Topic: Which Portable Recording machine ?

[furkin]

Hi all,
I’m a complete newbie to digital / portable recording and want to do some outdoor / wildlife recording - in stereo.

I'm well behind the times now, & know now't about current technology or brands etc, so am hoping someone can point me in the right direction as far as recorders/equipment go.

I’m a disabled pensioner and I'm not 100% certain what I want from a machine, so don't want to spend a fortune - yet. I do know that the machine will need to have mic in sockets, as I want to use separate mic's.  I have no idea what features to look for or what the latest techno-speak means.

Eventually I want to put the recordings onto disc &/or save to PC and have been advised that the quality needs to be better than basic Dictaphones & Voice recorders.

Any ideas please ?

Feel free to put any other information that you think might help for my quest.

thanks for reading.

[John Willett]

Hi all,
I’m a complete newbie to digital / portable recording and want to do some outdoor / wildlife recording - in stereo.

I'm well behind the times now, & know now't about current technology or brands etc, so am hoping someone can point me in the right direction as far as recorders/equipment go.

I’m a disabled pensioner and I'm not 100% certain what I want from a machine, so don't want to spend a fortune - yet. I do know that the machine will need to have mic in sockets, as I want to use separate mic's.  I have no idea what features to look for or what the latest techno-speak means.

Eventually I want to put the recordings onto disc &/or save to PC and have been advised that the quality needs to be better than basic Dictaphones & Voice recorders.

Any ideas please ?

Feel free to put any other information that you think might help for my quest.

thanks for reading.

Hi furkin, welcome to the forum.

What sort of budget do you have?

Portable recorders can go from a little over £100 to £10,000 plus - Mine is around the middle at £5,000.

Do you want a stereo machine or multi-channel?

At the good quality but inexpensive end, I would look at the Fostex FR-2 and Fostex FR-2LE for stereo, or the Tascam DR-680 for multi-channel.

At the professional end, for stereo I would look at the Sound Devices 702 and 722 and the Nagra LB.

For professional multi-tracks I would look at the SD 744T, 788T, AETA 4MinX and the Nagra VI (I have the Nagra VI).

I hope this helps.

[aaronji]

Do you already have mics (or know which ones you want to run)?  The Sony PCM-M10 is inexpensive and has a pretty quiet pre, but only an 1/8" input (meaning that for many mics you would need an extra box to supply phantom power)...

Maybe worth looking at the Marantz PMD661 (which does do phantom) or the Sony PCM-D50 (which does not) at the lower end of the price spectrum too. 

[rastasean]

I think a great all in one unit for you would be the Fostex FR-2LE and we have one in the yard sale right here:
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=145008.0
This unit is known to nature recordists to have very quiet pre-amps, long battery life, and pretty easy to use. The one I own works great for me. One of the nice things about it is that it can run on RC 7.2 volt batteries so you don't need to fill it up with AA batteries.

The m10 is a great recorder but you will then need a pre-amp to power most microphones.

[furkin]

Thanks folks for some great advice.
I hadn't come across the brands suggested, so i'll have a search for details.

BUDGET: 
Low.  As I don't know exactly what I want to do, or what to expect, I had no idea what to expect.
I saw a Stage-Line item at £65, but this was soon dismissed.
Also looked at (on the internet anyway) Teac VR-20 and Sanyo Xacti (ICR-XPS01M).
Since starting I was looking to spend around £100 as a beginners kit - but it looks like i'll need to spend a bit more to get a (half) decent quality.  As I want to record outdoor/wildlife/nature, I suppose my main concern is the quietness of the machine in the background, in case the required input is low.

MIC's:
I don't have any at the moment, but have read up on making my own using the Panasonic MW 61A units.  It now looks like I need to match them with whatever recorder I get.

CHANNELS:
I was expecting to use 2 channel.  I'm hoping to mix other sounds onto it, so although I don't think I need 4 track, I will need to look for a PC prog to do this (more advice please).

If I want to end up with Surround-Sound - would I still start with a stereo kit - and use a PC prog to make it SS or would I need a 4 track ?  sorry if this is sounding too basic, but I expected to learn these things as I go.

cheers all
   

[F.O.Bean]

4 channel if wanting to go SS

[John Willett]

4 channel if wanting to go SS

Yes - in which case I think the Tascam DR-680 is the most affordable option.

