Topic: ART DPS II (dual channel tube pre) - Yay or nay???????

[Evil Taper]

I'm putting together a new rig for open taping with a goal of warm, musical sound yet un-bloated results.  Portability isn't really an issue for me since I'll have access to whatever power source I need at gigs where I'd be using this rig.  I'd love to be able to make recordings that are as warm and liquidy smooth as those classic 70s albums we all love.  So I was thinking that a decent tube pre may be able to offer something closer to my goal than just mic voicing alone.  So that is my goal and what I'd like to do with this, is it realistic?  Here are the specs:

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DPS II - Digital Preamplifier System Features
• Variable Input Impedance
• 24bit/96KHz A-to-D Conversion
• Improved V3™ Variable Valve Voicing Presets
• LED Input Meter
• Analog Output Meter
• Enhanced ART Tube Technology Warms the Conversion
• Automaticly switches between instrument and mic preamp
• Wide Frequency Response (5hz/50kHz)
• Enhanced OPL™ Output Protection Limiter

DPS II - Digital Preamplifier System Specifications
CMRR >75dB (typ. @ 1kHz)
Dimensions 5.5"d x 19"w x 1.75"h
Dynamic Range >100dB
Equivalent Input Noise -129dBu (A weighted, xlr to xlr)
Frequency Response 5Hz to 50kHz (+0 to -1dB)
Input/Output Connections 1/4" RTS unbalanced. Tip = input, Ring = analog output. 10K Input impedance. 0dBu = digital clip point at input level max. Level control offers full mute at min setting. • Sample Rate: Internal Selectable 44.1KHz, 48KHz, 88.2KHz, 96KHz • External: Wordclock, ADAT. • Wordclock Input: BNC connector, 100 Ohms (terminated), 3.25V p-p min, 25KHz (min) to 105KHz (max) sample rate. • Optical Input: ADAT optical Selectable for sample rate locking. Also used as a source of ADAT data to be transmitted on unused ADAT channels. • Optical Output: ADAT optical or S/PDIF selectable. • ADAT Mode: Contains 24 bit ADAT data arranged DPS CH1 = ADAT odd channel(s), CH2 = even channel(s).
Maximum Gain 74dB (inst. input to xlr)
Maximum Gain XLR to XLR 80dB
Maximum Input Level +19dBu (xlr); +22dBu (inst. input)
Maximum Output Level +28dBu (xlr); +22dBu (1/4")
Phantom Power +48 volts
Total Harmonic Distortion .01% (clean), 0.1% (warm)
Vacuum Tube 12AX7A - Dual Triode (Hand Selected)
Weight 4.85 lbs. (2.2 kg)

[Nick's Picks]

i've looked at this a few times myself.
go for it!

[pfife]

My only suggestion is that since you have the R-1, maybe you could find something a little bit more economical that doesn't do the A/D conversion.... might not have a choice, but you'd be paying for something you won't use.  Otherwise, I bet this would rule.

Behringer made a tube signal processor (and I can't remember the name of it...) and even though its Behringer, its damn awesome... some friends of mine had it in their setup to record their band, and they raved about it.   Then, when my band went into a REAL studio, I was flabbergassed when the engineer pulled one of those suckers out... he loved it too.  Maybe someone here knows what peice I'm talking about...

[zowie]

I think its a great deal for the money.  It's AC only.  I considered it but decided I was better off sticking with my Roland MMP-2 when AC power is available (not tubed, but an even better deal and unbelievably versatile box when you can find one).  You really have a lot of choices when you can use AC.

You might want to look into whether it's really a tube pre and not a solid state pre with what amounts to a tube effects loop, as many of the low cost "tube preamps" in actuality are.  If that's the case, you might be better off using a better pre or DAC if you already own own one and adding "warmth" in post.

There's a lot of info about ART pre's on homerecording.com bbs.

[Evil Taper]

Vacuum Tube 12AX7A - Dual Triode (Hand Selected)

So there's tubes in the thing.  I have a behringer unit with 12ax7 in it now but it only runs 1 mic.  NOthing compares to tube warth for real, I use that pre to fatten and warm up the normally shrill modern day electronic instruments.  Sure it's nice to have every classic roland drum machine in 1 unit but the grooveboxes sound shrill and piercing instead of dense like the classic models.  I'm thinkin I'm gonna buy this thing in a little bit and try it out in a few different situations...sounds promissing though.

[cfbarlow]

It is a great sounding pre- I have an older one the DIO pro- two channel tube pre with ad, the only thing is that it truncates down to 16bit, but for straight 24 bit it sounds fantastic.

[zowie]

Vacuum Tube 12AX7A - Dual Triode (Hand Selected)

So there's tubes in the thing.  I have a behringer unit with 12ax7 in it now but it only runs 1 mic.  NOthing compares to tube warth for real, I use that pre to fatten and warm up the normally shrill modern day electronic instruments.  Sure it's nice to have every classic roland drum machine in 1 unit but the grooveboxes sound shrill and piercing instead of dense like the classic models.  I'm thinkin I'm gonna buy this thing in a little bit and try it out in a few different situations...sounds promissing though.

