Topic: Coresound HEB/DPA 4061 with no grids + question about battery box

[acidjack]

Just picked up a used pair of Coresound HEB's carrying the DPA 4061 caps.  Two relatively simple questions:

1. The mics came without the "high boost" grids covering the mic elements, meaning the gold mic elements are exposed. The seller (a reputable member here) told me this is how he was told to use them.  Is that a common opinion among users of these mics?  Also, and more importantly (since I can always buy more grids), should I be concerned about the elements being exposed like that?  They look sturdy, but of course, they are very, very small.

2. The label that showed which direction the bass rolloff switch should go for flat vs. rolloff has fallen off.  If you're looking down at the battery box like this:

O
/

with the "O" being the mini XLR input and the "/" being the rolloff switch, which position is "flat"?  Just to be 1000% clear, I would call the current placement being the switch turned to the "left".   So, "right" would be:

O
\

Any help, and other tips re: the HEBs, much appreciated.

[nickee]

1/ IIRC I've read about (probably here) that one guy prefered the sound of naked DPAs without any grids but I cant imaging that it is the way they are supposed to be used. Since the frequency response is somewhat determined by the grid, they may have a completely different frequency response without any grids? I would personally be concerned of the likely higher risk of damage without the protecting grids as well as getting in more dust, lint and other smaller particles. When I got my HEBs in 2005 Len supplied both the high boost grids and the normal grids.

2/ Here's what my label says. Switch to the right while looking at the box so that the switch is closer to the eye is flat.

FLAT:
0
/

[Church-Audio]

Just picked up a used pair of Coresound HEB's carrying the DPA 4061 caps.  Two relatively simple questions:

1. The mics came without the "high boost" grids covering the mic elements, meaning the gold mic elements are exposed. The seller (a reputable member here) told me this is how he was told to use them.  Is that a common opinion among users of these mics?  Also, and more importantly (since I can always buy more grids), should I be concerned about the elements being exposed like that?  They look sturdy, but of course, they are very, very small.

2. The label that showed which direction the bass rolloff switch should go for flat vs. rolloff has fallen off.  If you're looking down at the battery box like this:

O
/

with the "O" being the mini XLR input and the "/" being the rolloff switch, which position is "flat"?  Just to be 1000% clear, I would call the current placement being the switch turned to the "left".   So, "right" would be:

O
\

Any help, and other tips re: the HEBs, much appreciated.

Never run these mics with out a grid unless you want to buy new mics... The capsule diaphragm is exposed and one hair or any debris that gets into the capsule can damage the diaphragm. Its possible.. Besides the mics were designed to be used with the grids... for a reason DPA being one of the best microphone designers in the world I think they know a little thing or two about how they need to be run. Some guys when using them with classical close micing use them with out the grids..for violin but that's a very controlled situation. I suggest you get the "flat" grids and leave them on. As far as the bass roll off take a good pair of headphones and gently blow in the direction of the mics and flick the switch on and off. You should be able to hear a difference.

Chris

[acidjack]

Thanks to both of you for the helpful advice... That was kind of what I suspected as well.  Time to go buy grids....

Just picked up a used pair of Coresound HEB's carrying the DPA 4061 caps.  Two relatively simple questions:

1. The mics came without the "high boost" grids covering the mic elements, meaning the gold mic elements are exposed. The seller (a reputable member here) told me this is how he was told to use them.  Is that a common opinion among users of these mics?  Also, and more importantly (since I can always buy more grids), should I be concerned about the elements being exposed like that?  They look sturdy, but of course, they are very, very small.

2. The label that showed which direction the bass rolloff switch should go for flat vs. rolloff has fallen off.  If you're looking down at the battery box like this:

O
/

with the "O" being the mini XLR input and the "/" being the rolloff switch, which position is "flat"?  Just to be 1000% clear, I would call the current placement being the switch turned to the "left".   So, "right" would be:

O
\

Any help, and other tips re: the HEBs, much appreciated.

Never run these mics with out a grid unless you want to buy new mics... The capsule diaphragm is exposed and one hair or any debris that gets into the capsule can damage the diaphragm. Its possible.. Besides the mics were designed to be used with the grids... for a reason DPA being one of the best microphone designers in the world I think they know a little thing or two about how they need to be run. Some guys when using them with classical close micing use them with out the grids..for violin but that's a very controlled situation. I suggest you get the "flat" grids and leave them on. As far as the bass roll off take a good pair of headphones and gently blow in the direction of the mics and flick the switch on and off. You should be able to hear a difference.

