Topic: FLAC library management software

[Shawn]

does anyone know of any flac library management software that doesn't modify the FLAC files if you change the metadata associated with the files?

I downloaded media monkey and I dig the UI for the most part, and it does just about everything I want it to do (play 16 and 24 bit flacs, sort files by various paramters, enter metadata). The only problem is that entering metadata actually changes the FLAC files. I guess it uses the flac tags to store all the data, which would be fine, but the problem is that the md5's for the flacs no longer match once they've been changed. So I have hundreds of sources in circulation that don't include the tags and if I import them into media monkey and add all the meta data now my FLACs no longer match the ones I've put into circulation. BIG bummer.

I'd like a tool that manages the metadata for the FLAC files without using the flac tags so that my files will match the ones I've already put into circulation. Does anyone know of any tool that can do that? 

[scb]

match the flac fingerprints instead of the md5. 

[Shawn]

the fingerprints will match even if the file has been changed? if so that is awesome, and I will probably go that route.

edit: just found my answer here: http://wiki.etree.org/index.php?page=FlacMetadata

thanks and plus T scott.

[Shawn]

after thinking about this a little more... I guess that still doesn't get around the fact that the files don't match the ones in circulation. Sure the fingerprints would match, but I still wouldn't be able to reseed torrents because the files haved changed and the md5's for my master files still wouldn't match the files I've uploaded to archive.org. It's not perfect, but it may just have to do.

[scb]

that's the entire point of the fingerprint, though.  think of it as an md5 of just the audio data.  no matter what you change in the tags, the fingerprint will stay the same. 

you seem to want a program that will tag your files without actually writing to the files themselves.  so basically, you want an app that maintains it's own database of tags per file.  i don't know if that exists (i'm not a windows guy) but if it did, the tags wouldn't be readable in any other app since they woudln't be in the actual files

[Shawn]

You nailed it on the head. I want a program that maintains it's own database of tags, and can play FLAC files. It wouldn't bother me that the tags aren't readable in other programs. I'd rather have that problem than have my masters no longer match the files I put into circulation (at least from an md5 perspective). my hang up is mostly that I'd prefer that my master files continue to match the files on archive.org form an md5 perspective. personally I don't care about md5 vs flac fingerprint, but since archive.org requires md5s I'm kinda forced to use them on sources I circulate that way.

[attheshow]

How about getting an external hard drive and archiving the oroginal downloads separately from your playable FLAC library? It'll cost you an exterlan drive, but it will give you a backup of your data and you'll be able to grab the original directory created by the torrent/downloaded if you need to reseed.

[Shawn]

How about getting an external hard drive and archiving the oroginal downloads separately from your playable FLAC library? It'll cost you an exterlan drive, but it will give you a backup of your data and you'll be able to grab the original directory created by the torrent/downloaded if you need to reseed.

I have two 500gb hard drives that I am using to archive my shows right now (one drive simply mirrors the other). It is an interesting suggesstion. I guess I could leave the files on my back up drive untouched. Meanwhile the mods forced by updating the meta data would only affect the files on my primary drive. I could always go back to the backup drive to get the original files that were seeded if needed. And going forward If I tag all of my files before circulating them they will match the back up.

It's not a perfect solution, but I guess it could work. Sort of seems silly to have a "backup" that was intentionally different from the source, but whatever. I obviously have things to think about here.

[attheshow]

That's how I handle it. It's much more important to me to save the audio than to save the tag info. So my audio is stored redundantly, but my tags are split between "original" and dynamic. I guess if you had lots of extra space you could back up the originals drive as well, to ensure you never lost those original tags. The dynamic ones I don't worry about so much.

[Patrick]

I just recently began to tag my flac files, and have wondered if I should go back and tag every single show I've taped in the last 3 years.  It's an overwhelming task and probably something I am just going to let go.  Maybe someday when I have some free time, but like attheshow said, it's more important that the flacs are saved rather than the tags. 

[JasonSobel]

I'm not sure what program you're all using to tag FLACs, but here's what I do (and why)...

I create a batch file (.bat) that adds all the tags using the DOS command prompt using metaflac.exe
I then save all the batch files that I do, and it's easy to store all of these, as it's essentially just a text file.

so, at any point in time, say, if my harddrive crashes and I go back to my archived DVD to restore the data to a new HD.  but the archived DVD is the untagged version.  it is then trivial to add all the tags back.  just double click each .bat file, and with 2 or 3 seconds, all the FLAC files are re-tagged.  or, if you want to seed a show, but for some reason, you want to seed the "untagged" version because that is already what's "out there", you can easily remove all the tags with the "metaflac --remove-all-tags filename1.flac filename2.flac" line.  then, when you're done seeding, just re-tag with the saved batch file.   or, even better, just make a copy of the tagged files, strip the tags from the copy, seed, and then delete the untagged when you're done seeding.

if you want to check out what my batch files look like, I've attached one of them.

[KLowe]

stupid question here but....

how does one verify flac fingerprints? 

Is it a manual process?  Does Flac frontend do it?

MD5's I "get".... never really "got" the flac fingerprints.

[Gordon]

stupid question here but....

how does one verify flac fingerprints? 

Is it a manual process?  Does Flac frontend do it?

MD5's I "get".... never really "got" the flac fingerprints.

load the flac files into frontend.  make a ffp and compare it to the original.  honestly though I just test the flacs 9 times out of 10.  I now tag all my flacs with foobar.  I never make md5s for shows so it doesn't matter.  if it's the "original" flacs the ffp will match and they will test the same whether they are tagged or not.

[davepeck]

I'm not sure what program you're all using to tag FLACs, but here's what I do (and why)...

I create a batch file (.bat) that adds all the tags using the DOS command prompt using metaflac.exe
I then save all the batch files that I do, and it's easy to store all of these, as it's essentially just a text file.

so, at any point in time, say, if my harddrive crashes and I go back to my archived DVD to restore the data to a new HD.  but the archived DVD is the untagged version.  it is then trivial to add all the tags back.  just double click each .bat file, and with 2 or 3 seconds, all the FLAC files are re-tagged.  or, if you want to seed a show, but for some reason, you want to seed the "untagged" version because that is already what's "out there", you can easily remove all the tags with the "metaflac --remove-all-tags filename1.flac filename2.flac" line.  then, when you're done seeding, just re-tag with the saved batch file.   or, even better, just make a copy of the tagged files, strip the tags from the copy, seed, and then delete the untagged when you're done seeding.

if you want to check out what my batch files look like, I've attached one of them.

that seems like a LOT of manual editing to create that original .bat file though, no?

i use a program called Tag And Rename, and i couldn't be happier with it. i always tag my flacs, and it really makes it a breeze.

[JasonSobel]

that seems like a LOT of manual editing to create that original .bat file though, no?

i use a program called Tag And Rename, and i couldn't be happier with it. i always tag my flacs, and it really makes it a breeze.

it's not really too bad.  I open up each text file in ms word, and do a "find and replace" on the file names.  from there, it's just updating venue info, source info, and song names...