Topic: music "servers"?

[pfife]

Hey guys - I am interested in maybe adding one of these kinds of things to my rig- something that would play the music from the HD of my main machine over the LAN...  I was wondering if anyone has any experience with these (i.e. sound quality over a LAN, etc etc) and if there are better quality items such as these out there.... thanks...


Here's example of what I'm talking about, but I'd like to find something with higher quality than that.  Something that plays FLAC would be nice too!

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/category/category_slc.asp?CatId=197

[ethan]

I have a squeezebox and love it. It has a digi out!

www.slimdevices.com

[Daryan]

Here's my question, as this would be perfect for eliminating the 30 foot coaxial cable I have.  Is the data communication truly lossless?  Will it stream 24 bit?  It's hard to tell from the specs listed.

Thanks!

[MattD]

Data communication is definitely lossless. I experimented with one of the radioshack wireless a/v setups last year (I also had a 30 foot coax in my room then). It cost just under $100. I found that it could handle 24/48 just fine, but at 24/96, it choked and didn't output anything. The trick is to use the video (yellow in/output) for the digital audio. Since I needed 24/96 in my system, I returned it.

The data all gets there, but unless your DAC reclocks the signal, don't expect it to sound as good as straight from the soundcard. The output from the little wireless receiver is full of jitter.

[pfife]

yeah, right now I do have a computer nearby, with a decent soundcard in it, so I could run a wire, but it would also be a 30ft RCA cable, if not longer...  that won't be cheap to get a decent wire either.

[Daryan]

Matt,

Any options for jitter correction that actually work?  I know of the big ben, but there's no way I would spend that for a clock.  Nick?

Thanks

Daryan

[ethan]

Here's my question, as this would be perfect for eliminating the 30 foot coaxial cable I have.  Is the data communication truly lossless?  Will it stream 24 bit?  It's hard to tell from the specs listed.

Thanks!

The squeezebox streams lossless but I doubt the model I have will do 24 bit.

-e

[MattD]

Matt,

Any options for jitter correction that actually work? I know of the big ben, but there's no way I would spend that for a clock. Nick?

Thanks

Daryan

A lot of people swear by the Benchmark DAC-1. Also, the Grace 901 and 902 are supposed to do a great job with this. I don't own either (yet!), but have used a DAC-1.

[Daryan]

Thanks Matt.  I am trying to avoid buying a dac if at all possible.  I am betting I can upgrade the clock in the panny.  I will have to look into it.

Thanks gentlemen!

[The Kilted Taper]

For non-audiofile types (do those exisit  ) TiVO allows you to play MP3 files through your home audio system from your computer. Don't know if there is a rate limit, but just thought I'd through that out there. There's been some chat about supporting other formats in the future, but nothing yet.

[MattD]

Thanks Matt. I am trying to avoid buying a dac if at all possible. I am betting I can upgrade the clock in the panny. I will have to look into it.

Thanks gentlemen!

I never tried all analog over the wireless, so I'm not sure what your results would be. I can't imagine that the wireless receiver has a good output stage, but perhaps they're simple enough to mod. I'm thinking that going wireless with one of these things is equivalent to putting an A>D>A stage in if you use the analog inputs. Again, no proof of this, but it would correlate to my experience.

[Daryan]

What I would most like to do is modify the clock in the modded panny, run digital out of a wireless unit into the digital in of the panasonic, thus avoiding all digital conversion until the outputs of the xr-45, which are bybeed to hell.  This would be optimal for me, as I like the sound of the panasonic digital receivers a lot, especially when modded which are worlds better.  I have some surfing to do now I guess!

[Ed.]

may i suggest a modded xbox.  (xbox from ebay - $100, solderless modchip - $50)

i can stream audio/video/pics.  it'll do mp3s and flac's and every video file you can throw at it.  (no shn tho)  i've never personally did 24/96, but someone else on the board said they did successfully.

I have the advanced av pack, with component (red, gree, blue) video and optical audio outs.

its pretty much a second computer that can play video games as a bonus.  (it'll play emulators too - just incase you ever feel like having the complete collection of nes games at your disposal )

[Tim]

my Bel Canto DAC 2 does a good job of jitter reduction.

there are some boxes that Nick and Macdaddy have used for jitter reduction as well that are significantly cheaper

[Daryan]

Good, now I have something to do when I go back to work.  I will look into all of this including the xbox option, since I have one that I rarely play since I got so darned frustrated trying to beat HALO 2 that I haven't picked it up in a month.  Thanks Tim, I will search audiogon.