Chris

[jefflester]

There is no "flat" grid, just the "less boost" grid.

Not even sure how different they look without the grid, but having that small (less than 3 dB and very gradual) boost in the 5-15k range is outweighed by the protection the grid provides. I wouldn't run them without a grid other than in a controlled at-home situation.



 

[acidjack]

There is no "flat" grid, just the "less boost" grid.

Not even sure how different they look without the grid, but having that small (less than 3 dB and very gradual) boost in the 5-15k range is outweighed by the protection the grid provides. I wouldn't run them without a grid other than in a controlled at-home situation.



 

Thanks.  Yeah, it seems clear that these should not be used without grids.  I like the sound with the flat grids anyway.  I bought some grids, and Len at Core has graciously agreed to tune the mics up for me as well.  Looking forward to using these in the field!

[aboy]

I ran mine without the grids for a while.  I now have to replace them as they got damaged and no longer work.  Had I left the grids on I'd not be looking for new mics.

[Church-Audio]

I ran mine without the grids for a while.  I now have to replace them as they got damaged and no longer work.  Had I left the grids on I'd not be looking for new mics.

Let me take a look at them that's very strange that they no longer work.


Chris

[aboy]

I ran mine without the grids for a while.  I now have to replace them as they got damaged and no longer work.  Had I left the grids on I'd not be looking for new mics.

Let me take a look at them that's very strange that they no longer work.


Chris

Hi Chris,  Sadly Len at Core Sound said the could not be repaired.  I had one not working and the other seemed to have a lose wire in the capsule.  End result I trashed them. 

Thanks for the offer of help though.

[acidjack]

I ran mine without the grids for a while.  I now have to replace them as they got damaged and no longer work.  Had I left the grids on I'd not be looking for new mics.

Let me take a look at them that's very strange that they no longer work.


Chris

Hi Chris,  Sadly Len at Core Sound said the could not be repaired.  I had one not working and the other seemed to have a lose wire in the capsule.  End result I trashed them. 

Thanks for the offer of help though.

Funny, I just heard basically the same about mine - at least, one of the caps is now dead.  Clearly this no-grid business is not the way to go.

[Church-Audio]

I ran mine without the grids for a while.  I now have to replace them as they got damaged and no longer work.  Had I left the grids on I'd not be looking for new mics.

Let me take a look at them that's very strange that they no longer work.


Chris

Hi Chris,  Sadly Len at Core Sound said the could not be repaired.  I had one not working and the other seemed to have a lose wire in the capsule.  End result I trashed them. 

Thanks for the offer of help though.

I can actually take these mics apart and fix them. So if this ever happens to anyone else let me know sometimes they can be fixed.

Chris

[boojum]

There is an interesting thread over at Gearslutz about running these mics solely without the grids.  These are in applications of recording classical and acoustical music and in a controlled environment.  The results are quite pleasant without the grids.  A very nice, open sound.  Gutbucket on this board has done a lot of recording with the DPA 4060's and I am not sure how he runs his mics.

The company's user manual does not explicitly say to use the grids, but as Chris cautions, it might be a pretty good idea.  Folks do record without the grids, but the instances I have seen of this the mics were in an AB array at about 4 - 6 meters off the ground.  You can check in the "Remote" forum of Grealsutz (gearslutz.com) for the whole story.

The 4060's have a great sound.

User manual: http://www.dpamicrophones.com/en/Download/~/media/PDF/Download/Users%20Manuals/4060%204061.pdf


Added Later:

"Hi Sandy,

4060s come with both high boost and soft boost grids, and both are
considered protection grids.  The soft boost is only 3dB in the 8-20 kHz
range, and is commonly used for instrument miking without complaint. (The
high boost is most suitable for chestworn applications).  The mics can be
used without the grids, but you then have "naked" capsules exposed to
whatever comes their way:  dirt, dust, fluids, crushing blows, etc., so we
can only recommend using them without a grid "at your own risk".


Best Regards,
 
Joan Myers
DPA Microphones, Inc."