[RichT]

If you're looking to make a homebrew solution with WM61A capsules, it's easier to power them with one of the smaller handheld recorders which has a microphone input with 'plug in power'.  The Sony PCM-M10 and PCM-D50 have a reliable 3v output which will power these microphones, although cheaper Tascam, Zoom, Edirol etc handheld recorders will also do the job (or the new Nagra handheld for much more).  Alternatively you can use a 9V battery to power them with larger recorders with XLR inputs or make a regulator circuit to step down from 48V.

All of these recorders will work in stereo and cannot be synced together with other recorders so recording using surround techniques isn't possible, although the Tascam DR-2D will record 4 separate external inputs at a push.

If you're constructing surround mixes in post based on stereo recordings something like Soundfield's upmix software (or hardware) can help: http://www.soundfield.com/products/upm1-plugin.php
 

[furkin]

Thanks again folks,
Just looked at some of the machines recommended here,,,, and,,, wow, some of 'em look great.
Unfortunately, my circumstances won't allow most of 'em.  Of course, that's not to say, once I get into it, that I won’t want to up-grade (hobbies tend to take over once in operation ?!).

Before seeking help, I’d seen a few machines at around £100, so thought I’d push the boat out & look for something at about £140.  I think I need to be strict with myself, & look at an absolute maximum of £200 for everything I’ll need.
I see:
Zoom H2 -         £150
Tascam DR-05   £100
Tascam DR-07   £140
Roland R-05      £170.

Pro’s & con’s of these (or others in the range) appreciated.

4 Channel:
Not at the moment. Stereo will have to suffice.

MIC’s:
I was looking at the Panny WM 61a/b (Linkwitz) method as it seemed very reasonable.  Reading the features, it looks a very cheap way of obtaining decent mic’s.  As usual, any advice on this is welcome.

cheers

[furkin]

Recorders:
Just been looking at:
Sony       M-10
Olympus LS-11.

Initially out of my range, but if either is far far better than the previous list, I expect I could manage it (will have to go without meals for a couple of weeks, but I can stand that )

MIC's:
As to external mic inputs; is it better - generally - to use Line-In or Mic-In ?

[jbell]

If your getting a handheld go with the M10!

[earmonger]

If you know anyone who lives in or travels to the US, you can get the PCM-M10 for $229 (US) in New York City from

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/638090-REG/Sony_PCM_M10_BLACK_PCM_M10_Portable_Audio_Recorder.html

That would be your best budget recorder, and I'm not the only one on this board who loves it.

I know they are ridiculously more expensive in Europe. People here have suggested that the Roland R-05 is the best unit for the money in Europe. Search for the threads on it.

[12milluz]

If you know anyone who lives in or travels to the US, you can get the PCM-M10 for $229 (US) in New York City from

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/638090-REG/Sony_PCM_M10_BLACK_PCM_M10_Portable_Audio_Recorder.html

That would be your best budget recorder, and I'm not the only one on this board who loves it.

I know they are ridiculously more expensive in Europe. People here have suggested that the Roland R-05 is the best unit for the money in Europe. Search for the threads on it.

Yes and in fact the M10 can usually be found much cheaper than that here in the states.

[furkin]

Thanks guys,

I'm in the U.K. 
The PCM M10 is £280 here - that's a whopping 445 US $ !

I reckon if I could get one for $229 - or £140 - I'd grab it.

We also have a problem importing stuff.  Importing anything over £18 ($29.30) we have to pay our lousy government VAT of 20% of price, for doing bugger all, plus our postal service more money for being kind enough to collect the VAT from us !
This isn't just for Business or New stuff, but also personal & private things.

Before any Brits chime in with "why it's a good idea" please don't - heard it all before & still don't agree - leave me with my opinion.

cheers

[stevetoney]

Thanks guys,

I'm in the U.K. 
The PCM M10 is £280 here - that's a whopping 445 US $ !

I reckon if I could get one for $229 - or £140 - I'd grab it.

We also have a problem importing stuff.  Importing anything over £18 ($29.30) we have to pay our lousy government VAT of 20% of price, for doing bugger all, plus our postal service more money for being kind enough to collect the VAT from us !
This isn't just for Business or New stuff, but also personal & private things.

Before any Brits chime in with "why it's a good idea" please don't - heard it all before & still don't agree - leave me with my opinion.

cheers

Do you know anybody traveling to or from the US?  If so, have them hand carry it back to you.