I like this forum the best out of all of them on here FWIW, very good information when slutting it!  Review of bpt power conditioner coming this evening.

[BobW]

Get a fanless, wireless cube computer and an M902.
Use remote desktop to control it from your wireless PDA/ Laptop/ PC.
You can even map a laptop's hardrive or DVD to it.

There are many possibilities.

[Daryan]

How much does such a thing cost?  Very cool!

[macdaddy]

that is cool...

i have been reading about settng up a box that runs on flash memory, which would get rid of alot of the internal noise. just an idea...

right now i have a small box running foobar, controlled by an airboard (which i have then used to "teach" my remote - mx700). output is the spdif coax out of the dongle on the ap2496. this goes into the monarchy DIP, which goes to the mensa, which goes to the amp...

i get my best results when the flacs are on another computer on our home network. streaming across the network is fine, the only hiccups come when playing from a fragged drive that is uploading and downloading torrents all at the same time, and the network latency has nothing to do with the hiccup...

been doing it for years.

[MattD]

Can you go into more detail about your remote control/airboard setup? One hitch I have in my system is that I have to queue up a big list, otherwise I'm getting up every five minutes. Eventually, I also want to have a server/client setup with the music all in one central location.

[macdaddy]

Can you go into more detail about your remote control/airboard setup? One hitch I have in my system is that I have to queue up a big list, otherwise I'm getting up every five minutes. Eventually, I also want to have a server/client setup with the music all in one central location.

sure.

basically i just train the remote tho certain keystrokes, or build macros on the remote to do combined keystrokes...

if you can do what you need using a keyboard only, then you can program it to a remote via airboard...

[1st set only]

I want someone to design an amp that can control a hardrive directly via firewire. wouldnt that be a better solution than bringing a computer into your living room if all you want is music? just dreaming here, but i think it could be done.

[pfife]

Well, my buddy that works at a cable company is going to make me a 40' cable w/ stereo miniplug on one end, and RCA's on the other, with neutrik connectors ($17!  ), so I am going to give it a shot running from my computer to the amp on the other side of the basement.  We'll see how that works... I'm not too happy about a 40' run, but it my satisfy...

FWIW- my friend has me set up as a reseller w/ an account at his company, and I can basically get almost any kind of cable for really cheap.  LMK if anyone is interested.

[MattD]

That would essentially put the computer inside the amp. You need some kind of interface to browse the files on the drive and select them.

[Daryan]

OK, this is driving me nuts.  Can someone who has used their xbox for streaming 24/48 or 24/96 files to their amp/dac etc help me find a site that explains this in english.  All I want to know is what I need besides the xbox, which I already have.  Everything I keep finding is so geeky technical that I am having a hard time making heads and tails of all of this.

Thanks!

[Ed.]

OK, this is driving me nuts. Can someone who has used their xbox for streaming 24/48 or 24/96 files to their amp/dac etc help me find a site that explains this in english. All I want to know is what I need besides the xbox, which I already have. Everything I keep finding is so geeky technical that I am having a hard time making heads and tails of all of this.

Thanks!

you need a modchip and an updated version of xbox media center and you're set to rock and roll.

basically once you mod your xbox and flash a new bios onto it (easy as pie) you'll have a cheap multimedia machine.

you can find updated versions of xbox media center here: http://bt.xbox-sky.com:8080/ <-- if you don't feel like doing bt, you can get it from #xbins on efnet on irc.

Once xbmc is on your xbox, all you have to do is stream the audio/video/picture files from you puter to your xbox (or it can play flac files from a data dvd-r too) and you're golden.  I'll download a 24/96 flac today and see what happens when i try to play it.  but i'm positive it can do it, i don't know if downsamples tho.

i can go into more detail about modding your xbox if you'd like.

[ducati]

I ran a 30' RCA cable from my PC to hifi back when I was in an apt...  It worked OK for the tunes I was listening to (compressed Sugarmegs back in the day!)

For awhile I had a lappy w/802.11B and an EMI 2|6 running digital out through a DAC.  I put the laptop under my rack and set it to stay on when the lid was closed...  I used Remote Desktop to control it.  This was a nice setup, it sounded GREAT!

I had some network latency at times, but improved that by moving my WAP around.