I know there's a tube in it.  The question is whether the tube is an active part of the preamp circuit or a side chain.

[muj]

I'm putting together a new rig for open taping with a goal of warm, musical sound yet un-bloated results.  Portability isn't really an issue for me since I'll have access to whatever power source I need at gigs where I'd be using this rig.  I'd love to be able to make recordings that are as warm and liquidy smooth as those classic 70s albums we all love.  So I was thinking that a decent tube pre may be able to offer something closer to my goal than just mic voicing alone.  So that is my goal and what I'd like to do with this, is it realistic?  Here are the specs:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DPS II - Digital Preamplifier System Features
? Variable Input Impedance
? 24bit/96KHz A-to-D Conversion
? Improved V3? Variable Valve Voicing Presets
? LED Input Meter
? Analog Output Meter
? Enhanced ART Tube Technology Warms the Conversion
? Automaticly switches between instrument and mic preamp
? Wide Frequency Response (5hz/50kHz)
? Enhanced OPL? Output Protection Limiter

DPS II - Digital Preamplifier System Specifications
CMRR >75dB (typ. @ 1kHz)
Dimensions 5.5"d x 19"w x 1.75"h
Dynamic Range >100dB
Equivalent Input Noise -129dBu (A weighted, xlr to xlr)
Frequency Response 5Hz to 50kHz (+0 to -1dB)
Input/Output Connections 1/4" RTS unbalanced. Tip = input, Ring = analog output. 10K Input impedance. 0dBu = digital clip point at input level max. Level control offers full mute at min setting. ? Sample Rate: Internal Selectable 44.1KHz, 48KHz, 88.2KHz, 96KHz ? External: Wordclock, ADAT. ? Wordclock Input: BNC connector, 100 Ohms (terminated), 3.25V p-p min, 25KHz (min) to 105KHz (max) sample rate. ? Optical Input: ADAT optical Selectable for sample rate locking. Also used as a source of ADAT data to be transmitted on unused ADAT channels. ? Optical Output: ADAT optical or S/PDIF selectable. ? ADAT Mode: Contains 24 bit ADAT data arranged DPS CH1 = ADAT odd channel(s), CH2 = even channel(s).
Maximum Gain 74dB (inst. input to xlr)
Maximum Gain XLR to XLR 80dB
Maximum Input Level +19dBu (xlr); +22dBu (inst. input)
Maximum Output Level +28dBu (xlr); +22dBu (1/4")
Phantom Power +48 volts
Total Harmonic Distortion .01% (clean), 0.1% (warm)
Vacuum Tube 12AX7A - Dual Triode (Hand Selected)
Weight 4.85 lbs. (2.2 kg)

most of the 70's sound belongs to neve,harrison,quad,studer etc console, and most of the gear that time was fully tranformer balanced. the tube thing in these ART products is just a gimmick, most pro tube gear run at 300-350 volt power rails.Just by lookin at the words "warmth",,just proves the gimmick..what is warmth anayway?. if you want the 70's sound get a-designs pacifica ..i think it runs at 1500, or get the new presonus adl600,,best street price i heard was 1800.

[zowie]

Some good points, muj.  70s audio was not about tubes.  But let's not forget that part of the 70s sound also is attributable to analogue tape.

More basically, I don't think of the 70s sound as being particularly good and worth emulating, although that may be more attributable to the trend to cram too many tracks onto a tape, use of Sonic Maximizers, and cheap pressings.   Of course that's a vast overgeneralization, there were certainly some very good recordings.

Still, I'm not trying to discourage Evil from buying the DPS.  It's nice for the very modest money.

[bluegrass_brad]

Still, I'm not trying to discourage Evil from buying the DPS.  It's nice for the very modest money.

and noisy too

[cfbarlow]

Muj is right, the "glow" of this tube is from two led's below it.  The tube itself does not glow,therefore, it is not getting the proper voltage for true tube "warmth"

[Nick's Picks]

still...
i wonder how it sounds.
if only it were DC powered...it would be the ultimate cheap front end

[Evil Taper]

it can't be THAT hard to rig something up so suck a large Lith batt to a voltage converter and what not....some techie person knows how to do this.

[muj]

Muj is right, the "glow" of this tube is from two led's below it.  The tube itself does not glow,therefore, it is not getting the proper voltage for true tube "warmth"

thank you it reminded me of this
http://www.record-producer.com/learn.cfm?a=2838

 

[Roving Sign]

I've been using the dbx386 with great results...very happy with it...I beleive it is a true tube unit...2 tubes running at higher voltages...

I also have the Beheringer Ultragain tube stereo tube pre as well - this is one of the single tube, low voltage units - it sounds nice as well - but a little "sharper" than the dbx...and not as well built...but you can get these for 50-60 bucks on ebay...

Nice metering on both...

I like using tubes in the recording process - better than playback - when I've tried tube pres in my playback system - I always get tired of them and go back to solid state (actually I prefer passive pres!) -