go straight to 1/4's and use the phantom straight from the MT.  Are there any other performance variances I should consider if I were to cut the 3 prong pieces off and put 1/4's on in place of them?

How much drain on the MT battery would it be to run phantom power straight through that?

Thanks for your offer on converting the mics for me. How much are you asking?

[Nick's Picks]

a quarter of a hundred.
:-)  quick job..., parts in stock (right angled 1/4" plugs).

[symoka01]

a quarter of a hundred.
:-)  quick job..., parts in stock (right angled 1/4" plugs).

What kind of turnaround time? I would like to use these mics for a couple shows in the middle of july.  If we can get the turnaround done quick, lets do it.