[Daryan]

I am going to do this mod xbox thing.  However, I would really like to stream over wireless also.  Is this feasible...


wireless hub connected to usb adapter wireless going into a usb->coax 24 bit convertor, I was thinking m audio transit, running coax into the dac/amp/insert your gear here?

Daryan

[Nick in Edinboro]

I am going to do this mod xbox thing. However, I would really like to stream over wireless also. Is this feasible...

Seems as if streaming shouldn't be an issue.  Your xbox can go wireless:

[Ed.]

I am going to do this mod xbox thing. However, I would really like to stream over wireless also. Is this feasible...

my buddy keeps his router by the xbox and runs cat5 to the router, then streams audio/video from his computer over the wireless network.  If you don't want to put the router by the xbox, that wireless adapter for the xbox is available, however, i've never used it, so i don't know for a fact pm the adapter.

if you haven't been to www.xbox-scene.com yet, that site has pretty much everything you need to know about modding your xbox.  also if you're familiar with irc, you might want to get on efnet and look up the #xbox chat room...lots of help in there too.

I'd suggest getting a solderless mod-chip, they're worth the extra money and only take 5 minutes to put on.  I'd also suggest using a blow dryer to heat up the stickers on the back...they pull off easier and can be put back on covering up your work, just incase you have mess up the xbox and try the old switcheroo trick at wal-mart.

Also, when you go to buy the chip, i highly recommend www.modchipman.com - they also have a chat room on efnet, #modchipman, where you can talk one on one with the people who run the site and they'll help you with any problems.  The chips might cost a little bit more, but the customer service is worth it.  Not to mention, I had my chip within two days of ordering it.

feel free to ask me anymore questions.

[Daryan]

Wow, thanks for the help guys, this should be fun...no more obtrusive 30 foot canare coax cable.  If this works out, anyone need about 30 feet of 77 style canare cable for nothing?

[Ed.]

well, i just tried a 24/96 file and it froze the xbox and i had to reboot.

granted, my computer can't play the 24/96 file either because of my soundcard.  so i don't know if that'd effect it at all, but i don't think it would.

[Daryan]

Well, that's a big bummer.  Care to try again

[Ed.]

i'll try a 24/48 file and see what happens.  my laptop can do 24/96 so i may also try streaming from that and see what happens.  I'll work on those this weekend.

[ducati]

Wow, thanks for the help guys, this should be fun...no more obtrusive 30 foot canare coax cable.  If this works out, anyone need about 30 feet of 77 style canare cable for nothing?

Hell yeah, I could do some AUD/SBD mixes with 30' of RCAs!

[Daryan]

All yours if this works, I reccomend it get reterminated though, as you need some really HQ rca plugs which accept a pretty big guage plug, and I was just making do with something pretty ghetto.

[macdaddy]

tim-

you might want to think about the airport express to do the streaming...


this guy mods them so they have coax out (which you would connect to your DAC). could be sweet, and it sounds more lie what you are trying to do. my setup invlves having a 'puter right there with the amp and DAC - just another component on the rack. it seems like you want to do the wireless thing - the airport express sounds like it would be more up your alley....

[Daryan]

The mods are pricey pricey pricey.  He completely rebuilds the unit into a work of art.  Whether it is worth it or not, who knows. 

Isn't the airport express limited to 24/48 or am I incorrect?

[macdaddy]

The mods are pricey pricey pricey.  He completely rebuilds the unit into a work of art.  Whether it is worth it or not, who knows. 

Isn't the airport express limited to 24/48 or am I incorrect?

not sure about that. never looked into it that much, but i remembered it when i read through this again, and realized that was close to what tim seemed to be looking for 0 rather than just a media player that properly handles the audio we use (which is what i originally thought)...

yea - the d00d's mods are pricey - i see that he wants alot of dough to mod those DIP boxes i have - i dont think that they are worth that much, myself, but maybe i am missing something....

[JackoRoses]

micro atx or similar with a 1 u chassis. mount with stereo .
Run cat 5 to it from the switch. Done... RDP or ssh into it.
Currently I am pretty much doing what you are.
Computer next to stereo with a long spdif cable running into the DAC.
I looked into this a while ago, and they all supported only lossy music.
Flac was just starting to become supported but still not fully.
I think that has changed now, I have seen flac support pop up into a lot.
I have seen a system play shns before, (some kind of web jukebox)
I could never get it to work though. It required some custom scripting
that was beyond my knowledge.

[MattD]

I can't imagine the output stage on that box is anything special. I'm hoping the squeezebox people come up with a 24/96 solution soon!